That wasn't the question lol. Is it really impossible for me to say that I don't think it's bad but it should lose 10 fuel off the cost?
Like I'm not saying it has no applications. It's just been nerfed significantly, so I don't see how it's still worth the same price. You're just paying for mobility at this point, otherwise you'll get a pak howy
That's fair. I can't say for certain as my games with the mod are limited, and my games with usf in the mod even more so though I'd rather er on the side of caution due to how oppressive the Scott could be. Plus if we knock of 10 fuel we've more than double undone the back breaking nerf the Jackson got a little back and I'm not sure I'm ready for that |
So do you think it's still think it's worth 75 fuel?
I do think it certain scenarios it has its applications. The thing about having indirect out the ass is they won't (or shouldn't) all be viable in every scenario all the time. Even with the shorter range the unit will work well on the defensive as AT will likely be behind enemy front line, the mobility will let it escape armour and reposition where needed. The barrages are ever useful. It's not an auto pick but it'll eb decent. |
Does Mobilize Reserves provide extra utility with no additional cost? Yes
You want to argue that AT grenade is now more expensive? it is fine by we can agree to disagree.
How is it that the first is true and yet the second is in. Contention? If you never got the nolitov, which you shouldn't, because they are bad, you are now forced to get them with AT nades. At nades are more expensive as a result. |
So in a real game, T3 comes about 10 fuel and 50 MP earlier at best and 5 fuel and 25 MP earlier at worst (depending on when you purchase AT nades), whereas you pay 25 MP less and 5 fuel more for T4. This is a minimal buff to teching.
But what is the argument? Teching for just teching is complete bullshit. There is no point in teching for its own sake.
T3 units come earlier, which is likely a necessary buff for the SU76 and the M5 which at least might have the chance to make them more attractive), while the T70 got a rightful nerf to justify it coming a bit earlier. The only issue that can still arise is if the T70 were STILL too strong, which to be honest I cannot judge.
Otherwise you are arguing for keeping the SU76 and M5 as units that are not even niche, but absolutely useless.
I don't disagree with anything here. The changes to teching, though minor will mean a bit sooner quad/su76. Combined with a much needed nerf to the T70. I however believe that with the nerf to the T70 and how minor the changes to tech truly are, there is room for improvement still.
The T70 may well still be OP at which point its more or less stays quo, but in the end 5-10 fuel one way or another doest really change a whole lot, it's a matter of seconds. The area soviet has always struggled is manpower (which the medics will help) and awkwardly rigid teching (although it's better than it used to be) |
There all buffs in tech and no more buffs are needed.
Soviet is the faction with most to gain from change to medic healing speed while it also available cheaper making conscript spam more effective.
ATgre/Mol combination is reduction of total Soviet tech cost, regardless.
Earlier T3 is a buff.
Total soviet cost has already been reduced and these is little to justify further reduction, that was my point I am sticking with it.
The medics will certainly be nice, especially how they won't get caught up on a single model and not heal anything at all unless you micro your units at base, no argument there. But you still have to retreat to have heals, which desires a slight increase in effectiveness. The only change medics in my memory have ever received was they lost a medic, and that was back when the game was slower.
Moli/at nade isn't a reduction in cost if you never it the molitov, which Noone did because they are garbage. At any rate I would GLADLY trade the combination in favor of knocking some manpower off t1/t2 if the other is built so that penals can be less oppressive as they would have support.
Earlier t3 is technically a buff but worse T70 is a significant nerf. You sre arguing paper costs I'm arguing impact.
If soviet teching is already being reduced then it's in scope and there is no reason not to be discussing alternatives that might have better synergy with the faction. |
kv8 rear armor 145
p4 near pen 125
brumbar rear armor 105/126
t3476 near pen 120
su85 far pen 220/242(patch)
time to apply same standards with brumbar nerfs!
If you sre suggesting that the kv-8 gets the ability to wipe squads instantly in very going to disagree with you. |
Making the tech cost cheaper as suggested without out changing anything else is not a redesign, is straight up buff.
The faction that has already received tech buffs with cheaper (and better) medic, lower cost for At/molotv combo, faster T3 and better MR.
There is no need for further buff to soviet tech
Medics was a much needed change to put it part way near half as effective as all other factions healing, the moli/ at combo is not a better price, it's a nerf to the AT nade price by shackeling it to what is possibly the worst ability in the game. Faster t3 is coming in the heels of a massive tone down of the T70, THE crutch unit, the only thing that gets soviet through the mid game...
Medics aside these are not buffs, these are adjustments. At this point working in a MP reduction to some techs would ALSO not be buffs, but adjustments because as it stands with the nerfs to the T70 soviet might not be making it through the mid game. Having units to support penals wouldn't break the game when you consider the loss of T70 power spike. Hell, combined with the increased price on the AT nade, it would probably have t3 hitting at the same time as now |
It didn't got any additional buffs to base speed.
It got vet swap and ability that works in context with the unit.
Then its time to tone down Blitz and Combat Blitz.
Speed without bite and speed with bite are different things. Keep in mind too that war speed costs no munitions. Meaning for about the price of blitz you will have blitz pro. I think hunt will be a good addition, but we should consider OP synergy with other elements as we don't know if/when it'll be addressed again. |
Flanking with indirect fire units isn't exactly the intended use of INDIRECT fire units.
That's like being forced to flank HMG with a mortar.
Tho I do get all the butthurt about the scott autofire and do hope barrage ends up not useless.
Of course I don't mean flank, but if the enemy has the counter present in that area, operate elsewhere. One of the biggest boons of the Scott is its mobility. Assuming the barrage still functions well, that will be used when AT is present, maybe even on the AT to push it off and allow the Scott room to roam |
well, with 50 range autofire going 1 or 2 Scotts is too risky ( get shot by pak, Raketten right after you fire).
.... Don't park it in front of a pak? Like seriously come on. You do have to play the game you know? This isn't supposed to be a tower defense game where you shoot down with minimal effort and the enemy just walks the slolim of death. |
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