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Relic Winter Balance Preview v1.5 Update

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13 Jan 2017, 20:05 PM
#21
avatar of BartonPL

Posts: 2807 | Subs: 6

instead of having 2 mseparate upgrades for molotovs and AT nades, why not merge it into one? wouldnt that be easier?
13 Jan 2017, 20:06 PM
#22
avatar of ferwiner
Donator 11

Posts: 2885




OKW need disposable smoke by default or doktrinal like other armies. You cant pass through blendkorpher and it arrives too late...


Flak HT smoke is second best in the game after sherman smoke though. Also, soviets are much less smoke - equipped faction. They have it only on UP mortar nondoctrinally.

There was a proposed solution before though - giving flame nades and molotovs sitght blocking in small area. I think this one could be good for the game.
13 Jan 2017, 20:16 PM
#23
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

Still no buffs for ostheer? :foreveralone:
13 Jan 2017, 20:32 PM
#24
avatar of Mr.Smith

Posts: 2636 | Subs: 17

instead of having 2 mseparate upgrades for molotovs and AT nades, why not merge it into one? wouldnt that be easier?


That would be a very logical thing to do. Unfortunately, we have no way of justifying that such a change would be in-scope.
13 Jan 2017, 20:47 PM
#25
avatar of ZombiFrancis

Posts: 2742

To free up the space from the hq to create an upgrade that affects penals and guards?

Lock demos and at satchels behind an upgrade. That affects penals/guards and is therefore scope.

Although I'd prefer ppsh cons upgrade but we know that's not scope.
13 Jan 2017, 20:47 PM
#26
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

But what does Relic want exactly? They don't seem to want to make any real efforts to change anything in the game that would REALLY help balance. It seems to me that you guys can change some things, but most things are out of scope.

13 Jan 2017, 21:04 PM
#27
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7



That would be a very logical thing to do. Unfortunately, we have no way of justifying that such a change would be in-scope.


I actually don´t like idea of merging both upgrades in one. Why I have to pay for mollies when I only want AT nades ? Why I have to pay for AT nades when I want to use only penal flamer/penal mollies ?
13 Jan 2017, 21:12 PM
#28
avatar of capiqua
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 985 | Subs: 2

MERGED NOTES (V1.0 to v1.5)

MERGED NOTES (V1.0 to v1.5)


Someone who changes the title to: Relic WBP Merged Notes v1.0 to v1.5
13 Jan 2017, 21:13 PM
#29
avatar of TheSleep3r

Posts: 670

While adding more depth to the game by gating some upgrades I feel that making the flamethrower locked behind a molotov upgrade which is anti-garrison itself will make penals even greater replacement to conscripts. Something must be done, if not in this patch, in the next one.
13 Jan 2017, 21:19 PM
#30
avatar of BartonPL

Posts: 2807 | Subs: 6



That would be a very logical thing to do. Unfortunately, we have no way of justifying that such a change would be in-scope.


you need to justify it? okay no problem, molotov sucks and usually its no pooint in researching it and its also worth to netion that US has with one upgrade two abilites (nades and smoke) and Ostheer gets free faust with tech
13 Jan 2017, 21:22 PM
#31
avatar of Mr.Smith

Posts: 2636 | Subs: 17



you need to justify it? okay no problem, molotov sucks and usually its no pooint in researching it and its also worth to netion that US has with one upgrade two abilites (nades and smoke) and Ostheer gets free faust with tech


The catch, here, is you need to justify this with respect to light vehicles, or guards/penals, or ost infantry scaling. Conscripts are not in-scope :(

(OST scaling does NOT mean buffing underpowered squads to match that scaling, btw, else you might have seen shocks buffs).

13 Jan 2017, 21:33 PM
#32
avatar of Osinyagov
Senior Modmaker Badge

Posts: 1389 | Subs: 1

I have a question about already relesed QoL changes - Will they be updated or brought to their logical conclusion with release? Or better to wait next patch for that?
KV-8 - Get more informative icon.

HM-38 - Get new shield symbol, but don't get updated call-in icon for that.

13 Jan 2017, 21:44 PM
#33
avatar of |GB| The Hooligan486
Senior Referee Badge

Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1





If we go for the PTRS-flavoured Penals (especially the ones you've been seeing for 1.3-1.5), their PTRS will not bet gated behind the AT grenade upgrade. This is because:
- AT Grenade upgrade is rather expensive
- PTRS Penals are already a downgrade for most part, compared to guards; we don't want to make them any worse than that.

