WHAT ABOUT SU85 ??
7 Apr 2015, 16:08 PM
#41
Posts: 1595 | Subs: 2
Mobility, that is all.
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7 Apr 2015, 17:41 PM
#42
Posts: 137
I find it pretty alright against everything except JP4 and KT.
It works really well vs KT tbh.
No need for buffs. SU-85 is fine
7 Apr 2015, 17:48 PM
#43
Posts: 17891 | Subs: 8
I wouldn't mind it seeing it get the Jackson treatment.
Increase pen, lower damage. Gives it more of a chance vs end-game heavies (tiger, king tiger, panther, jagdpanzer) while preventing it from completely dominating t3 play (p4, ostwind, luchs get a bit more time on the field)
Increasing mobility or front armour on a unit that has very high sight range is going to lead to trouble. It's a TD that doesn't need spotting, hence it must remain fragile.
If it was to get lower damage then it is, it would turn out as worst TD in game.
Bad mobility.
Bad survivability.
Unable to hit anything on the move.
And last thing we need is for it to struggle to kill P4(which would be a direct result from lowering its damage).
Lack of turret ensures that it will never dominate T3.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
7 Apr 2015, 18:09 PM
#44
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
The SU-85's high ROF more than makes up for it's lower pen, but it's kind of sad there really isn't any reason to build it if you have a USF team mate who can just give you Jacksons.
7 Apr 2015, 18:17 PM
#45
Posts: 1484
The SU-85's high ROF more than makes up for it's lower pen, but it's kind of sad there really isn't any reason to build it if you have a USF team mate who can just give you Jacksons.
Vet 2 and 3 Su-85 works wonders against slow Tigers and King Tigers; great combo with Lend Lease Sherman/USF Shermans.
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7 Apr 2015, 18:23 PM
#46
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Vet 2 and 3 Su-85 works wonders against slow Tigers and King Tigers; great combo with Lend Lease Sherman/USF Shermans.
Yeah, but the issue Iv found lately is just getting them that veteran status. More reliable to have the USF player focus on vehicle based AT with the M10 and Jackson while you focus on infantry based AT with guards, ZiS guns, and mark target.
Soviet Call in domination doesn't really help all things considered. It would be nice if the SU-85 got a frontal armor buff.
(Also because it's been mentioned, why hasn't Relic given us a doctrine with the SU-100 for Soviets or a doc with the Jadgpanther for Axis?).
7 Apr 2015, 19:37 PM
#47
Posts: 194
OK, a small rotation and speed buff would be good, and vet 1 ability just sucks when compared to Jackson and Jagdpanzer. But vet 0 focus sight is awesome.
Also going T4 in 1v1 is hard, cause it lacks reliable infantry counter and lategame harassment unit (t34 and t70).
Try playing a commander with artillery with t4, it's beastly imo, because mp only artillery + SU 85 = STRONK.
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7 Apr 2015, 19:45 PM
#48
Posts: 655
Permanently BannedEveryone says mobility, but
I think what you really want is better pathing/movement system for vehicles, so you wont need to be fast, just skillful.
And SU-85 is hardly the only vehicle which suffers in that regard.
I think what you really want is better pathing/movement system for vehicles, so you wont need to be fast, just skillful.
And SU-85 is hardly the only vehicle which suffers in that regard.
A Fallen Scrub
8 Apr 2015, 01:16 AM
#49
Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2
Permanently Banned
i think the su85 is quite balanced versus ostheer t3. It takes like three or four shots to kill the luchs even.
too many
jp4 kills stuart in 2, same with t-70
There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
8 Apr 2015, 01:21 AM
#50
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
too many
jp4 kills stuart in 2, same with t-70
Well, to be fair, the Stuart is trash, anddddd fuck the Luchs.
I think the Stuart could be fine with a health increase and major cost decrease for its abilities. The abilities are legitimately useful, it just takes up all of the munitions which the USF already suck down like it's water in the desert.
8 Apr 2015, 01:26 AM
#51
Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2
Permanently Banned
Well, to be fair, the Stuart is trash, anddddd fuck the Luchs.
I think the Stuart could be fine with a health increase and major cost decrease for its abilities. The abilities are legitimately useful, it just takes up all of the munitions which the USF already suck down like it's water in the desert.
replace it with
There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
8 Apr 2015, 01:47 AM
#52
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
replace it with
Let's be honest though, if Relic put it in, its main gun would suck, it would require constant munition bleed from using some ability and probably constant micro, and it would inexplicably still have 80 less health than a Luchs.
