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USF Airborne Company

3 Apr 2020, 06:41 AM
#41
avatar of Grumpy

Posts: 1947


I would argue it's not a super good commander either. There's a difference between being grand offensive and being a fairly competitive pick, and airborne is not either right now.


To me, it seems like a slightly worse Recon Company in 2v2. It's worse in 3v3 or 4v4. I like the idea of having the weapon drops be Pathfinder abilities and adding in another ability. The P47 always goes from OP to terrible and back, depending on the patch, and most of the time it seems buggy like some people have claimed. I'd rather have a copy/paste of the Soviet IL2 bombing run.
3 Apr 2020, 07:01 AM
#42
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3597 | Subs: 1

Airborne is a good mid-game commander but once late game is up, have nothing really to make it relevant.
Every time I see it used in 2vs2, if the player didn't manage to dominate his opponent before 15 minutes it is basically GG.

Recon Support is better in that way, butterfly bombs have great utility on the late game. It is better to use them to force move opponent support weapon and give room to your Jacksons than a P47 run that is going to do nothing for double price.

Imo this commander has always been a bad copy of Coh1 ones, it has only be relevant because of USF stupid design since the beginning.
3 Apr 2020, 08:47 AM
#43
avatar of SupremeStefan

Posts: 1220

Its "ok" commander but i like idea with offmap that kills howtzers. Usf should have more commanders with that option beacause priest commander in evry game (teamgames) just because u need somehow counter lefh is boring.
3 Apr 2020, 14:18 PM
#44
avatar of JulianSnow

Posts: 321

Double LMG paratroopers + Jacksons are pretty strong tho.

Might be an idea to change the troopers-drop to function like the Recon support troopers does? Changing the weapon drops to an ability of the pathfinders would open up 2 commander slots which would be a bit much imo.

Proposal;
Slot 1 - Pathfinders
Slot 2 - Paratroopers with 1x .50 cal
Slot 3 - Paratroopers with 1x M1 ATG
Slot 4 - free for new things (Time on target? or a the Sherman E8?)
Slot 5 - P47 Rocket strafe (replaced with the cheaper single run from soviets).

Might need shared cooldown on slot 2 & 3.

Though I don't often play as USF, as OKW however the RNG-ness of the P47 rocket loiter mostly scares the crap outa me. Can really fck up your tanks good.
3 Apr 2020, 14:32 PM
#45
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

Okay well, since this veered off into a full rework, let me put forward some ideas.

0CP - Pathfinders (260mp, 4 men, stationary camo, 4 M1 carbines with Volks Kar98 profile, 42 sight, reinforce beacon, Call in red smoke for Anti infantry loiter (like airbourne guards) or fake red smoke.)
1CP - Airbourne Engineers (280mp, 5 men with volks kar98 profile M1s, can lay M6 mines, trenches, reinforced wire, satchel, can upgrade with sweeper or flamer)
3CP - Parachute Riflemen (360mp, 6 men with M1 carbines, can upgrade with double elite bazookas or double M1919s, cooked grenade, can lay flare mines.)
4CP - Airbourne supply drop (400mp, drops a 30muni crate, a 15 fuel crate, an M1 AT gun and a .50 cal)
8CP - Air support operation (180muni, P47s strafe infantry, then rocket strafe spotted enemy armour, Airbourne riflemen can reinforce during this operation anywhere on map, 25% faster cap and decap)
3 Apr 2020, 14:35 PM
#46
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

There's just some things that are outdated, the weapon drop being 2 separate slots for example


I keep seeing this, but since both weapon drops are call-ins, the UI does not support putting them into one slot. And having access to both makes the commander very versatile because it allows to fully tech whatever tier (for LVs or the Pack Howie) is needed for the specific map or situation, while being able to airdrop the other tier's support weapon. Merging them into one ability that drops both would arguably be worse. So even if the commander needed anything (and I don't think it does), the weapon drops are not where the solution would be at.
3 Apr 2020, 17:29 PM
#47
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1


Merging them into one ability that drops both would arguably be worse.

