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What was, bar none, THE most busted unit in CoH2 history?

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10 May 2022, 23:10 PM
#21
avatar of Kurobane

Posts: 643

Soviet Windustry



Soviet Industry wasn't even that bad.

For those who are unaware Relic was trying to make commanders that offered different playstyles. Soviet Industry was a passive that converted 30% of your manpower into fuel. If you basically sat AFK and didn't make any units you could rush out vehicles really quickly but you sacrificed map control and was manpower starved the whole match.

All you had to do was spam teller mines, get a Panzershrek Panzer Gren Squad and you were good.

It was annoying more than anything as it was basically the noob strat of the day like the current Pathfinder spam you see now. If you were aggressive early on you would have more map control and could bully them early on since they had no manpower so if they wanted to hold a point they would pay heavy for it. It wasn't a bad idea but putting it on a $10 DLC Commander didn't help its case at all. As people felt it was pay to win. Anything that wildly changes a faction like that should be a part of stock faction.

Like imagine if UKF could only unlock Hammer upgrade with a DLC paid commander. It is not going to go well with the community.




11 May 2022, 00:44 AM
#22
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 2760 | Subs: 4




Soviet Industry wasn't even that bad.




Conscripts were only 200mp then and it was very easy to trade efficiently with the sandbags. Dont forget about the 240mp maxims that were 15mp to reinforce to allow for manpower efficient static play.

Yes you were at a disadvantage for a few minutes but unless you failed horribly with your infantry, you had a T34 or T70 (with crush) out by the time your opponent finished building his t2 structure. You also cant "spam" tellers in first 4min, and even if you could then it's no rocket science to put a sweeper near your tank
11 May 2022, 00:50 AM
#23
avatar of Katukov

Posts: 761 | Subs: 1



Conscripts were only 200mp then and it was very easy to trade efficiently with the sandbags.


haha they would never again repeat such blunder in the future, right? ("we have new units", "our forces increase")
11 May 2022, 08:12 AM
#24
avatar of Applejack

Posts: 353

Oh man, if we're talking about OP stuff. Here's a list.

You were probably around for IL-2/T-34 ram combo. It wasn't OP per say but it was a high risk, high reward for a big swing in either direction. Either an enemy heavy tank died or you were out 250 muni and a T-34. Heavies were pretty powerful but they all had the weakness of dying to this combo.

Now going farther back. When Rifle Commander was released, the E8 was an insanely good tank. It was super accurate on the move and the AoE on the shell shredded infantry. You could run circles around enemy squads and still blast them with every E8 shot. Really fun to play until the E8 ran into a mine.

You used to be able to do call-ins on enemy home bases. So you would see artillery or loiters on your base sometimes if you were losing particularly hard. The worst abuser was the OKW tactical nuke from OKW Salvage Doctrine (iirc). Back in the day OKW had lower munitions and fuel income but their OST allies could build caches to up their income. OKW players using this would save up about 600+ munitions then call in the arty barrage on their base (most of the time on USF) and destroy their entire base with one click. It was pretty nuts. You can actually see it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rp6gleSyDw

Penals used to get flamers (as someone mentioned) which was amazing on them because of the high member count and the already high AI damage. HOWEVER flamers back in the day had a random chance of exploding and killing units if being shot at.

Volk shrek blobs used to be a mainstay of the OKW army. They always had 3 volk squads with shrek upgrades which would counter any vehicle that allies could throw at them. What also sucked is back in the day, calliope wasn't in the game so only Soviets had rocket arty to counter these shrek blobs.Volk shrek blobs were insanely durable but also bled MP like crazy for the OKW player.

USF Riflemen used to have smoke grenade so they could self smoke MGs. What usually happened though was 2 Riflemen squads would hit an MG, one to smoke, and one to push up and throw grenade. Although 1 squad could do it themselves. I think MG42/34 suppression was upped so that 1 squad couldn't do it alone.

Up until recently, Soviet 120mm was basically a broken unit that didn't work for its price. The barrage took longer to fire than the autofire and the AoE was non-existent. Then it got fixed and then nerfed.