8 Apr 2015, 02:31 AM
#53
Posts: 2487 | Subs: 21
Idk, SU-85 is sometimes a dice roll for me.
But honestly people complaining about SU-85 needing love......
What about the SU-76????????
It's what we should be really worked up about.
But honestly people complaining about SU-85 needing love......
What about the SU-76????????
It's what we should be really worked up about.
8 Apr 2015, 07:02 AM
#54
Posts: 1740
The SU85 is a overall nice tank that suffers from some things that make it not that good anymore:
- It's pathing is (as for many other tanks without a turret too) very underwhelming. This needs a fix.
- It's mobility is a bit too bad. Slightly improve it's rotation speed (but not too much, many here remember the SU-85 from CoH2 Alpha).
- In the current Call-In Meta there is just little space for a only AT tank for soviets. Why build the tier and a SU-85 if you can get a far better AI and similar AT tank with the IS-2 instead?
SU-85 was a beast a long time ago. It shouldn't become like this again but it could definetly need some slight buffs. On the other Hand the SU-76 is in a real desperate state right now and that should be fixed first in my opinion.
- It's pathing is (as for many other tanks without a turret too) very underwhelming. This needs a fix.
- It's mobility is a bit too bad. Slightly improve it's rotation speed (but not too much, many here remember the SU-85 from CoH2 Alpha).
- In the current Call-In Meta there is just little space for a only AT tank for soviets. Why build the tier and a SU-85 if you can get a far better AI and similar AT tank with the IS-2 instead?
SU-85 was a beast a long time ago. It shouldn't become like this again but it could definetly need some slight buffs. On the other Hand the SU-76 is in a real desperate state right now and that should be fixed first in my opinion.
It is though God by command has withdrawn every other throne.
And God is saying 'No. These people will deal with me alone.'
And God is saying 'No. These people will deal with me alone.'
8 Apr 2015, 07:03 AM
#55
5 Posts: 1157 | Subs: 2
SU85 is pretty nice on certain maps, but there are a lot more units that haven't ever had a place in the meta that I'd like to see adjusted first. SU-76 Whaaa!?
9 Apr 2015, 10:38 AM
#56
Posts: 270
High ROF, durable and decent accuracy. What else do you need? The mobility of a puma?
I'll try again.
The source of my frustrations that should be removed
9 Apr 2015, 11:05 AM
#57
Posts: 142
Hm, I've always felt that we are missing some important things in this thread. Now I know it 
: REPLAYS; a balance thread about Su-85 without HIGH LEVEL REPLAYS to back up whatever claims is totally unacceptable!
: REPLAYS; a balance thread about Su-85 without HIGH LEVEL REPLAYS to back up whatever claims is totally unacceptable!
9 Apr 2015, 11:09 AM
#58
Posts: 17891 | Subs: 8
High ROF, durable and decent accuracy.
Its a thread about SU-85, not JP4.
@flyingtiger
You won't find them, because none of high level players uses them, last time I've seen one used was when Lenny used it against KT and it was horribly ineffective, was before the patch though when it still had 425 armor.
Take that as an alternative indicator of their usefulness in current meta.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
9 Apr 2015, 12:50 PM
#59
Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1
jp4 kills stuart in 2, same with t-70
That's normal, because Axis steel > Allied steel of course
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
9 Apr 2015, 13:06 PM
#60
Posts: 142
That's normal, because Axis steel > Allied steel of course
And much more expensive
.Get rid of the focus side ability on the Su-85, and decrease the cost to 310 mp and 100 fuel and things should be much better. There's no reason for it to cost more than a T-34/76 (its a turretless tank-destroyer, intended to be cheap, easy to produce after all).
Its a thread about SU-85, not JP4.
@flyingtiger
You won't find them, because none of high level players uses them, last time I've seen one used was when Lenny used it against KT and it was horribly ineffective, was before the patch though when it still had 425 armor.
Take that as an alternative indicator of their usefulness in current meta.
The one on Langres, right? I think it's the Su-85 that rendered the KT ineffective, not the other way around. But to be fair Lenny had the advantage and he would have won anyway, with or without the Su-85.
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