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Currently Browsing: Topic - [Winter Balance Update] SOV Feedback


Thread: [Winter Balance Update] SOV FeedbackYesterday, 15:23 PM Jump back to quoted postYesterday, 15:13 PMKatitof And you really have only 2 options here. Make both tiers have viable AI and AT options OR do something with accessibility to one when you got other. You can't do both, but current status quo can't and won't stay either. Well as I said, I wouldnt fiddle with accessibility, but rather make them cheaper, to keep resources investement the same as if you went for only one tier, or maybe just a little bit expensive and cut this expenses from T3, but make them both requared for T3. Because ideally, this whole balance idea behind them as they are right now, is only somewhat working in 1v1. While even in 2v2 it goes into shitter like instantly. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] SOV FeedbackYesterday, 15:05 PM Jump back to quoted post10 Jan 2021, 03:46 AMFunPolice So I want to repeat this but Penals still have this massive issue of expensive back techs to get basic tools like support weapons. We saw the OKW get some changes to their teching so it's easier to get Medics if they are skipped. Penals should get a similar treatment because imo their back tech is far more important to the late game compared to medics. Something like significantly reducing the cost of T2 and T1 once a player gets T4 would still leave penals without AT guns until the late game where it otherwise becomes very hard to function without them. It would also technically give the option to get T1 for builds that didn't get it although there's often little reason to. Without something like this Penals are still just have this big issue of having to do an expensive back tech delaying their late game even further. You cant look at OKW, this comparison cant be more wrong really. OKW got tech changes not to provide you with full access to backtech tier, but to give you access to medics, since its a basic tool, which never should have been locked behind chose. You still have to pay just as much, if you decide to fully unlock med track units. Right now soviet T1 and T2 in their core idea, arent meant to be used at the same time without any resource punishment. In its core this idea that "Either T1 or T2" is the opened pandora box. Because idealy both T1 and T2 units should justify skipping each other, and they are by far dont, well T1 at least. Because in any case, if you are unable to roflstomp your opponent with T1 and force him to surrender and completly baselock him, you will still need T2 at least for an AT gun. Personnaly I think this is over-all bad desing, and T3 should requare both T1 and T2 to be build, with proper cost ajustment ofcourse. In this case at least whole soviet T1\T2 units can be balanced in context that you will always have access to them, because they are part of your tech and not self sufficient buildings, which ideally should provide whole roster of self-sufficient units. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] OST Feedback5 Jan 2021, 13:13 PM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 12:59 PMvgfgff Did you ever put stock penal/Cons/Riflemen/IS vs gren at long range and see what happened? Ye and how many brainsells one must have to use penal/Cons/Riflemen vs grens at long range? And in equal cover IS will win vs Grens. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] UKF Feedback5 Jan 2021, 02:16 AM I would say that hunt won't be used mainly against heavier targets but it will be used to just have penetration advantage fighting mediums. Also honestly, speed buffs, fow view and so on is cool. But won't it be VERY easy to dive for artillery units and just delete them. I mean, you can't really hide because Cromwell will see it, and aside from insta alpha strike nothing will kill it fast enouth with how fast it is. I really thing that if it should detect vehicles in fow it should be applied only to damaged ones. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] SOV Feedback29 Dec 2020, 00:50 AM Jump back to quoted post29 Dec 2020, 00:45 AMelchino7 2 on everything, 3 PTRS, 3 Zook on rangers. I didn't think it was worth testing 2 Elite Zook on Paras. Not sure how you see them doing similarly when they had the most reliable and best performance overall. Maybe you refer for cost and that would be correct. But zooks on RET ha a high variance on dmg, as they often failed to pen and they barely survived all the incoming damage. Not sure if i perfectly aligned them in front of the PV so they get hit by all MGs with 100% uptime. TDL penals with 3 PTRSs which cost rufly the same as 1 zook\schreck\piat are able to take more then half of the HP PV. Would be actually funny to see, how they pefrom compared to 1 schreck\zook\piat In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] SOV Feedback28 Dec 2020, 21:31 PM Jump back to quoted post28 Dec 2020, 19:38 PMKatitof They are well balanced at the moment. Can you hold attack from two fronts? From thouse who think they are OP and thouse who think they are UP In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] OST Feedback27 Dec 2020, 11:33 AM Jump back to quoted post27 Dec 2020, 02:33 AMelchino7 Soviets and OKW are in their current position due to their tech. Check how much you spend in tech to get T2 + Conscript upgrades + T3 + T70 vs OKW going mechanized + P2. There's a reason also why OKW is getting more accessible medics as well, cause both USF/UKF can deal with mechanized in an efficient way. Well without going into the offtopic too much. I partly agree, but soviets and OKW are two simular but completly different cases, imho. OKW is the case of messed up unit timings due to tech cost standatization across the factions and the fact that WFA and EFA are not equal, not