17 Jan 2018, 03:42 AMHelpingHans
Well this was an enjoyable read.
Hans we all love you — rage and all — don’t stop being you
Thread: Helping Hans deleted Coh2 cause of allie biased patch18 Jan 2018, 16:06 PM
17 Jan 2018, 03:42 AMHelpingHans
Well this was an enjoyable read.
Hans we all love you — rage and all — don’t stop being you
Thread: Helping Hans deleted Coh2 cause of allie biased patch17 Jan 2018, 01:22 AM
Okay, y'all seem to be getting waaaay off topic here so I'll jump in again.
The veterancy system makes sense for some units. Damage-based vet is good for things like AT guns. It can be hard to kill well-micro'd tanks and then you've just got slow-to-fire AT guns and vet 2/3 tanks that have killed a bunch of infantry.
Sure, you can argue that taking damage shouldn't give veterancy, but that's to balance it out so you're not both bleeding manpower and getting more and more outplayed by vet 3 units while you're just sitting half way to vet 1 and being slaughtered.
But then again, you're more often than not just getting outplayed anyway.
The vet system is fine as is the resource system.
But again, this is not really relevant to the subject at hand
Thread: Helping Hans deleted Coh2 cause of allie biased patch16 Jan 2018, 03:05 AM
16 Jan 2018, 02:12 AMLenny12346
You honestly think that because Hans was back Lelic suddenly restored balance after 2 days?
Bruh, Newbie is trolling you
I haven't played enough to really give my own verdict on the patch but Hans has always been a better and more level-headed version of Wada to me.
Hans' rage can get quite intense which isn't good nor bad, just how he is.
Thread: Soviet conscript flair killing models15 Dec 2017, 08:29 AM
For 10 munitions it's probably too cheap. Twenty would be a fairer price?
Perhaps it would be best if it would be a trip-wire activation that doesn't cause damage, but has a larger AoE for it to be triggered?
Also, I'm pretty sure the trip-wire will trigger a demo... It illuminates the macabre scene afterwards for viewing pleasure.
In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [1v1] Threw a game I didn't need to13 Dec 2017, 05:45 AM
11 Dec 2017, 23:19 PMSwiftsabre
Thanks for the advice.
That sounds great! It all came down to you needing something to punish his infantry because your infantry couldn't do the job on their own :/
Thread: [1v1] Threw a game I didn't need to11 Dec 2017, 22:48 PM
Hey Swifstabre, so I took a look at the replay and I'd say the overall reason why you lost was because of the infantry game. Your infantry took a hammering so much so that by the end you were reduced to nothing or maybe a single squad of combat engineers.
Other issues I identified, some of which are opinions and may vary depending on player skill, include your mid-game build order, army composition, and late-game micro.
First off, you did a great job at wiping squads. Your opponent went 5 produced and 5 lost with his Volksgrenadiers. He didn't bother to get a mine sweeper and had a few squads wiped by demos on your fuel point. Overall, your micro felt pretty even when comparing the two of you: you both had mistakes, some of which were paid for by lost squads or miraculously, the squad was saved. You even killed both of his KT and all of his armor including the JP4
Second of all, my bottom-line recommendation would've been to get a sniper some time in the mid game. You were really pressed for manpower whereas your opponent usually always had a healthy pool of it to reinforce squads and/or build another unit. I'd also recommend giving your T34 drivers less vodka so they don't feel as invincible when they drive up to the enemy and get fausted then die
Basically, that's it. I'll pick apart more stuff in greater detail but that's the summary.
I'll start with the early game and picking apart these first engagements:
The very first engagement, you stuck your combat engineer into the house by your opponent's fuel when it was surrounded by two volks. After you realized you were going to lose, you got out. It was a sensible decision, but you could've gauged your opponent by watching to see if he would dedicate both squads to firing into the house (and not going out to cap more points) or if he would've left one squad there. It may have been better for you to keep that engineer squad in there for another 20-30 seconds and deny your opponent a slight advantage in resources (because the sturmpio can cap right away).
