I would like cons to be useable without weapon upgrades if possible, and keep that to doctrines.
I don't believe that's possible.
They had veterancy increased, weapon change to be less RNG fest, got extra 10% accuracy vet and all of that is still irrelevant in comparison to regular LMG or G43 grens.
However, if they were to get a T3/T4 weapon upgrade, it should be this current SVT.
Upgrade is too weak to be doctrinal and simply doesn't bring enough for the cost and functionality(unless you drop it for ost player, hoping he'll pick it, nerfing his grens DPS and blocking weapon slot), but it would be sufficient for late game upgrade for cons. |
Wait, what the F are paras for then? Do you always call them into your base?
When was last time you've seen not base/friendly territory paras drop in 1v1 or 2v2?
Also, infiltration units are shock units, paras are not, because 1) It takes an eon for them to drop 2) Its not exactly stealthy or sudden, so no, not infiltration troops. |
ass engies and cav rifles can match pgrens at point blank unupgraded. Pgren CQC is not a big deal.
And which allied stock squad has 60 CQC DPS?
Also, are ass engies or cav rifles 6 man squads with 0.95 rec acc?
Are cav rifles 0 CP?
Have you read patch notes recently? |
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So go and complain about that in Lend lease assault thread?
Also, these thompsons aren't exactly minute 0 upgrade.
And I'm talking about your own proposal.
Do you REALLY think that squad with PG CQC DPS and better then penal out of the gate durability is in any way, shape or form balanced at 0CP? |
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If something is mandatory for a win at competitive level, its not really an option.
Patch after patch after patch after patch have proven that correct, especially with ever changing soviet early game balance where always 2 out of 3 options were non viable choice for memes, not winning the game.
If we ignored balance completely, you'd be right. Its an option as you can build it or not. But we can't ignore balance, we can't ignore state of conscripts, we can't ignore state of maxim, that means the "option" is not really optional if you're interested in rank higher then 500 in 1v1 or 2v2.
So you're wrong for the reasons thedarkarmadillo mentioned.
Arguing against that is equal to pure denial of current state of balance of soviet early game.
Not all games happen through spreadsheet and theorycraft and forum warrioring, some actually happen in games, where you need to take the REAL possibilities based on current balance of available units, not semantical theorycraft over the meaning of word "optional". |
I was lucky enough to find some games over the last days in which i played with and against Assgrens.
My experiences so far:
- Never skip T1: Allied light vehicles (UC, Soviet scout car, USF jeep) will completely bully you and you cant protect your MG. Skipping T1 = Self suicide
- The 5-men unit is still too weak
- The 6-men unit works and can be good with veterancy.
My suggestion:
- Increase unit cost to 300
- Increase cooldown time
- Let the unit already start with 6 men!
I really think this change would deserve testing - even the 6 men unit is not especially fearsome.
How is that surprising to you and why it should be like that?
AGs were never, not even for a split second considered mainline replacement or allow any kind of tier skipping. They are supplemental early game shock unit that now can scale beyond mid game with the 6th man upgrade adding both durability and dps.
Answer me this, do you seriously, with a straight face honestly believe that a 60 DPS 6 man unit with below 1 rec acc from first minute is balanced?
You're supposed to get 1 maybe 2 to supplement your opening, not replace how the faction is supposed to operate by steamrolling everything that isn't a light vehicle with them. |
Imo Penal battalion would be in much better place design wise if they followed P.F. design and had a separate upgrade for their AI and AT.
Then their cost and built time could be adjusted.
We can talk about that when cons are on the level of volks in terms of combat capability.
PFs are fully optional.
Penals, with maxim gutted out of existence and cons being impotent without ppsh doctrine, are not. |
OKW starting mp 350
Usf starting mp 400
Not unit + starting mp
Starting mp is starting mp, not my issue if you don't get it.
Actually, starting MP standard is 500.
From that starting MP, cost of starting unit is subtracted.
3 factions are getting BONUS EXTRA MP, meaning they have more total resources at start then other factions.
A faction that gets MOST, +100, is OKW. OKW got this massive bonus so they can instantly start building another unit, same thing for UKF, but again, UKF got that value at only 60 MP if memory serves me right.
Ost get bonus MP as well, but its lower value then OKW and they have it pretty much "just because" at current point in balance.
So yes, OKW has most starting MP. |
I would like to see the received accuracy increased because of 4 man squad. They just die too fast for their price to be effective,
They already have 0.8 and hefty vet bonus.
Add more to that and they'll start dodging bullets, matrix style.
But they are not shock troops, never were and never will be, they will always be punished by frontal attack without use of cover or other units allowing for approach(sniper stun shot, mortar smoke, HMG suppression, gren rifle nade forcing movement therefore lowering opponents dps, even moving in first other squad to soak some damage). |
I fail to see how a doctrinal unit to counter a stock unit with no viable counter at that time is going to end USF(?) I don't get why USF. Sounds like a soviet clown car issue.
Ending or not, there is lack of consistency.
Even partisans, who are not 0cp require AT nades upgrade before using them and being doctrinal apparently doesn't help there.
Osttruppen as well require T1 for their faust access.
OKW is a big boy now, no need for these training wheels.
0 CP unit should not have instant access to utility tool that is delayed to keep very early game in check for the faction. |
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