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Panzerschrecks - state of balance

6 Jan 2020, 00:07 AM
#21
avatar of WAAAGH2000

Posts: 706

Big problem is 4 men more usually drop weapon……
6 Jan 2020, 00:16 AM
#22
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3046

Wants to 1-shot a 70 fuel LV. /thread please lmao.

Schrecks are literally just zooks but comparable or better in every way except reload. They're fine.
9 Jan 2020, 09:04 AM
#23
avatar of Th3DankDuck

Posts: 11

What is your opinion on the current state of the shreks?

I fell compared to zookas and the fact, that only pgrens can get them, they underpeform. You have to sacrifice one p gren squat, which becomes utterly useless vs. everything else and get only a medicore units which cant even 2 shot flak hts t70 or stuarts. Thus they get kited to deadt while not being a real threat on the battlefield.

Rear echelons with double zookas and 5 man are more sticky and deal more damage, without suffering a heavy mp bleed.

In my opinion, shreks need a slight range buff, so they can be acutally useful in fighting at least the early alli vehicles, while not being to strong.


What no they perfrom good better then piats bazookas etc. And just bc one unit can get them then look at OKW they often blob panzerschrecks and easily destroy big tanks same goes for bazookas and piats are ok too. They do not underperform they do better then the things that is compared to that.
9 Jan 2020, 12:20 PM
#24
avatar of Widerstreit

Posts: 1392



What no they perfrom good better then piats bazookas etc. And just bc one unit can get them then look at OKW they often blob panzerschrecks and easily destroy big tanks same goes for bazookas and piats are ok too. They do not underperform they do better then the things that is compared to that.


That isn't true. Schreck-team maybe perform worse than enemy units do, because they don't force so fast tanks.

Best counter versus Schrecks = road-kill.

Now do the same versus PTRS or Pios with Piats = gg. :P


It is the needed brain, Alliis need less. ^^
9 Jan 2020, 14:26 PM
#25
avatar of achpawel

Posts: 1351

The real problem is not their DMG. I am against buffs to shrecks. The real problem is the pzgrens durability and bleed under tank fire. Larger allied squads will manage to land more shots before they have to retreat. Even if they risk losing models they will bleed less, especially if they use echelons or sappers. At the same time they don't waste expensive anty infantry squads and can have cheap stopgap AT units. I wouldn't touch pzgrens here, just allow to purchase one shreck for pios after researching say battlephase 2
9 Jan 2020, 20:04 PM
#26
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 772

Let's just make Panzershreks a copy of the USF standard bazooka in every way if this is considered a problem.

I can't wait to see the Shreks UP threads that follow.
9 Jan 2020, 20:30 PM
#27
avatar of Alphrum

Posts: 787

Let's just make Panzershreks a copy of the USF standard bazooka in every way if this is considered a problem.

I can't wait to see the Shreks UP threads that follow.


allies generally have lower armour tanks, bazookas stats with its ROF will be very deadly.

Personally, i just wish Pshreks was more accessible or at least bit more accurate
9 Jan 2020, 20:42 PM
#28
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8



allies generally have lower armour tanks, bazookas stats with its ROF will be very deadly.

Personally, i just wish Pshreks was more accessible or at least bit more accurate

Handheld AT weapons except AT rifles are inaccurate specifically to allow light vehicle play.
They all were more accurate in the past and it made LV plays outside of T70 completely irrelevant and pointless.
9 Jan 2020, 21:43 PM
#29
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 772



allies generally have lower armour tanks, bazookas stats with its ROF will be very deadly.

Personally, i just wish Pshreks was more accessible or at least bit more accurate


Agreed but if they're ever anything different stat-wise it appears we get more of these threads.

As for accuracy, the Panzershrek is more accurate at most ranges already and generally benefits more from veterancy accuracy bonuses than the bazooka.
26 Mar 2020, 16:45 PM
#30
avatar of KiwiBirb

Posts: 789



What no they perfrom good better then piats bazookas etc. And just bc one unit can get them then look at OKW they often blob panzerschrecks and easily destroy big tanks same goes for bazookas and piats are ok too. They do not underperform they do better then the things that is compared to that.


When comparing Zooks to Shrecks i find that zooks are far better early game, as they still zone out light vehicles while costing 160mp! less

However, Shrecks are far more effective late game due to their high penetration, which shows in their cost.
26 Mar 2020, 20:29 PM
#31
avatar of Kurobane

Posts: 548



I've asked for that option for all AT squads to have the option to hold fire 2 years ago, but Relic obviously doesn't care. Same with a manual reload button on all HMGs so they can fire a full burst. Relic doesn't care.


