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allied artillery

11 Feb 2019, 16:42 PM
#21
avatar of #12345678

Posts: 65

The only arty piece that is trully OP in this game is Katyusha as it can consistently wipe lone squads on demand. It is tied to huge risk though because in order to achieve this effect you need to do barrage from minimal possible range.
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Apparently the OP arty is panzerwerfer and walking stuka. Guaranteed squad wipe in close range.
11 Feb 2019, 17:16 PM
#22
avatar of ElSlayer

Posts: 1563 | Subs: 2



And just that you contradict yourself: one Katyusha has a dense rocket volley only at a dangerously close distance. If you want a dense rocket salvo at a distance - you need two Katyushas, one jaeger unit that appeared in the rear can destroy two Katushas, which can cost you victory in game. So no, Katyusha is the most balanced artelian unit in the game.

Yes it is somewhat balanced but in a way as snipers are balanced. Some factions have better tools to deal with snipers, others suffer (I'm looking at you, USF). Same with Katy.

Apparently the OP arty is panzerwerfer and walking stuka. Guaranteed squad wipe in close range.

They are much more dodgeable than min-range Katy barrage.

Ah, yes, I see now, I didn't mentioned one important trait of Katy in my previous post.
Katy is the only rocket artillery piece that is effective against MOVING targets because time between issued order and the moment when first rocket hits ground is really low in comparison Peewerfer and Wurfrahmen.
11 Feb 2019, 17:22 PM
#23
avatar of SupremeStefan

Posts: 683

Alied arty so op espiecially brits without sexton commander
11 Feb 2019, 18:06 PM
#24
avatar of zerocoh

Posts: 723

jump backJump back to quoted post11 Feb 2019, 10:23 AMKatitof
Don't spam bunkers all over the map then?

Its not Red Alert, static defenses are very weak and arty is specifically made to hardcounter them.


this, also the last patch made ALL factions much more mobile and offensive. I play lots of private games with friends and the ones that used to turtle all game are getting massively rekt now after the commander revamp.

CoH2 used to be a WW1 simulator, now it's a proper mobile warfare game.
11 Feb 2019, 20:55 PM
#25
avatar of insaneHoshi

Posts: 691

, one jaeger unit that appeared in the rear can destroy two Katushas, which can cost you victory in game. So no, Katyusha is the most balanced artelian unit in the game.


If you let two katushas get killed by JLI you deserve to loose.
11 Feb 2019, 21:08 PM
#26
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 1037 | Subs: 2



If you let two katushas get killed by JLI you deserve to loose.


Katyusha is very vulnerable, killing two Katyushas with the sabotage unit - easy, using a howitzer counterbattery shooting - one shot, especially considering that in almost every mast the Germans are spamming howitzers.
11 Feb 2019, 22:46 PM
#27
avatar of Grim

Posts: 556



Where are OST Panzerwerfer and OKW walking stuka? You eat them?


Sorry I forgot to outline that I was referring to allied factions only.

12 Feb 2019, 01:13 AM
#28
avatar of insaneHoshi

Posts: 691


Katyusha is very vulnerable, killing two Katyushas with the sabotage unit - easy,


Yeah, vulnerable to tanks, not to 16 dmg k98s that have 1 pen vs 7/5 armour.

The only way a JLI can kill two is if their owner is asleep at the wheel.
15 Feb 2019, 04:35 AM
#29
avatar of Dyingbattery22

Posts: 12

The only arty piece that is trully OP in this game is Katyusha as it can consistently wipe lone squads on demand. It is tied to huge risk though because in order to achieve this effect you need to do barrage from minimal possible range.



Disagree with #2.
From my experience - static artillery pieces at best can be decrewed by counter barrage; self-propelled artillery may be destroyed in process if you don't stop its barrage if it got hit.

Recently I had one game where I decided to give another try to Priests. Had to stop my barrages after I fired 2nd shell as they got hit by Lefh for around half HP pool.

Counterbarrage is effective against both static and self-propelled arty.


i would nerf the katyushas penetration and i think it would be fine.
15 Feb 2019, 04:54 AM
#30
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 2150

As Katitof said though try to be more mobile and aggressive as opposed to static gameplay. In addition you could build Howitzers and the Vet 1 ability will automatically fire at enemy artillery units.

On a side note it would be nice if they brought back the Panzerfeldhaubitze 18M auf Geschützwagen III/IV (Sf) Hummel from COH 1 in some way.