OST Close Air Support doctrine used to be insanely good. It had a button that let you instantly convert MP (then eventually fuel) to munitions, no pickup required. It had a anti-infantry strafing run call-in and an anti-armour strafe call-in. No one ever used the anti-infantry strafe because the anti-armour strafe destroyed infantry better than it damaged tanks. So you would have OST players just constantly calling in anti-armour strafes on infantry.

I'm trying to think of other stuff that was broken that come to mind but I think most of the stuff was mentioned like Tiger Ace and ISU-152 HE shells.
11 May 2022, 08:49 AM
#25
avatar of OKSpitfire

Posts: 123

Oh man, if we're talking about OP stuff. Here's a list.

You were probably around for IL-2/T-34 ram combo. It wasn't OP per say but it was a high risk, high reward for a big swing in either direction. Either an enemy heavy tank died or you were out 250 muni and a T-34. Heavies were pretty powerful but they all had the weakness of dying to this combo.

Now going farther back. When Rifle Commander was released, the E8 was an insanely good tank. It was super accurate on the move and the AoE on the shell shredded infantry. You could run circles around enemy squads and still blast them with every E8 shot. Really fun to play until the E8 ran into a mine.

You used to be able to do call-ins on enemy home bases. So you would see artillery or loiters on your base sometimes if you were losing particularly hard. The worst abuser was the OKW tactical nuke from OKW Salvage Doctrine (iirc). Back in the day OKW had lower munitions and fuel income but their OST allies could build caches to up their income. OKW players using this would save up about 600+ munitions then call in the arty barrage on their base (most of the time on USF) and destroy their entire base with one click. It was pretty nuts. You can actually see it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rp6gleSyDw

Penals used to get flamers (as someone mentioned) which was amazing on them because of the high member count and the already high AI damage. HOWEVER flamers back in the day had a random chance of exploding and killing units if being shot at.

Volk shrek blobs used to be a mainstay of the OKW army. They always had 3 volk squads with shrek upgrades which would counter any vehicle that allies could throw at them. What also sucked is back in the day, calliope wasn't in the game so only Soviets had rocket arty to counter these shrek blobs.Volk shrek blobs were insanely durable but also bled MP like crazy for the OKW player.

USF Riflemen used to have smoke grenade so they could self smoke MGs. What usually happened though was 2 Riflemen squads would hit an MG, one to smoke, and one to push up and throw grenade. Although 1 squad could do it themselves. I think MG42/34 suppression was upped so that 1 squad couldn't do it alone.

Up until recently, Soviet 120mm was basically a broken unit that didn't work for its price. The barrage took longer to fire than the autofire and the AoE was non-existent. Then it got fixed and then nerfed.

OST Close Air Support doctrine used to be insanely good. It had a button that let you instantly convert MP (then eventually fuel) to munitions, no pickup required. It had a anti-infantry strafing run call-in and an anti-armour strafe call-in. No one ever used the anti-infantry strafe because the anti-armour strafe destroyed infantry better than it damaged tanks. So you would have OST players just constantly calling in anti-armour strafes on infantry.

I'm trying to think of other stuff that was broken that come to mind but I think most of the stuff was mentioned like Tiger Ace and ISU-152 HE shells.


As someone who played the original game to death, but not so much coh 2 until pretty recently, i am loving this thread. I have no previous knowledge of any of this stuff. Its a fun read.
11 May 2022, 10:03 AM
#26
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 890

jump backJump back to quoted post10 May 2022, 19:28 PMKatukov


they should add this back in tbh




their forward HQs still repair emplacements btw


Right, because ppl weren't screaming enough about it before. Unknown to most players, this commander does in fact counter LEFHs as well ever since the Assault officer got the (hard to shoot down version) recon pass at vet I.

