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russian armor

Jäger Armor is still the same BS than before

25 Mar 2021, 16:23 PM
#21
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 1563



Both true, but right now, when compared to Jaeger, Fortication doctrine doesn't look very attractive and even if one has it they would most likely still stick with Jaeger. I mean of all the Elephants you encounter, how many of those came from Fortification? I'm pretty sure it's less than 1%. Called 'fortification' or not, that doctrine needs an extra something over Jaeger, or Jaeger needs something less.

The main reason why you see Ele's from Jager is everybody has Jager Armor doctrine and no one is gonna pay or grind for a commander that does virtually the same
25 Mar 2021, 16:53 PM
#22
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 1116 | Subs: 1


The main reason why you see Ele's from Jager is everybody has Jager Armor doctrine and no one is gonna pay or grind for a commander that does virtually the same


Um? So teller mines, spotting scopes and AT strafe are worth skipping in favor of command PIV, tactician and hull down? Really now.

Give a single reason, why you would even think of picking fortified over Jaeger, even if both commanders would have been free, considering you are picking both commanders pretty much to get Elephant.
25 Mar 2021, 17:47 PM
#23
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1



Um? So teller mines, spotting scopes and AT strafe are worth skipping in favor of command PIV, tactician and hull down? Really now.

Give a single reason, why you would even think of picking fortified over Jaeger, even if both commanders would have been free, considering you are picking both commanders pretty much to get Elephant.

I personally some times use "fortified" instead of Jagger in 2vs2 simply because one can skip t3 and try to survive with the crappy C.Pz until Elefant can be called in.

Panzer tactician is way better than Riegel imo also.
25 Mar 2021, 20:27 PM
#24
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Mar 2021, 15:57 PMSpoof
Isn't the AT strafe the same as the one from CAS? The one that has artillery flares and takes 5 seconds to arrive and is dodged by clicking 10 pixels to the right?

i believe it is, however its area of effect is rather decent and its damage is fantastic.

i dont really think there ios much issue in the ability though- but the ost "nerf" is more of a commander rabalnce than a nerf when compared to the soviet one as the AT strafe is better in some scenarios than the stuka nuka whereas the soviet one is simply worse in every way to the il-2 bombs
25 Mar 2021, 20:50 PM
#25
avatar of Spoof

Posts: 449


i believe it is, however its area of effect is rather decent and its damage is fantastic.

i dont really think there ios much issue in the ability though- but the ost "nerf" is more of a commander rabalnce than a nerf when compared to the soviet one as the AT strafe is better in some scenarios than the stuka nuka whereas the soviet one is simply worse in every way to the il-2 bombs

I'm fine with the strafe being mediocre, it just surprises me that the strafe actually works sometimes. I've never used it nor seen it being used with success.
25 Mar 2021, 21:16 PM
#26
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Mar 2021, 20:50 PMSpoof

I'm fine with the strafe being mediocre, it just surprises me that the strafe actually works sometimes. I've never used it nor seen it being used with success.


part of me feels like its been over nerfed, because of the speed it comes in now, but another part of me remembers when they gave close air support out for free and it was deleting tanks without so much as the smoke landing yet.... im sure theres a happy medium somewhere but its scary to think about missing the mark....
25 Mar 2021, 23:04 PM
#27
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Mar 2021, 20:50 PMSpoof

I'm fine with the strafe being mediocre, it just surprises me that the strafe actually works sometimes. I've never used it nor seen it being used with success.


TBF i think you could give Jaeger Armor any kinda of offmap capable of destroying rocket artillery and the effect would be the same as per OP describes.

If it wasn't for the commander's name, the AI suppress strafe from CAS would had been the ideal change (since ISU commanders got the AI crappy one as well).
25 Mar 2021, 23:18 PM
#28
avatar of LMAO

Posts: 163

The last changes made Jäger Armour even more popular in team games as the AT-strafe is generally more useful than the Stuka dive bomb. The ability is also bugged and there are usually no sound cues. In combination with Spec Ops flares, it's almost impossible to keep arty pieces alive as you have to constantly have your camera on them to have a chance to dodge the ability.

Every single 3v3 has Jäger Armour in it, the balance patch tried to fix this but totally failed at achieving its goal.
You're lazy to reposition your moving artillery pieces so it needs nerf seems ok. How about nerfing all arty pieces defensive stats too? So axis actually don't need to spend tons of munition to get rid of the stupid caty, priest etc. and it wont even work if you are actually paying attention
26 Mar 2021, 01:40 AM
#29
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1793

AT strafe is shit and worse than stuka dive bomb

at least with sdb, you can destory buildings or arty pieces or decap

AT strafe is a slow single pass that is useless against allies fast tanks.

OP is on crack! or mistaken AT strafe for loitering planes..

On other hand, P47 and ukf version needs to be look at!
26 Mar 2021, 07:22 AM
#30
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

If it wasn't for the commander's name, the AI suppress strafe from CAS would had been the ideal change (since ISU commanders got the AI crappy one as well).