Yeah if you're really having trouble with arty destroying "defensive positions" you should really just not be building so many defensive positions. Resort to aggressive infantry and tank play instead. Blitzkrieg, not Atlantic Wall :P

I really wish there was a hummel too but sadly Relic won't add any more assets to the game.
15 Feb 2019, 08:56 AM
#31
avatar of SeductiveCardbordBox

Posts: 130

4v4 is absolutely an indirect party just because of unit density. Four players on any map bar steppes means a lot of dense and slow moving front lines, ergo, artillery.

Decent offmap play will keep static artillery pieces in check to some extent, but its a lot of munitions from the other team for every one field gun. That means no strafes, grenades or loiters in exchange.

But that remains the same for any nation. Recon runs/flares and a stuka cannon loiter will wreck an arty parking lot as reliably as a major recon and timed artillery wreck a static gun. Priests and Sextons are slow to get moving and don't move fast.


No side has any clear advantage in the long term arty game. Brits get no functional indirect at all outside of docterines, usf have no rocket arty, neither can build static guns. Ost and OKW have no SPG but get rocket arty and a mortar/mobile field gun, and can build static arty.

The long and short of it is just that you HAVE to pick a decent mix of commanders in a 4v4, and you should really always expect a lot of indirect support on both sides.
15 Feb 2019, 09:22 AM
#32
avatar of Harry

Posts: 40

Send me a replay so I can tell if you are really right.
As one of the highest rank 4v4 allies and OST players, I see the german artilleries are mostly dominating the current meta in the team games. However, I do realize that lower rank/skill level Axis players are having some struggle dealing with allies arties, when I am playing with my friend who ranks around 700.
15 Feb 2019, 11:52 AM
#33
avatar of SupremeStefan

Posts: 683

Most cancerus thing in this game is that okw has non doc rocket arty and no u dont need micro on maps like port hamburg imo only vanila faction should have it and its total bulshit that okw defensive commander have acess to lefh - its like royal arty+and cancer regiment in one. In 4v4 usf without priest is suicide chalange so dont be suprise that people make them.
Best way to fix 4vs4 is limit non doc rocket arty only to vanila factions. Then give mortar halftruck to okw. Replace arty flares with stuka zu fuss.
=Wow u fix the 5 year old game.
U want stuka? Then pick gardening doctrine
U want lefh ? Then pick gardening doctrine
15 Feb 2019, 23:34 PM
#34
avatar of Cancer

Posts: 10

The walking stuka's and PW's lethality is justified by the soveits having 6 man squads. It is broken against USF though. Katyusha has superfast rockets which almost always grant at least one wiped squad. Callie and LM are the only balanced units IMO.

TLDR, all artillery need to be redesigned. They might be somewhat fine in 1v1, but that mode is irrelevant and not played much (reality check).
17 Feb 2019, 14:01 PM
#35
avatar of kingdun3284

Posts: 384

allied artillery exists except for SU?
17 Feb 2019, 14:20 PM
#36
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 1942

allied artillery exists except for SU?
u don't know the glory of the sexton
17 Feb 2019, 14:24 PM
#37
avatar of kingdun3284

Posts: 384

u don't know the glory of the sexton

u don't know how boring that you can only play the same doctrine every time in team game
17 Feb 2019, 14:35 PM
#38
avatar of SupremeStefan

Posts: 683

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Feb 2019, 23:34 PMCancer
The walking stuka's and PW's lethality is justified by the soveits having 6 man squads. It is broken against USF though. Katyusha has superfast rockets which almost always grant at least one wiped squad. Callie and LM are the only balanced units IMO.

TLDR, all artillery need to be redesigned. They might be somewhat fine in 1v1, but that mode is irrelevant and not played much (reality check).

Exactly, this game is only alive because 4vs4 mode i hope coh3 will be more focused around 4vs4 games. 1vs1 are only for streams lol
17 Feb 2019, 14:53 PM
#39
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 11688 | Subs: 6


Exactly, this game is only alive because 4vs4 mode i hope coh3 will be more focused around 4vs4 games. 1vs1 are only for streams lol

Don't count on it.

You want to see bigger game modes more balanced, then make them do in team games what they did in DoW2 and 3, where in larger game modes income for "fuel" and "muni" is lower and lower the bigger the game is, so there is no resource inflation and pacing is kept.
17 Feb 2019, 18:35 PM
#40
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 5592 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Feb 2019, 14:53 PMKatitof

Don't count on it.

You want to see bigger game modes more balanced, then make them do in team games what they did in DoW2 and 3, where in larger game modes income for "fuel" and "muni" is lower and lower the bigger the game is, so there is no resource inflation and pacing is kept.


I'll rather see them test as well, with a rather smaller popcap.

2v2 is the most number of resources and units the game should have for the amount of strategic points and VPs there are.

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