After the Volks pushed your engineers off, maybe a minute later, there were three of them in the middle vs. one of your penal squads. You should've tried to withdraw right away or just retreat (I'm not sure on the exact situation now). You did a good job capping on the sides with your engineers, though.
At 4:13, the blob shifted to the right and took up position behind the light cover of the wood fence. You had a penal by that strategic point in front of it and another to the left of the mid VP. You closed the distance to make it to the green cover of the well but had to immediately retreat as the sustained fire from 12 K98s was too much for your 6 (then four) penals to handle. You should've soft retreated and found a way to have your other penal (and eventually the third one reinforcing at base) to come together to hit the volks while keeping your engineers on the sides capping point and laying mines. Instead, this engagement you lost 3-4 models and had to reinforce them whereas your opponent had four men in each Volks squad.
At 5:05 you had a good push in the mid but then you pushed too far (for the cutoff). Your opponent had an MG34 so your gains were immediately reversed as your squads were forced to retreat.
Basically, that's it for early game things. Better penal micro might've saved you some mp but your early game wasn't bad.
You had some end of early game/beginning of mid game tech choices to make. Essentially, you had to build units that allowed you to remain on the field and to punish your opponent more than they were punishing you. To be frank, you failed at this task and continued to suffer disproportionate manpower bleed throughout the rest of the game.
Essentially, you had four choices: tech up to T70, Build a sniper, get a team weapon from a doctrine, and build T2 and get team weapons from there. They weren't all mutually exclusive and you chose the T70 and the 120mm mortar. Neither were bad decisions but in hindsight it's easier to evaluate the decisions and postulate alternatives and use that in future games!
Naturally, you wanted to go for an early T70 and your opponent anticipated this and built a rakaten. You waited about two minutes before making a decision. You could've brought out the mortar earlier or built a sniper. The note I took says that at 7:20 you were floating 600mp and T3 was under construction. Then, you brought out the mortar which was a sensible choice considering that there were two MG34s on the field. What you really needed was another infantry squad (or the sniper) to give you more field presence and allow yourself to push the OKW player back. Denying resources early is a great way of delaying OKW's late game tech.
Alternatively, you could've gone Lend Lease and called in a Dshka, then a sniper, and not build a T70 and go straight for T4 with your fuel. With this opponent, that just might've worked as they saved up a lot of fuel (almost 250) and built a P4. Of course, that's also in part a counter to your build order. Or, you could've delayed your T70 by a minute or two after calling in the Dskha/sniper to contain his infantry pushes and gain ground for yourself.
You could've also stuck with the T70 but build a half track and upgrade it for a mobile suppression platform. Between the 10 and fifteen minute mark, an M5 Quad might've helped you push your opponent around, suppress MGs, and force him to invest more mp in an extra rakaten (perhaps instead of the leig).
Basically, the bottom line here is that you needed more than just a T70 and the 120mm mortar to punish your opponent. I disagree with your choice to build the SU-76 because you needed something to help relieve your mp bleed and shift it to your opponent. A second T70, then the SU-76 would've been decent as well. Your T70 was very successful but it ended up dying in a situation that may have been salvageable.
Some general mid-game notes:
you wiped two volks squads within five minutes of each other.
at 18:30 you should've told your penal squad to fire at the dying volks squad. This would've prevented the MG34 from spotting your squad and prevented the leig from firing at your squad (or made a barrage more inaccurate).
At 19:00 you lost the mid engagement and your mortar was wiped because you didn't have a squad to garrison the middle house.
At 16:20, your T70 is on capture mode on the top VP, taking fire from the MG34. You send it forward where it hits a mine, then gets destroyed by a rakaten + sturmpio. Towards the end of the engagement, you had one penal and maybe another one or your CE on the top standing by the muni point not moving. It would've been worth it to bring those two squads forward to try and push off the sturmpio/volks.
When you built your T34/85 that's when things started to go poorly. You should've built a T34/76 and then another SU-76 or another T34/76 to deal with the P4. The T34/85 doesn't perform as well against infantry and, like I said before, that's really what you needed: something to hit his infantry hard.