I disagree, because the Elefant is supposed to be weak against AT infantry. An AI strafe would counter those.

The AT strafe isn't that special, I guess it's only useful against rocket arty because of OKW Spec Ops flares that you won't really notice because those barely have any indications of being used. Shouldn't be a problem anymore if they get changed or switched out.

And the Soviet AI strafe will be buffed.
26 Mar 2021, 19:37 PM
#31
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2



I disagree, because the Elefant is supposed to be weak against AT infantry. An AI strafe would counter those.

The AT strafe isn't that special, I guess it's only useful against rocket arty because of OKW Spec Ops flares that you won't really notice because those barely have any indications of being used. Shouldn't be a problem anymore if they get changed or switched out.

And the Soviet AI strafe will be buffed.


It's been years since i've seen the AI strafe been used but i don't think it's effective against mobile infantry. Might be wrong and if it works well you are right.
26 Mar 2021, 19:57 PM
#32
avatar of Grining Cat

Posts: 98

The last changes made Jäger Armour even more popular in team games as the AT-strafe is generally more useful than the Stuka dive bomb. The ability is also bugged and there are usually no sound cues. In combination with Spec Ops flares, it's almost impossible to keep arty pieces alive as you have to constantly have your camera on them to have a chance to dodge the ability.

Every single 3v3 has Jäger Armour in it, the balance patch tried to fix this but totally failed at achieving its goal.



Hey, I am exactly the kind of player who picks Jäger Armour almost in every team game! :)

Which Ostheer doctrines do you play in 3v3? Or which would you suggest as an good alternative?

I often feel like Jäger Armour the best choice, because other doctrines feel weaker or don´t offer as much.
26 Mar 2021, 20:00 PM
#33
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1




Hey, I am exactly the kind of player who picks Jäger Armour almost in every team game! :)

Which Ostheer doctrines do you play in 3v3? Or which would you suggest as an good alternative?

I often feel like Jäger Armour the best choice, because other doctrines feel weaker or don´t offer as much.


Ah Schmusekatze :)

Jäger Armour is the best choice which is why everyone uses it every game. That's exactly my point. It should be nerfed further so the game isn't as boring. No one wants to play against the same doctrine over and over again.
26 Mar 2021, 20:09 PM
#34
avatar of 1st. Fallschirmjäger

Posts: 67



Ah Schmusekatze :)

Jäger Armour is the best choice which is why everyone uses it every game. That's exactly my point. It should be nerfed further so the game isn't as boring. No one wants to play against the same doctrine over and over again.


What about a wild idea, that instead of nerfing everything that is useful/good, buff some things that are not.
26 Mar 2021, 20:15 PM
#35
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474



Ah Schmusekatze :)

Jäger Armour is the best choice which is why everyone uses it every game. That's exactly my point. It should be nerfed further so the game isn't as boring. No one wants to play against the same doctrine over and over again.
well really for team game u need an elephant/JT so u really have 3 commander total to play , maybe okw can pull of using the elite armor with the jadpanzer with boosted ammo
26 Mar 2021, 20:26 PM
#36
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

well really for team game u need an elephant/JT so u really have 3 commander total to play , maybe okw can pull of using the elite armor with the jadpanzer with boosted ammo

True Elefant/JT is the necessary evil vs allied TDs.
26 Mar 2021, 20:40 PM
#37
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1

well really for team game u need an elephant/JT so u really have 3 commander total to play , maybe okw can pull of using the elite armor with the jadpanzer with boosted ammo


I rarely see JT in 3v3 and I personally never use it as 2x JP4 are way better. Ostheer is fine without Elefant as well. You can counter TDs with Pak40s and Pgrens with Shrecks. Elefant with spotting scope is just too way easier to use as it remains broken OP.
26 Mar 2021, 20:47 PM
#38
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474



I rarely see JT in 3v3 and I personally never use it as 2x JP4 are way better. Ostheer is fine without Elefant as well. You can counter TDs with Pak40s and Pgrens with Shrecks. Elefant with spotting scope is just too way easier to use as it remains broken OP.
no, cause we all know how team games ends, arty +td + is/rifle/cos spam late game team weapons have short life
idk about spotting scopes but im sure u will still see elephant and JT unless they put them at 50 range in that case u will only see the search opponent bar forever :snfPeter:
26 Mar 2021, 21:21 PM
#39
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

well really for team game u need an elephant/JT so u really have 3 commander total to play

Lol that's just not true. They are strong in team games sure, but saying you need one in order to win is a massive exaggeration

Like the JT isn't necessary in the slightest. JP4s are better option almost always like blvckdream said
26 Mar 2021, 21:25 PM
#40
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 940

JT suffers from the fundamental lack of spotting scopes (limited to 35 sight range or firing into FoW at ppl testing its armor) and thus needs a spotter, hence its lower pick compared to Ele, even trying to factor in JP4 existing. It's extremely difficult to deal with when well supported, far more than Elefant, but that's to be expected.
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