However, from v1.6, and for a few versions, we will be trialing a PTRS-free version of Penals.

The reason locking flamers behind molotovs makes sense is so that you can't rush flamer + scout car and murder everything (without very little consequences). We'll see, though.

You are probably right.
Was thinking out loud :D
13 Jan 2017, 21:51 PM
#34
avatar of Gluhoman

Posts: 380

Still waiting for molotov buff, still waiting
13 Jan 2017, 22:02 PM
#35
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7

Still waiting for molotov buff, still waiting


Molotovs are actually really good if you use them against charging squads while you´re in cover. Just drop it in front of you cover and wait til they burn or have to fall back.


Also if you don´t charge with squads into no cover to throw them they are really good. For 15 munnition they counter garrisons and also squads in cover if you´re in mid range combat. Soviets also have oraaah. You have to use your conscripts together to help each other and molotovs are only there to counter, what conscripts alone cannot. They were never meant to be strong as other grenades. They were mean to be cheap garrison/green cover counter that is used in conjuction with oraah and other conscripts.
13 Jan 2017, 22:04 PM
#36
avatar of Frost

Posts: 1024 | Subs: 1



Molotovs are actually really good if you use them against charging squads while you´re in cover. Just drop it in front of you cover and wait til they burn or have to fall back.


Also if you don´t charge with squads into no cover to throw them they are really good. For 15 munnition they counter garrisons and also squads in cover if you´re in mid range combat. Soviets also have oraaah. You have to use your conscripts together to help each other and molotovs are only there to counter, what conscripts alone cannot. They were never meant to be strong as other grenades. They were mean to be cheap garrison/green cover counter that is used in conjuction with oraah and other conscripts.



Don't tell them buddy, they still won't believe that Kappa
13 Jan 2017, 22:27 PM
#37
avatar of vasa1719

Posts: 2635 | Subs: 4

Permanently Banned


Molotovs are actually really good if you use them against charging squads while you´re in cover. Just drop it in front of you cover and wait til they burn or have to fall back.


Also if you don´t charge with squads into no cover to throw them they are really good. For 15 munnition they counter garrisons and also squads in cover if you´re in mid range combat. Soviets also have oraaah. You have to use your conscripts together to help each other and molotovs are only there to counter, what conscripts alone cannot. They were never meant to be strong as other grenades. They were mean to be cheap garrison/green cover counter that is used in conjuction with oraah and other conscripts.


So why grens and folks need rush cons, if thay are better in long distance ? If cons are in cover no need to rush. For 15 muni tahy are good, maybe to good, but problem are with speed of throw. If axis side have argument that ppl dodge flame nade vs garnizone units, so dodge molotovs are more easy.
How cons are cheap, same price like grens, 3 model of cons = 60 mp, 2 model of grens = 60 mp, 5 model of cons = 100 mp, 3 model of grens = 90 mp. So answer me, if cons are cheap, grens must be cheap too ?
Really good are penals with falmer, riflman with bars and nades, some part of nades, but not lolotovs.
13 Jan 2017, 22:32 PM
#38
avatar of skemshead

Posts: 611

Edit : After some more thought ( too much actually ) and some more ingame testing I have come to the decision that there is no good solution ( regarding ptrs penals ). Adding upgrades for ptrs/flamers is probably going to be too demanding manpower wise, whilst on the flip side giving penals muni only ptrs/flamer upgrades offers too much utility and simplicity.

13 Jan 2017, 23:27 PM
#39
avatar of Tiger Baron

Posts: 3145 | Subs: 2

Since when does the MG fire "phosphorous rounds"? They're either incendiary rounds or Armor Piercing, white phosphorous was only used by American and British units, while the Brits really loved their incendiary bombs.
13 Jan 2017, 23:54 PM
#40
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4



Molotovs are actually really good if you use them against charging squads while you´re in cover. Just drop it in front of you cover and wait til they burn or have to fall back.


Also if you don´t charge with squads into no cover to throw them they are really good. For 15 munnition they counter garrisons and also squads in cover if you´re in mid range combat. Soviets also have oraaah. You have to use your conscripts together to help each other and molotovs are only there to counter, what conscripts alone cannot. They were never meant to be strong as other grenades. They were mean to be cheap garrison/green cover counter that is used in conjuction with oraah and other conscripts.

I dunno they are still slow as shit and easy to dodge, with a non-negligible fuel cost.

I would like to see them buff the direct damage from the explosion from 10 -> 30, to keep it distinct from the volks incendiary nade which is quick and weaker.
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