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Fallshrims got completely neutered over the years

16 Mar 2020, 16:27 PM
#1
avatar of DerKuhlmann

Posts: 294

At first they could spawn in a building and could throw a nade immediately.
Then they lost that.
Then they got buffed a patch ago
Then they lost faust.

So now we got a ober squad with stealth.

Feelsbadman.
16 Mar 2020, 16:34 PM
#2
avatar of Muad'Dib

Posts: 355


So now we got a ober squad with stealth.


Damn. Sounds pretty good when you put it like that.
16 Mar 2020, 16:37 PM
#3
avatar of JibberJabberJobber

Posts: 1341 | Subs: 3

Wow, it's almost like their cheese is getting replaced by raw performance.
16 Mar 2020, 16:44 PM
#4
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1529 | Subs: 1

Yeah an ober squad with stealth AND first strike that comes at 2 CP and can upgrade without Panzer Authorization. So feelsbadman that I'm uninstalling. It was good while it lasted!
16 Mar 2020, 16:48 PM
#5
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2550 | Subs: 1

It's almost like the balance team wants the game to be skill based instead of having a bunch of uncounterable no-brain cheese abilities that win games.
16 Mar 2020, 16:57 PM
#6
avatar of Stormjäger

Posts: 2636

So now we got a ober squad with stealth.


Completely agree, the overlap between Fallschirmjägers and Obers is criminal, I don’t get why Falls were remade into this WH40K Terminator squad and then had any utility removed to be Obers clones. They even have poison smoke at vet 1 like Obers, it’s absurd. The rework of Falls is definitely one of the worst balance decisions in recent years in the way it was handled.


Yeah an ober squad with stealth AND first strike that comes at 2 CP and can upgrade without Panzer Authorization. So feelsbadman that I'm uninstalling. It was good while it lasted!


Learn to read, it’s not about Falls being UP, they are extremely strong, it’s about overlap with Obers and having no role different from them.
16 Mar 2020, 17:19 PM
#7
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2042


The rework of Falls is definitely one of the worst balance decisions in recent years in the way it was handled.


+1

Should have either turned them into a Commmando-esque unit or slightly buffed their stats. I never really understood why they reworked them the way they did.

I actually found the pre-rework Falls more fun to use than the current version.
16 Mar 2020, 17:27 PM
#8
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2550 | Subs: 1




Learn to read, it’s not about Falls being UP, they are extremely strong, it’s about overlap with Obers and having no role different from them.


I mean, the title of this thread implies that Falls have been nerfed into the ground. So telling someone to learn how to read doesn't make sense.
16 Mar 2020, 17:49 PM
#9
avatar of borobadger

Posts: 144

Falls are still exceptionally strong. Potentially still too strong
16 Mar 2020, 19:06 PM
#10
avatar of BlueKnight

Posts: 271

All the falls ever really needed was maybe reinforcement cost reduction to 32/model, but due to other doctrines being more meta, Falls got buffed to the level at which they had to lose the faust to maintain some sort of weakness. They are not obers, but they are not that far off.
16 Mar 2020, 19:17 PM
#11
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3217

All the falls ever really needed was maybe reinforcement cost reduction to 32/model, but due to other doctrines being more meta, Falls got buffed to the level at which they had to lose the faust to maintain some sort of weakness. They are not obers, but they are not that far off.


Falls had to lose the faust anyway.

They're a cloaking ambush unit with high close range DPS and a frag grenade. That means their only hard counter is vehicles.

Giving them a faust meant their only hard counter was medium vehicles, which was insane on a CP2 unit.
16 Mar 2020, 19:35 PM
#12
avatar of BlueKnight

Posts: 271

jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2020, 19:17 PMLago


Falls had to lose the faust anyway.

They're a cloaking ambush unit with high close range DPS and a frag grenade. That means their only hard counter is vehicles.

Giving them a faust meant their only hard counter was medium vehicles, which was insane on a CP2 unit.