This point has been made already, Armadillo offered a solution that has them as 1 slot but still able to be called in separately

The only reason I suggest it is because there is literally an overlapping commander (that many would choose over Airborne) that gives you Paras and a Pak howy at the same time


So even if the commander needed anything (and I don't think it does), the weapon drops are not where the solution would be at.

Do you have any comment on the bug that Marzianni pointed out here:


The P-47 rocket strike is bugged. The extra damage modifier it is supposed to get for damaging tanks is mistakenly and bizarrely instead applied to UKF emplacements. I made a thread on this some time ago and proved it did not function properly with tests.

I saw you asked him if he was checking the right stats in that thread, and he seemed to verify that he was
3 Apr 2020, 17:59 PM
#48
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4

Okay well, since this veered off into a full rework, let me put forward some ideas.

0CP - Pathfinders (260mp, 4 men, stationary camo, 4 M1 carbines with Volks Kar98 profile, 42 sight, reinforce beacon, Call in red smoke for Anti infantry loiter (like airbourne guards) or fake red smoke.)
1CP - Airbourne Engineers (280mp, 5 men with volks kar98 profile M1s, can lay M6 mines, trenches, reinforced wire, satchel, can upgrade with sweeper or flamer)
3CP - Parachute Riflemen (360mp, 6 men with M1 carbines, can upgrade with double elite bazookas or double M1919s, cooked grenade, can lay flare mines.)
4CP - Airbourne supply drop (400mp, drops a 30muni crate, a 15 fuel crate, an M1 AT gun and a .50 cal)
8CP - Air support operation (180muni, P47s strafe infantry, then rocket strafe spotted enemy armour, Airbourne riflemen can reinforce during this operation anywhere on map, 25% faster cap and decap)


You're taking out thompson paratroopers? The current saving grace of airborne?
3 Apr 2020, 18:03 PM
#49
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3



You're taking out thompson paratroopers? The current saving grace of airborne?


Lol forgot about that since I always used the LMG Paras.

Yeah I guess replace bazookas with thompsons.
3 Apr 2020, 22:12 PM
#50
avatar of Grumpy

Posts: 1947



I keep seeing this, but since both weapon drops are call-ins, the UI does not support putting them into one slot. And having access to both makes the commander very versatile because it allows to fully tech whatever tier (for LVs or the Pack Howie) is needed for the specific map or situation, while being able to airdrop the other tier's support weapon. Merging them into one ability that drops both would arguably be worse. So even if the commander needed anything (and I don't think it does), the weapon drops are not where the solution would be at.


Could it be made into a Pathfinder ability? It would be nice to have Pathfinders make beacons, call in weapon drops, and lay mines. I'm not sure what to do with the additional slot. Reserve armor, Easy 8's, or a Pershing would help greatly but don't go along with the rest of the theme.

Making pathfinders into bazooka experts (or whatever it is called) would be great also.
3 Apr 2020, 22:27 PM
#51
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post3 Apr 2020, 22:12 PMGrumpy
It would be nice to have Pathfinders make beacons, call in weapon drops, and lay mines.


Literally find me one source of US Pathfinders in Operation Overlord having mines with them when they dropped. Literally one source.
3 Apr 2020, 23:06 PM
#52
avatar of Sumi

Posts: 132





You guys are correct, my mistake. I mixed up sbps when checking in Attribute Editor.

And is it really worse to have 2? Target entities are chosen randomly, no? So if you have 2 scoped Garands in your team, there's a higher chance that either one of them will target the low-health entity.


I like this thread, also Pathfinders dont scale pretty good in late games since there DPS does not scale up good against vetted Axis frontline infantry and also their reinforce cost is high. So they are mostly an early help infantry and scouting infantry late game. Also what I dislike the most is their camo removal when they move makes the whole camo thing pretty useless. I almost forgot they had camo lmao.

But the two different air support option seems good and reminds me of COH 1 airborne commander. Ah those good ol days.
3 Apr 2020, 23:13 PM
#53
avatar of Sumi

Posts: 132

Okay well, since this veered off into a full rework, let me put forward some ideas.