even close. Best example are oberts, who arrives usually when the WFA have an upper hand over them, and they have to grind vet fast to catch up, while they are fine against Soviets. Soviets are the case of old Relic design and complete removal of cheesiness, without proper ajustments of power and costs. But thing is soviets are tied to Ost just as Ost tied to soviets. Right now, I would say, Soviet vs Ostheer is more or less even, with probably ost having slight advantage due to MG42 and all the skips they can do. Ultimatly both Soviets and Ostheer rely on somesort of carry unit. Ost vs WFA is fully dependent on MG42 play, untill like midgame and even after. Even sniper is not as important as MG42. Soviets are fine early to mid game vs OKW, but fall flat on their ass ones OKW start gaining StGs and elite inf, making a T70 a go for unit. I honestly just belive that both USF\UKF put powel level way to high, while Ost is tied to Soviets in terms of power and vise versa, OKW has to balance between strong WFA and objectively weaker EFA. Jump back to quoted post27 Dec 2020, 02:44 AMthedarkarmadillo at the end of the day the molitov is "only" 80mp and 10 fuel, but its an extra cost that directly inflates the cost of cons. pretending its not an additional cost helps even less. I would rather call it, additional cost that you are expected to pay at some point. I mean, its true what you are saying. I'm not fully agree that side grades inflates cost of cons. But at the end of a day, in live version and meta, if you got AT nades as Soviets, you didnt put yourself in a resources disadvantage, because, as I've said, you are kinda expected to unlock AT nades at some point. While if you for some reason didnt and managed to pull it off without AT nades, then you've made a savings and you can tech faster. I can agree that it just feels unfair, because all other factions get snares for free and all the side grades\free grades focusing more on power increase, while soviets side grades (AT nades) are mandatory abilities. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] OST Feedback27 Dec 2020, 01:04 AM Jump back to quoted post26 Dec 2020, 20:03 PMKatitof Actually, if we consider side unlocks that are mandatory meta, ost will hands down get med earliest, its not even funny how much faster if they get that AEC/Stuart/T-70 on a teller early, preventing them from losing map control in early mid game. Its true. But again its a capitalization on power for UKF\USF. Soviets T70 can be considered true mandatory LV. But again, every sain person would agree, that soviets in general arent the best designed faction in terms of how their tech works and it should be looked at, at some point. Jump back to quoted post26 Dec 2020, 20:03 PMKatitof That's too simplistic and detached from what happens in the game, which has given us our current meta state. Well, it is what it is. While you are right in way, still in current meta, no matter if you like or hate it, all factions more or less have fair timings of all nessesry tools they need. Execution of this might be far from being perfect, but the point point is still remains the same, that over-all free or payed grades are somewhat compinsated evenly across the faction by timings and costs. So "X gets Y for free, while Z have to pay", arent really helping anybody. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] OST Feedback26 Dec 2020, 19:23 PM Jump back to quoted post26 Dec 2020, 16:42 PMthedarkarmadillo Its strange to me that osts stuff included with tech somehow inflates their tech costs and you are "paying extra, just don't have a choice not to" when every single other instance of stuff being added to to be included with tech didn't increase tech costs. 7 man in t4 costs the exact same as pre 7 man. When volks got stgs, flame nades and snares their tech costs were not adjusted to accommodate this "totally paid for and not free" additional content.... Tbh here, I never understood all this free and paid stuff shenanigans. We cant lets say compare ost free unlocks to UKF\USF free stuff. Aswell as we cant compare soviet free stuff to OKW free stuff. All that matters at the end of the day - how fast factions can reach their first tank. Right now, if we consider realistic play, with all usuall side grades, free grades, weapon upgrades and so on. All the faction more or less have fair timing in terms of how fast they can have\get their armor and armor counters. I think this is what matters the most. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: [Winter Balance Update] UKF Feedback25 Dec 2020, 14:48 PM Jump back to quoted post24 Dec 2020, 23:16 PMDescolata All im going to nit pick is PIATs really REALLY suck. They are Zook clones, without any Super PIATs. So that isnt as nasty. Piats are the second strongest inf AT weapon in the game, after panzerschreck. It only has slow firing speed out of cover. Check penetration values on them. Super zooks are better, but at the same time standart zooks are shit and super zooks requare commanders and quite expensive squads. UKF can have second strongest inf AT weapon on a second cheapest inf squad in the game (after rears) which can have AT weapons and also have snares with them. PGs - expensive, small squad Rangers\Paras - just expensive, requares commander Rears - cheap but shit zooks Rifles - snare but shit zooks And objectively Royals are probably second best squad to have AT weapons on in terms of cost\effectiveness and abilities. First one being Panzerfusiliers, because they also do have snare and recon on top of that. Jump back to quoted post25 Dec 2020, 02:20 AMgeneral_gawain I do think what many people who complain about the Heavy Engineers miss is that they are completely overburdened with tasks in a bad and risky way. Hello, Sturmpios, my old friend, I've come to talk with you again. In: COH2 Balance