Hold Fire for AT Weapons (Such as Panzershrek, Bazooka etc) is actually pretty easy to implement. Not sure why it hasn't been done yet.
27 Mar 2020, 00:18 AM
#32
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 2645 | Subs: 4



When comparing Zooks to Shrecks i find that zooks are far better early game, as they still zone out light vehicles while costing 160mp! less

However, Shrecks are far more effective late game due to their high penetration, which shows in their cost.


how do you guys always find these old threads? It's like you just lost a game vs strategy X, got salty and searched the forum about it so you can rant about the topic no matter how old the thread is
27 Mar 2020, 00:59 AM
#33
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3318 | Subs: 1

Ostheer Pioneers should be able to buy a single panzershrek with 60 muni, able to get it with a sweeper but not with a flamer.

+1

I feel like it should be locked behind bp1
27 Mar 2020, 01:38 AM
#34
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1731

Pg shrek are crazy op in 4v4. You just need support your ost team mates with some AI and let the shrek blobs clear 60td in seconds. Pg already super buff with sprint.

Yeah no. Bad idea to change any things, except move the sprint to vet 3.
27 Mar 2020, 02:51 AM
#35
avatar of Jilet

Posts: 549


Handheld AT weapons except AT rifles are inaccurate specifically to allow light vehicle play.
They all were more accurate in the past and it made LV plays outside of T70 completely irrelevant and pointless.


Good days of mediums theey were...
Nowadays we only see LV into heavies sadly.

Edit:
OOF SORRY FOR NECRO.
27 Mar 2020, 03:19 AM
#36
avatar of Kasarov
Senior Modmaker Badge

Posts: 421 | Subs: 2



Hold Fire for AT Weapons (Such as Panzershrek, Bazooka etc) is actually pretty easy to implement. Not sure why it hasn't been done yet.


It is actually not as simple as you would think.

Prioritise Vehicles works fine for PAK40, 43, ZiS, 6lb, and M1 just fine. However, the mechanics simply stop working when garrisoned (e.g., garrisoned raketen will target infantry, and after exiting will continue to ignore Prioritise Vehicles). This holds true for AT infanry squads as well. It would work up until the point when they garrison structures.

Additionally, the ability takes up a precious slot on the command card. The team would need to clear up space for every infantry squad to make room for it, and not all infantry has the space to spare. This becomes very difficult when the team tries to standardize ability locations on the command card, especially due to hidden doctrinal abilities. Look at how many abilities UKF sappers have (or Soviet Conscripts have doctrinally) for example.
27 Mar 2020, 04:08 AM
#37
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 4095 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Mar 2020, 02:51 AMJilet


Good days of mediums theey were...
Nowadays we only see LV into heavies sadly.

Edit:
OOF SORRY FOR NECRO.


Was Kiwi, and at least it's on the same patch so it's still semi relevent.
27 Mar 2020, 14:14 PM
#38
avatar of Kurobane

Posts: 548

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Mar 2020, 03:19 AMKasarov


It is actually not as simple as you would think.

Prioritise Vehicles works fine for PAK40, 43, ZiS, 6lb, and M1 just fine. However, the mechanics simply stop working when garrisoned (e.g., garrisoned raketen will target infantry, and after exiting will continue to ignore Prioritise Vehicles). This holds true for AT infanry squads as well. It would work up until the point when they garrison structures.

Additionally, the ability takes up a precious slot on the command card. The team would need to clear up space for every infantry squad to make room for it, and not all infantry has the space to spare. This becomes very difficult when the team tries to standardize ability locations on the command card, especially due to hidden doctrinal abilities. Look at how many abilities UKF sappers have (or Soviet Conscripts have doctrinally) for example.


Back when I was learning how to use the modding tools (Spent around 2,500 hours on the modding tools)I was able to create Prioritize Vehicle for AT Weapons that worked inside buildings and vehicles as well. I agree that the command cards will need some adjustments but in the case of Sappers things like Destroy Cover or Tear Down Emplacement could be placed inside of a Sub Menu as those aren't as commonly used as Grenade Abilities and things of that nature.
27 Mar 2020, 15:56 PM
#39
avatar of FelixTHM

Posts: 494 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post5 Jan 2020, 11:38 AMMusti


BTW. 2 PGren models have plenty of AI DPS,


Hello CODGUY.

Yes, I agree that Pgrens with Shrecks being able to barely hold their own vs combat engineers and unvetted Rear Echelons is indeed too much AI. With 2 X Pgren with shrecks, one would be able to defeat a Conscript squad or even a Riflemen squad! Truly unimaginably OP that after a Pgren squad with shrecks loses a whopping ONE model, they're still left with an astounding 25% of the original firepower of a Pgren squad.
27 Mar 2020, 17:31 PM
#40
avatar of KiwiBirb

Posts: 789



Was Kiwi, and at least it's on the same patch so it's still semi relevent.


I’m really sorry I have this ?glitch? where I click on a topic and it sends me to one in the same spot a few pages back

I think it’s because I am the only one who uses an iPad mini to browse this site.

Also iPad mini is awesome

Plz no bully
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