0CP - Pathfinders (260mp, 4 men, stationary camo, 4 M1 carbines with Volks Kar98 profile, 42 sight, reinforce beacon, Call in red smoke for Anti infantry loiter (like airbourne guards) or fake red smoke.)
1CP - Airbourne Engineers (280mp, 5 men with volks kar98 profile M1s, can lay M6 mines, trenches, reinforced wire, satchel, can upgrade with sweeper or flamer)
3CP - Parachute Riflemen (360mp, 6 men with M1 carbines, can upgrade with double elite bazookas or double M1919s, cooked grenade, can lay flare mines.)
4CP - Airbourne supply drop (400mp, drops a 30muni crate, a 15 fuel crate, an M1 AT gun and a .50 cal)
8CP - Air support operation (180muni, P47s strafe infantry, then rocket strafe spotted enemy armour, Airbourne riflemen can reinforce during this operation anywhere on map, 25% faster cap and decap)



nice looks beautiful instead leave paras at 3CP, no airborne riflemen required.
3 Apr 2020, 23:14 PM
#54
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post3 Apr 2020, 23:13 PMSumi



nice looks beautiful instead leave paras at 3CP, no airborne riflemen required.


Airbourne riflemen = Paratroopers

I saw the US order of battle for the 101st airbourne and it refered to them as Airbourne Infantry.
3 Apr 2020, 23:18 PM
#55
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

This game really doesn't take history into account that literally. Pershing and Ostwind saw little to no real action as far as Im aware
4 Apr 2020, 01:43 AM
#56
avatar of CODGUY

Posts: 884

I will never understand why Pathfinders have to be so damn expensive and yet suck so badly in combat but that's most USF units in a nutshell.
4 Apr 2020, 02:43 AM
#57
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 784

This game really doesn't take history into account that literally. Pershing and Ostwind saw little to no real action as far as Im aware


20* M26 Pershings saw combat with 3rd and 9th Armored Divisions (1945), 310 sent to Europe overall before VE Day.

40-44 Ostwinds produced or converted between September 1944 and March 1945. Supposedly prototype saw service in France in September of 1944 and survived to supposedly see use in the Battle of the Bulge. Number actually produced is apparently unclear. Four vehicles saw service with 501st SS Heavy Panzer Battalion in early 1945, where apparently they performed well enough, though not versus aircraft.

Notable quote:
“…We drove in open formation behind the Tigers and Panthers to subdue enemy infantry. I was instructed by Peiper to support our infantry in house-to-house fighting. Several Panthers followed us to destroy any enemy tanks that might appear …. Peiper forbade us to engage enemy aircraft, our infantry was to defend themselves and we were to conserve our ammunition for the ground battle.”


Identification of use within other units apparently difficult due to lack of distinction with other flakpanzer models.

Sources:
Pershing
Ostwind
*Not counting one Super Pershing, which also saw combat
4 Apr 2020, 02:55 AM
#58
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1


20* M26 Pershings saw combat with 3rd and 9th Armored Divisions (1945), 310 sent to Europe overall before VE Day.

40-44 Ostwinds produced or converted between September 1944 and March 1945. Supposedly prototype saw service in France in September of 1944 and survived to supposedly see use in the Battle of the Bulge. Number actually produced is apparently unclear. Four vehicles saw service with 501st SS Heavy Panzer Battalion in early 1945, where apparently they performed well enough, though not versus aircraft.


Yeah I'd say both of those accounts qualify as "little action", especially compared to several other vehicles. My point is they are featured far more often in this game then they were ever seen in WW2

The other point was to be talking less about history in a balance thread, not more
4 Apr 2020, 02:59 AM
#59
avatar of blancat

Posts: 810

1cp)pathfinder : reduce cooldown the M1c garand and add camo bonus(+15% accuracy, 4s), add flare mine

2cp)paratroopers : 5 man sqaud, if paratrooper squad get Thompson upgrade, squad will be 6-man sqaud, 380mp -> 340mp

timed explosive charge muni cost 45 ->30

weapon drop is same

12cp) P-47 strike muni cost 240 -> 200

4 Apr 2020, 04:18 AM
#60
avatar of CobaltX105

Posts: 87

I remember we've had a thread or two going over the possibility of 2CP Paratroopers. Even made a test mod for it too.

Wasn't the general sentiment that even with their weapons locked behind racks and 6th man behind an upgrade, they were still particularly strong for 2CP?
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