I thought it was just for vehicles, but turns out you're right. Huh, I thought it was gone when ppl stopped spamming fwd hqs near their emplacements with this commander. Though I vaguely recall a repair search radius nerf(?) that may have had something to do with that. Anyway, at least the autocounter-all-arty at 3 CP was heavily nerfed and then removed. Iirc it used to kill even rocket arty. No more 130% hp bofors and mortar pits, tyvm.
11 May 2022, 10:58 AM
#27
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 990 | Subs: 1

Guards and shocktroops available at 1CP, after CP value change. Meaning that old 1CP became 2CP, effectively making shocktroops and guards having half CP timing.

11 May 2022, 11:08 AM
#28
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 2101 | Subs: 2

Guards and shocktroops available at 1CP, after CP value change. Meaning that old 1CP became 2CP, effectively making shocktroops and guards having half CP timing.



The Shock Troops had another feature. They started with Mosin rifles and bought PPSh-41.
11 May 2022, 11:25 AM
#29
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 990 | Subs: 1


The Shock Troops had another feature. They started with Mosin rifles and bought PPSh-41.


Yeah, remember that. But I think they had shitty mosins so PPSH was a mandatory upgrade, yet, I remember that people placed them behind sandbags on VPs or close to them and it was literally almost impossible to force them out, because of their armor.
11 May 2022, 11:29 AM
#30
avatar of DonnieChan

Posts: 2209 | Subs: 1

Don't you remember the patch in which out of nothing doubled the AOE of katyuscha and gave it like 4x the dmg`

Also there was a guy in 1v1 who did in every game stall and then get 4 lend lease shermans to overrun you. i forgot his name unfortunately. he did that for like 3000 games
11 May 2022, 12:10 PM
#31
avatar of Katukov

Posts: 761 | Subs: 1



Right, because ppl weren't screaming enough about it before. Unknown to most players, this commander does in fact counter LEFHs as well ever since the Assault officer got the (hard to shoot down version) recon pass at vet I.

I thought it was just for vehicles, but turns out you're right. Huh, I thought it was gone when ppl stopped spamming fwd hqs near their emplacements with this commander. Though I vaguely recall a repair search radius nerf(?) that may have had something to do with that. Anyway, at least the autocounter-all-arty at 3 CP was heavily nerfed and then removed. Iirc it used to kill even rocket arty. No more 130% hp bofors and mortar pits, tyvm.


the repair is nice because it essentially lets you prolong your building lives and not bleed extreme amounts of manpower on engineers that get dunked by the volleys of mortar and LEIG 18 spam

IIRC the arty was considered completely useless and so it was removed in favor of letting it have (i think) hold the line


and how does it counter LEFHs? what does it have in its kit rn? if support emplacements somehow persist until LEFH, which is a miracle by itself, they definitely wont exist after it starts raining down
11 May 2022, 12:15 PM
#32
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 2101 | Subs: 2



Yeah, remember that. But I think they had shitty mosins so PPSH was a mandatory upgrade, yet, I remember that people placed them behind sandbags on VPs or close to them and it was literally almost impossible to force them out, because of their armor.


This would make sense if there were other upgrades besides PPSh. For example, captured panzerschrecks or rifle grenades or something else.
11 May 2022, 12:21 PM
#33
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1183

Free Tiger Ace in 2013


youre the og man i love you
11 May 2022, 12:24 PM
#34
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 890

jump backJump back to quoted post11 May 2022, 12:10 PMKatukov


the repair is nice because it essentially lets you prolong your building lives and not bleed extreme amounts of manpower on engineers that get dunked by the volleys of mortar and LEIG 18 spam

IIRC the arty was considered completely useless and so it was removed in favor of letting it have (i think) hold the line

Not really. The fwd hq just gets targeted instead. It's a much bigger target, less hp, more resources have gone into it and has no brace. Easy target for rocket arty.

That version of CB had been nerfed in at least 3 different patches hence its little use. Day 1 version was a constantly on thing that basically ranged the whole map and came online around the time you could get 2 x ISGs.

jump backJump back to quoted post11 May 2022, 12:10 PMKatukov

and how does it counter LEFHs? what does it have in its kit rn? if support emplacements somehow persist until LEFH, which is a miracle by itself, they definitely wont exist after it starts raining down

Precision barrage. 200 muni guaranteed kill on an LEFH.