Case in point: at 27:05, his Obers were vet 2 with 26 kills and his P4 was at vet 2 with 26 kills. He had 144 kills at that point in the game -- a full 1/3 of his kills came from those two units.
At 29:00 you looked like you were going to lose. You killed the P4 but had an SU-85 and an SU-76. A minute before you just lost your MG34 and a penal squad. You have three penals and one CE and your opponent has no vehicles.
The last twenty minutes:
You both needed mine sweepers. You keep losing squads, you lost two more T34/85s, but you don't have the staying power on the field that your opponent has. You recaptured an MG34 late in the game but often times it is on the center of the field by itself and gets flanked and dies while you have 4-6 man penal squads sitting in your base (they could've reinforced en route from T1).
In a few engagements, your tanks could've remained on the field for a little while longer to help you keep squads on the field (I.e., pushing back the KT for a few more seconds allowing your penals/Guard to win engagements vs. schrecked sturmpios)
44:00 Obers have 62 kills.
I think a sniper and earlier suppression -- Maxim, M5 Quad, or even a Dshka could've helped you maintain field presence. A sniper really hurts the OKW and would allow your infantry to win those 1v1 engagements they would otherwise lose. one shot is 50 mp on the Obers squad. Your opponent had no diving unit to kill the sniper. Bottom line is you lost the manpower war (I think I've said that like three times already).
Thread: [1v1] Threw a game I didn't need to11 Dec 2017, 06:51 AM
Hi Sabre! If you'd like I can give you my opinion on your game
Thread: USF Mid-Late Game Glass Ceiling 8 Dec 2017, 23:18 PM
8 Dec 2017, 21:20 PMrazelazz
I just watched the replay again and at the 4:00 mark, when your mortar fired its first shot, the sturmpioneers had already been evicted from the house and you had 58 munitions :/
You probably could've called the AE squad in and capped the neutral point right outside the spawn and started upgrading the flamers ten or fifteen seconds before the mortar opened up
In: Strategy Desk
Thread: USF Mid-Late Game Glass Ceiling 8 Dec 2017, 08:59 AM
Hey Razelazz, I've just watched your replay and took copious notes. I've identified a few problems that I'll summarize first and then go in to detail.
Often times, games are decided by singular engagements where too many units were lost at a time or a key piece of armor went over unswept ground and became snared. In this game, I don't think you ever had that moment. I would say that the main issues were your mid-game build order and later army composition. Later, this translated into you having an army ineffective at holding a single position as key units were in other parts of the map. I'm going to talk more about the overarching strategic choices you made rather than specific engagements because I believe that a lot of the engagements you lost were because you didn't make the best strategic choices.
The underlying issue, your mid-game build order, prevented you from applying pressure to your opponent. You built a super early fighting position covering the entrance to the fuel on the right side. This early, that's a waste of mp. That far forward, it's in a dangerous position. If you wanted a FP to be useful, I'd recommend setting it as far back from the capture point you want to defend as possible but ensure that its arc is completely covering the cap zone. This will make it less likely to be detected and easier to fall back to/prevent your enemy from capping the point. Alternatively, you could've placed it near the three houses close to your base so your REs could lob grenades into the houses and deny them those buildings. Still, I'd recommend not building a FP so early in the game.
Your early game build was Rifle Rifle Rifle Mortar. There is merit in direct fire and I won't tell you to never get a USF mortar, but an assault engineer squad with a flamethrower would've been much more effective at denying your opponent houses, green cover, and punishing a volks running up to lob a flame grenade into a house. It would've also given you another frontline combat unit, something you would desperately need.
I appreciated the LT tech and the AAHT. It's a powerful unit and one that's hard to counter if an OKW player goes med truck. Unfortunately, by the time your AAHT hit the field, your forces were so incapable of causing real mp attrition that your opponent queued up two Rakatenwerfers immediately. However, you were much too aggressive with it. AT 8:50 you ran into a volksgrenadier blob of three squads that all could've fausted you. Fortunately, they retreated and the rakatens were not in position. Eventually, you lost your AAHT to camouflaged Rakatens that crept up to it. You ran it over there to save a squad in trouble and it got out OK but you then failed to withdraw the halftrack while the rest of your squads were in base reinforcing.