Isn't this why they were CP3 infantry before rework? You could only reasonably fit 1 squad of Falls in your roster (unless you were wiped) and a single Falls squad pre-rework could not win vs 2 mainlines even when ambushed, so they could keep the faust because they weren't that OP and could be fought with infantry. They used to reward you by using them as ambush unit. Now as you can fit more of them in your army and they had their DPS increased, people A-move blob them (not anymore due to Grand Offensive Tiger meta in 2v2+). Their close range DPS was lower than that of PG and it was going down significantly with every model lost. Their current design is very weird not as unique.
16 Mar 2020, 19:53 PM
#13
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 3960 | Subs: 1

Falls were fine as they were before the rework imo. They had a high skill requirement to get the most out of them but the sky was the limit for skill cap. Then somehow we ended up with a unit that you couldn't make work poorly if you tried AND had a high ceiling... They used to be a really fun change if pace from the usual "okw infantry >>>> all else in every way into more of the same...
16 Mar 2020, 20:08 PM
#14
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 193

As a former Luftwaffe main, there were few experiences in the game as rewarding to me as seeing vet III/IV Falls force a retreat by merely appearing. That said, I do enjoy the firepower of the current version enough to make a pair of them a real danger to even a blob when ambushing.

They are not as durable as Obers however, nor do they scale quite as hard.

I don't like that they have to be paradropped rather than appear out of a building, but I suppose there's no more 'oh they spawn at base due to building occupancy' issues....
16 Mar 2020, 20:36 PM
#15
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 15216 | Subs: 7

The cheese was taken away, only whine left.
16 Mar 2020, 21:29 PM
#16
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 2929

Yes because falls are definitely terrible right now. Who needs a camouflaged infantry unit with good DPS at all ranges, a snare for some reason, +50% accuracy at vet5 for a-moving, and 2 of the strongest grenades in the game?
16 Mar 2020, 21:37 PM
#17
avatar of Alphrum

Posts: 671

lol falls are very a good unit and they can still be used to ambush and pick fights, i especially love to hold fire and wait for a sniper or an unpacked mg to come or any unexpected squad to come in close which u can nade too. They are a very good alternative to obers and i personally like what the balance team did to them.
16 Mar 2020, 21:41 PM
#18
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 765

Falls should never have been this ultra-high-dps quad-BAR 4-man squad anyway. Should have been a utility heavy 5-man stealth unit as I proposed ages ago.
17 Mar 2020, 00:03 AM
#19
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 7104 | Subs: 1


Isn't this why they were CP3 infantry before rework? You could only reasonably fit 1 squad of Falls in your roster (unless you were wiped) and a single Falls squad pre-rework could not win vs 2 mainlines even when ambushed, so they could keep the faust because they weren't that OP and could be fought with infantry. They used to reward you by using them as ambush unit. Now as you can fit more of them in your army and they had their DPS increased, people A-move blob them (not anymore due to Grand Offensive Tiger meta in 2v2+). Their close range DPS was lower than that of PG and it was going down significantly with every model lost. Their current design is very weird not as unique.


Because they were not close to PG, they were closer to been 4 man BAR squad, with more than decent/good long range dmg and with insane scaling but been glass cannons.
They were not an ambush unit outside of spawning them to kill snipers, support weapons or the odd Katyusha.
They were an aggressive Ober alternative.

The doctrine also had the unique niche use of trading munitions for mp (by getting a Fall).
17 Mar 2020, 00:15 AM
#20
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 3960 | Subs: 1



Because they were not close to PG, they were closer to been 4 man BAR squad, with more than decent/good long range dmg and with insane scaling but been glass cannons.
They were not an ambush unit outside of spawning them to kill snipers, support weapons or the odd Katyusha.
They were an aggressive Ober alternative.

The doctrine also had the unique niche use of trading munitions for mp (by getting a Fall).

All falls themselves needed though was ambush camo at vet 0. This whole rework to turm them into terminators wasn't. The commander itself was a bit on the weak side but at least it was fun. Could a combined the ability and strike together and added an ostwimd and the commander would have been golden
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