Sure a mortar pit can survive that long if properly supported. Hell I even got one to last the entire game on Ettelbruck vs ISG/mortar spamming Axis, with teammate help. Close calls but it worked. Katyusha put an end to their light arty.
11 May 2022, 12:24 PM
#35
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1183

More to the list:

- You were able to call-in loiters in enemy's base. Yes.
- Free Tiger Ace as has been mentioned.
- Plane commander for OST could convert manpower to fuel without doing anything (like SOV windustry).
-
11 May 2022, 12:28 PM
#36
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1183

jump backJump back to quoted post10 May 2022, 18:42 PMKatukov


https://youtu.be/8E5TtByIH5U


damn man you brought back nightmares I quit the game for 2yrs when I saw this happening to me
11 May 2022, 12:36 PM
#37
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13290 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post11 May 2022, 12:10 PMKatukov


the repair is nice because it essentially lets you prolong your building lives and not bleed extreme amounts of manpower on engineers that get dunked by the volleys of mortar and LEIG 18 spam

IIRC the arty was considered completely useless and so it was removed in favor of letting it have (i think) hold the line


and how does it counter LEFHs? what does it have in its kit rn? if support emplacements somehow persist until LEFH, which is a miracle by itself, they definitely wont exist after it starts raining down

It was not removed because it useless but because it fire on enemy artillery with no player input similar to Lefh ability.

On release it was even worse since it cost no munition only prevented building production. One could simply keep it on.
11 May 2022, 12:56 PM
#38
avatar of Katukov

Posts: 761 | Subs: 1


Not really. The fwd hq just gets targeted instead. It's a much bigger target, less hp, more resources have gone into it and has no brace. Easy target for rocket arty.

yeah emplacements are D tier/garbage because its so easy to pressure them and eventually destroy them.

the fQH will survive light arty but it indeed starts to struggle as you get LEFH and stukas raining down, and theres not a single thing you can do

Precision barrage. 200 muni guaranteed kill on an LEFH.

Sure a mortar pit can survive that long if properly supported. Hell I even got one to last the entire game on Ettelbruck vs ISG/mortar spamming Axis, with teammate help. Close calls but it worked. Katyusha put an end to their light arty.


the thing with emplacements is that they can survive only if you are in a supporting role to your allies, if the enemy focuses your army, you will be panicking to find any solution to the pressure you will have on yourself. However emplacements can be very hilarious to use because the enemy will, as if feral, focus all their resources to hunt the emplacements down. You can draw the resources, time and attention of multiple enemies by holding out as long as you can, attritioning hard so your allies take over the map

yeah, the precision barrage kills LEFHs, but i dislike these 200+ muni abilities because they come at several CPs later than the arty, and additionally have to be used several times to fish out all the arty
11 May 2022, 13:09 PM
#39
avatar of Oziligath

Posts: 187

the maps the freacking maps, that was a thing, stalingrad in 1v1, or sittard summer in 4v4 once or twice fun more the paaaain. it's not about the units but maps can really changes some units tbh
11 May 2022, 13:44 PM
#40
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1183

jump backJump back to quoted post11 May 2022, 12:56 PMKatukov

yeah emplacements are D tier/garbage because its so easy to pressure them and eventually destroy them.

the fQH will survive light arty but it indeed starts to struggle as you get LEFH and stukas raining down, and theres not a single thing you can do


the thing with emplacements is that they can survive only if you are in a supporting role to your allies, if the enemy focuses your army, you will be panicking to find any solution to the pressure you will have on yourself. However emplacements can be very hilarious to use because the enemy will, as if feral, focus all their resources to hunt the emplacements down. You can draw the resources, time and attention of multiple enemies by holding out as long as you can, attritioning hard so your allies take over the map

yeah, the precision barrage kills LEFHs, but i dislike these 200+ muni abilities because they come at several CPs later than the arty, and additionally have to be used several times to fish out all the arty


UKF can run wild until 8cp comes and axis have access to Lefh. Then the ukf player has no hopes of success.
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