Firefly has mg on his turret
The panzerwerfer has an MG on the top of it. It's equally revevant to the role and balance of the unit. |
I feel like Penals with SMG performance should be similar to Shock troops or better since their cost is about the same. Shouldn't be worse at least because you're spending munitions and not getting grenade(s).
no nades, smoke or armour |
You mean like getting a stock HMG? OKW was launched with no mg34 stock, it was doctrinal. People complained, so they got one stock
Flak HQ isn't really OP but the gun should really have a popcost. Make the gun a free upgrade after panzer authorization. Only cost is 5 pop or something close to that
I dont see why OKW even needs the flak HQ anymore, but if it's not going anywhere at least give it a popcost
Tbh I'd sooner have the gun require muni than pop cap. Ukf have their base howis but don't require pop for them, I'd much sooner see the flak truck pay per use. |
but both factions that have long range indirects have non-doc forward retreat points and both indirects are cheaper than the mortar
as long as the price goes down thats an alright change, otherwise hell nah
Neither faction has a merge.
You will almost never lose either a leig not a pak howi to direct fire, same with the 120mm. You lose them all to being out indirected. I don't feel the 120 would need a cost reduction for losing retreat, as it already has the ability to limp away with 1 model (see oak howi for how much of a benifit this is)
Its range is its retreat and an enemy managing to get in there and out play that shouldn't be met with a bonus to survival. |
I agree, its survivability is absurd for how hard it hits. 1v1 no big deal, maybe even 2v2, but once mg walls can be made it most cancerous.
I personally think raks are similar, they themselves are not great but the ability to fuck up bad and just 1 click retreat out of a mistake is dumb. To combat the actual survivability of the unit i think there should be a pak up delay when retreat is issued. Anywhere from 1/2 second to a full second before the unit begins retreat animation. OR maybe slow down the packing up of the weapon animation if that is possible.
Frankly, you could even just remove retreat fr it entirely... The other long range indirect don't have retreat (leig, pak howi, erm... Mortar pit) and they manage fine |
I'm pretty sure that this used to be the case. Except the units got replaced. Supposedly penals were literally a "placeholder" for elite troops, (Meaning you'd have to tech T1 in order to get Shocks or Guards, and once you picked a doctrine you couldn't make the stock version any more.) that's the reason they weren't given a purpose for a long time if I understand correctly.
You are correct, early in the beta doctrinal units replaced core units, I'd have them built alongside like the t34/85 for units that should be "rushable" and like the wehr skirt p4 for units that find themselves with split tech (120mm would be in t0 for example, so it can still support a T1 build)
. Unlocked with CP like now, but required to be built, delaying it slightly |
Well yes and no. I'd say trying to counter 120mm with stuka specifically is a bad idea, since it has long CD and even if you de-crew 120mm soviet will just crew it back. Stuka helps soften soviets defence which might allow you to push and at least force 120mm away.
And 120mm is not OP in a sence of perfomance. Its imo just overtuned for the timing and stats it has. If it was a little bit weaker surviability wise or came like not at 2CP but at 3CP, it might have been completly fine.
I've always felt that doctrinal units should be built. That gives a lot more control over their balance via build time and tieing up production and resources while it's built. It also eliminates the "panic" call in where you instantly have a unit if you need it |
I don't think it's necessary, but if it was done, the toggle could apply the muni drain that old T70 auto repair used to to keep it balanced. It's an AT gun that can be a field gun, I wouldn't want to see cheesy shenanigans of mass infinite arty barrage that can then fight off any tanks. |
Never really understood the armor on the JP4. It's a 60 range TD with a relatively small target size and it gets 160HP at vet 2 like you mentioned. Why does it need the armor?
I don't think it's horribly gamebreaking or anything, just find it confusing . The understand the armour you have to reflect on the original design of OKW. their armour was all durable to help offset thier slowed income. If the jp4 was your only vehicle, getting swarmed by t34s could be devistating. Durability to be able to get the 5 levels of vet was a hallmark, even the lights were above average durabilty- T70 and Stuart were 320HP but the Luchs was 400, iirc the Stuka was 320,and the on top of everything else has smoke.
OKW didn't have a snare at launch either so the durability on a casemate makes sense in that regard too. |
The leIG already does that. Instead of a stun, it forces units to go prone messing with cover and firing cycles.
Suppression on indirect was tried and it made the game REALLY stale.
Supression was tried on auto fire on a long range indirect that could be parked beside a defense fortress...
If it's done with even a weee bit of thought it could work. For example on barrage only. Then it's not uncountable supression, but player controlled area effect on a cooldown. |