Profile of Stark

So G43s have less DPS at close and mid range, but overtake STG44s at 27 range and have significanty better DPS at max range.
However, one important factor to consider is moving DPS:
STG44s have only ~50% DPS while moving, at most ranges.
G43s have ~88% DPS while moving.
So G43s have higher DPS on all ranges while the squad is moving, which would also probably make them too good at chasing and wiping retreating squads if they got a 4th G43.

Yeah, I see the problem with 4xG43 combine with vet1 ability. Could be abusive and really annoying to deal with.

Is it possible to change the G43 values only for Panzergrens by reducing the moving DPS and increase long range performance? Giving them a clear role as long range recon infantry would be quite interesting which ostheer currently doesn't have.

Currently the diffrence between STG and G43 isn't so big, it's more a trade off, you loose close/mid range into slighly better far range and better moving performance. If you don't plan to make any other change to G43 then removing the cost would be bad solution

So let's get back on topic, why do people think of the changes that happened in the mod?

Total changes are:

-Now available from the HQ after Battle Phase 1
-Population from 9 to 8
-G43 upgrade from 60 to 25.
-Reinforce time from 8.5 to 7.
-Build time from 34 to 28.
-Infantry Doctrine Combined Arms now a veterancy 1 passive. Medkits removed.
-Combined Arms ability now triggers when near allied vehicle.
-Veterancy 2 now adds +16.7% weapon accuracy.
-Veterancy 3 accuracy bonus from +40% to +20%.

Generally good changes. I like them a lot. Honestly I don't think moving unit into T0 will cause big problems. Skipping T1 and goving for pgrens can be punished by early light vehicule rush. Plus quite high costs of BF1 upgrade, still 28s build time will make them come quite late (way later than penals). Also worth pointing out that going for early Pgren rush will also include build of 2 or 3 MG42. I think this strategy can be problematic for Brits but thanks to their new commander and mortar 0CP they can deal with it. I'm also kinda afraid spam of pgrens with 2x shrek covered by MG wall in mid game which will be able to stop any tank and infantry push.

I guess we will find out more when patch will be release and then some quick ajustments could be needed. Maybe spliting shrek upgrade into 2 fazes: 1 shrek upgrade straight away and second after BF2 or BF3.

Btw does G43 upgrade really need to require ammunition? From what i tested and saw - diffrence in performance is really small.

I'd be pretty reluctant to make the ability any better but the idea of making it free to give it more incentive to use has some merit. Will look into that.

Great to hear

But by what right should the OKW Tiger be straight up better than the Ostheer one?

The Tiger should not be an exception to this. It even gets a discount for its vet 4 and 5 requirements while all the other units have requirements that are exponentionally higher than their vet 3's.

It shouldn't be better and it isn't right now. I;m not asking for better vet bonuses for OKW Tiger. The command ability - in form you are proposing - has his pros and cons therefore will be used only for mass group of units. This plus high vet requirement will make this ability rare to see. But even with it OKW Tiger isn't a unit more tempting to use than ostheer version.

+20% reload time isn't a whole lot when vet 3 already gave -30% reload time and -20% accuracy is negated by vet 2's +20% accuracy and can even be compensated more by the Panzer Commander's +10% accuracy bonus if you're planning on using the ability a lot.

If you are adding the ability try to make it as best as you can in form of balance, performance etc. You can't just add the ability that no1 will use (becouse it's too expensive, weak, unatractive) just to shut the mouth of people who wanted the CommandTiger and call it a day. I do always agree that OKW vet4-5 should give a certain abilities to units that are effective but more situational and therefore it makes units more unique. But this... this is like vet5 LeFH that literally no1 ever used. In that case you guys just waste your time in creating that ability. If you don't see Tiger as a command unit then change the direction. Remove the abilities and give them something extra, for example stationary ambush ability and single suppression shot (abilities that cost ammo and can be used on the field).

To be specific, I'm not saying the aura itself is weak but it shouldn't nerf the Tiger and also had ammunition cost in the same time. From a vet3 beast you make Tiger vet0 unit in exchange of better performance of nearbly troops. Tiger vet bonuses are one of the best in game and i;m giving up them in exchange of better army - sound fine and fair. But in that case it shouldn't have any ammunition cost.


I also agree that if Tiger is currently tied to tech it's worth give community posibility to test reduce price of a tank and see how it goes.

Hit the dirt is also an ability that makes conscripts stationary. Something guards do infinitely better with no side tech costs.

If conscripts are ever going to br worth buying instead of them, their kit needs to have some sort of purpose, and giving them a mix of sprinting abilities and stationary bonuses ain't gonna help, imo.

On the other hand if you want more mobile, effective in move infantry you can go penals. I would try to avoid any sort of overlap with concripts. If we gonna make coscripts too good in move, very mobile offensive infantry then penals will loose their meaning.

Soviet faction doesn't have mainline defensive infantry, conscripts could fill that gap. CoverBonus could help making that real.

Cons already have durability.....
The current changes are happening SPECIFICALLY because amazing durability means literally nothing if you can't do anything in return and cons aren't exactly Diablo 2 Iron Golem you believe they are for whatever reason.

So how would you change conscripts to make them worth using and still keep them unique?