After your AAHT choice, there were some issues. You elected to get an M2HB. I think that's a great choice. However, I would've recommended that you get BARs first. You had enough munitions at 9:45 (when the MG hit the field) that you could've afforded three; waited a few seconds and you could've got four. This would've made it easier for you to win engagements and vet up faster and cause more mp loss to your opponent. Instead, four minutes later, you get BARs and an ambulance but between your grenades and upgrading a FP on the left side vp/fuel, you only have enough muni for one or two.
Really, this is where you started losing, the mid game, traditionally the strongest part for USF. You had a resource disadvantage because in the first six or seven minutes, your opponent was able to cap the left side of the map with their Kubel while engaging all of your forces with the rest of theirs on the right hand side of the map. A med truck just outside the base cut a significant time out of the hard retreat of frontline squads, giving the OKW player an advantage with field presence. Also, the player got medics very soon after, putting you at a medic disadvantage for at least four, probably five or even six minutes. AT the 11:35 mark you had an RE, three rifles, and an LT. The RE was at nearly full health, but every other squad was at most at 75% health. Two of your rifles had just at or above 50% health and you had no BARs. There's almost no way you're winning an engagement without suffering severe mp bleed.
To summarize: too slow on getting Ambulance/BARS, poor micro with your AAHT, wasteful mp/mu spending on fighting positions that were so easily destroyed by rakatenwerfers.
At around the 15:00 minute mark, your build order starts to get real wonky. At around 12:30 you lost a rifle squad, putting you down to an RE, LT, and two rifles plus your support teams. You lost your first MG in a poor engagement and was captured by Fallschirmjägers. You've built a second one and decide to build a third M2HB, bringing you up to two plus the one your opponent captured. You also chose to get a second mortar around this time. Getting the second MG (really, third) and the second mortar was a poor decision. You needed infantry to keep up the frontline. Another rifle squad or two (or one rifle/Assault Engineer) would've been good for you. But by this time, the Volks already have StGs and vet. Your lack of infantry allowed your opponent to bully you around the map.
at 16:50, the only thing stopping your opponent from capping the right side of the map was their fear and a 4-man LT squad at 50% health which attempted to 1v1 a squad of falls. You lobbed a nade, one of many which failed to do damage or change an engagement, and then were forced to retreat.
at 18:00, your mortars are forced to retreat because there is no support. Both of your MGs are on the left side of the map, not even set up, doing nothing. Not capping points, not holding the hole between the hedges, just standing around. At the very least, they could've been capping or, rather, should've been behind your mortars and supporting your rifles.
at 20:00 the same thing happens. Your mortars have no MGs to keep back the infantry and one of them goes down and the weapon salvaged.
Summary: you need more infantry and not double MGs/Mortars. Your positioning and use of your weapon teams was not beneficial to you and your opponent continually ran you off the field.
Now, in the late game (not sure how "late" 20 minutes is, though) you've teched to captain. You've had the CPs for the M10 and as soon as you see the panther you call it in. That's great. However, your next fuel purchase is the sherman dozer. With only one source of AT -- an M10 -- and an enemy panther, two rakatenwerfers, and fausts on virtually every squad, you're in for a tough time. Unsurprisingly, the next engagement goes absolutely poorly and you lose the M10. You have 75 fuel and only a bazooka to fend off the panther. your opponent is about to build a P4. At this point, the game nearly lost but you made a decent choice in getting yourself an ATG and a second M10 at 90 fuel. At this point I think you had about 100-150 munitions. That's terrific! I would've recommended that you put two zooks on your RE squad and, if you could, get a BAR on your captain. Treating the captain as a front-line, anti-infantry squad is something I've been doing for a few years now as the Captain's Thompson + 2x BAR dps is pretty good. Regardless of your munition state around the 22:00 minute mark, putting a BAR on your captain wouldn't have been a bad idea so long as you got those bazookas first.
A few minutes later, after more lost engagemetns, you build a second ATG. at 28:47, your captain goes down, the M10 has already died, and the sherman dozer becomes abandoned.
At 31:40, you have a push on the left side consisting of... 2x M2HB and 2x ATG and another M10... This combat group didn't do anything meaningful and wasn't able to push on towards the fuel/VP because your opponent came in from the right side with their armor and a few infantry squads. After keeping your LT in the fight against the panther and P4 and nearly losing it, a hero rifleman squad comes to crew the sherman just before it's destroyed (killing themselves in the process). You surrender and the game ends. I'd hate to write the letters back to the parents of those boys who died for nothing... I don't envy you there
Summary: Your late game army comp was a mess and your vehicles didn't bring a good return on investment.
I know I've basically written a whole bunch of negative words and I am sorry about that. Here's something positive: You had one notable success with a grenade! It went in a perfect spot and reduced the captured M2HB team to 3 men and 10% health! You also wiped the rakatens a few times!
Okay more negatives: That engagement with the captured M2HB was really going in your favor. You had your own MG set up and was about to shoot at your opponent's MG. The other falls squad supporting it was also in the arc and your squad that threw the nade was at 4 men and a decent chunk of health. You didn't have to retreat it! Overall, you lost a lot of engagements. Not to bad micro, but because you didn't have BARs or you didn't get an ambulance soon enough or because you just got out DPS'd by the OKW elite squads/veterancy. The losing of engagements and thus territory is really what set you back. Sure, you had some poor engagements where you misclicked or forgot about a squad and it died. Luckily, that really only happened twice. Once, when your first rifle died at 12:28, and when you had your first M2HB in the house with the LT, then ate a flame nade and it got captured. Late game, you were just stressed and had to manage more units.
Overall, here are the changes I would recommend:
Getting another infantry squad earlier (not getting such an early and easily flankable FP)
Not getting double team weapons (MG & Mortar; zooks on RE squad(s - if you got a second one) to keep you from needing double AT guns)
Getting BAR/Ambulance earlier
Making the right choices for fuel (didn't need Sherman bulldozer if you had more infantry with BARs).
Using your team weapons effectively + supporting your army (AAHT included)
I hope this is helpful!
In: Strategy Desk
Thread: USF [1v1] build orders7 Dec 2017, 23:13 PM
I typically go RE Rifle Rifle Rifle Officer.
After the third rifle, the officer depends on the game. If I'm equal with a slight advantage, I'll go LT AAHT Weaponracks. Against OKW I'll try and get three zooks to deter the Luchs or (rarely) if they went med truck I'll get maybe one or two to deal with a Kubel then get BARs. Then an ambulance. I'll usually go Captain for the ATG and then rely on a pershing or even armor company for AT.
With captain, It's usually Captain AT gun Stuart Weaponrack ambulance. I'll skip the ATG if there's a med truck or if the Luchs isn't coming for a while/I have high fuel (winning, basically).
With the new patch, getting a second RE may be ideal because of smoke grenades being moved and also their buffs. It may be easier to get captain and lieutenant because the captain will have smoke.
Basically, mid game, you want to have 4 frontline fighting squads, a weapon team, a light vehicle, and at least two sources of AT. The frontline squads are the rifleman + an officer but they can also be Rangers or paratroopers or a Pathfinder squad (from airborne). the weapon team is usually an ATG or the M2HB. You can have both. You may want to consider, depending on the map, getting indirect fire, either the mortar, the mortar HT from Infantry Company, or the pack howitzer.
With the DBP, every USF commander may be viable with an appropriate build order. the M8 Greyhound could replace the need for a Stuart, allowing you to go for a LT ---> Major build or the new air-dropped combat group could allow you to skip Captain with the AT gun and the paratroopers with the lower-cost bazooka upgrade. This could allow a Rear Echelon squad to have BARs and use the volley fire ability!
I hope this is helpful and not just a mess of words