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russian armor

OKW faust and mg coming too late?

14 Sep 2021, 06:01 AM
#21
avatar of Operator09

Posts: 52

I just wish that the OKW to have a proper AT.
14 Sep 2021, 13:35 PM
#22
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2222

I just wish that the OKW to have a proper AT.


OKW and ost lack a lategame spamable allrounder tank.

Panther is good vs armor, but lack good AI, when you spam panthers, you stay there with 3 of them and try to kill one AT gun or ptras penals for ages.

you can spam p4 as okw..which lack HP and range and are eaten by anything lategame.

ost can build brumbars, which let you struggle vs any kind of lategame armor.

while all allies running around with their allrounder tanks Comets, T34-85 and Easy8. and demolish everything in their path, when be spammed.

14 Sep 2021, 14:06 PM
#23
avatar of Grim

Posts: 997



OKW and ost lack a lategame spamable allrounder tank.

Panther is good vs armor, but lack good AI, when you spam panthers, you stay there with 3 of them and try to kill one AT gun or ptras penals for ages.

you can spam p4 as okw..which lack HP and range and are eaten by anything lategame.

ost can build brumbars, which let you struggle vs any kind of lategame armor.

while all allies running around with their allrounder tanks Comets, T34-85 and Easy8. and demolish everything in their path, when be spammed.



There is just so much.....wrong with all of what you said.

14 Sep 2021, 15:00 PM
#24
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 757

They will not buff volks or rather don't hold your breath waiting. MG time is fine for BG but very late for Mech.
14 Sep 2021, 15:45 PM
#25
avatar of Operator09

Posts: 52

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Sep 2021, 14:06 PMGrim


There is just so much.....wrong with all of what you said.



What is wrong? in a late-game OKW is always hindered by pop-cap and very few units selections. Do you expect a veteran 0 raketeen to PEN heavy tanks late game? Which can be easily melted by veteran infantry because of its range?

With OKW fuel starved and expensive only option P4 who can't even pen a COMET or Easy 8.

Or a PUMA which has 0 armor and 1 HP?
14 Sep 2021, 17:07 PM
#26
avatar of Geblobt

Posts: 187

No. OKW has some problems, but the timing of faust and mg is for sure not one of them.
14 Sep 2021, 17:10 PM
#27
avatar of Descolata

Posts: 480



OKW and ost lack a lategame spamable allrounder tank.

Panther is good vs armor, but lack good AI, when you spam panthers, you stay there with 3 of them and try to kill one AT gun or ptras penals for ages.

you can spam p4 as okw..which lack HP and range and are eaten by anything lategame.

ost can build brumbars, which let you struggle vs any kind of lategame armor.

while all allies running around with their allrounder tanks Comets, T34-85 and Easy8. and demolish everything in their path, when be spammed.



Panther has solid AI, especially if you Sit on them. All pintles ramp rapidly with range, so just sit on top of the AT gun and it will die. Or get a SZF. You know. The non-doc anti-blob tool.

OKW P4s are AMAZING, with massive initial armor that can bounce M36 shots and that classic P4 gun, which has best-in-class AI and AT. WITH either a pintle or doctrinal commander. Jesus.

Brumbars annihilate infantry and team weapons... what's the problem?

What all-rounder tanks? All 3 of those get spanked by Panthers and Tigers. 2 Vet 1 E8s are needed to kill 1 Panther and they have very similar AI due to a quirk of how AI AoE works, the T-34/85 is pretty much a P4J with health instead of armor (thats why its SO GOOD). Comet comes super late, and lost much of its AI bleed in a previous patch. It has Cromwell grade AI.

Just.... build Panthers late game. Maybe pick a commander with Tank Commander so you can artillery AT guns.

And everyone loses if fuel starved. Period. Its a reason I prefer 3v3, it has the highest rate of safe Fuels in the game.
14 Sep 2021, 17:29 PM
#28
avatar of Mr Carmine

Posts: 1139



What is wrong? in a late-game OKW is always hindered by pop-cap and very few units selections. Do you expect a veteran 0 raketeen to PEN heavy tanks late game? Which can be easily melted by veteran infantry because of its range?

With OKW fuel starved and expensive only option P4 who can't even pen a COMET or Easy 8.

Or a PUMA which has 0 armor and 1 HP?


Wfa have imo always been spam faction regarding mainlines. Esp okw had/has an easy time spamming, this creates a idea that no other units are viable.

I woudnt call okw fuel starved. In the sense you dont loose many vehicles generaly as okw. Their stock vehicles imo generate the most value out of all stock vehicle options. The are very sturdy with high armour and high hp and good speed and
good damage.

The (okw) p4 has a better chance of penning a comet then the t34 has to pen a panther. Also both p4's have a greater one hit kill radius then the cromwell and t34. Nothing strange or up here. You cant have everything on one unit.

Okw has the insta supress mg34 and flaktrack to protect the raketten wich can retreat from inf who generaly dont excel at long range combat.

The raketten is cheap t0 atgun with retreat and garrisson. You cant expect it to reliably pen allied heavies. Okw has the panther and kt for that.
14 Sep 2021, 18:27 PM
#30
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 757



Okw has the insta supress mg34

:rofl::rofl::rofl:
14 Sep 2021, 18:33 PM
#31
avatar of donofsandiego

Posts: 307


OKW and ost lack a lategame spamable allrounder tank.


But that's not OST or OKW's faction design. Spammable generalist tanks are SOV's hallmark. In return for not having that, they get specialist tanks that are better in a specific role. You use them in conjunction to each other. Spamming one tank only is not how Axis armor beats Allied armor.

(Coincidentally one of these is also a cheap AT tank built from T3 that can trade with said generalist tanks by being the exact same fuel cost or less. Yes, I'm talking about the 90 fuel StUG)

Panther is good vs armor, but lack good AI, when you spam panthers, you stay there with 3 of them and try to kill one AT gun or ptras penals for ages.


As others have already pointed out this isn't necessarily the case when it comes to isolated teamweapons. However, in the case that they're stacking up teamweapons OKW gets access to the Stuka which goofs on them with a little effort.
14 Sep 2021, 18:56 PM
#32
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3233 | Subs: 1


:rofl::rofl::rofl:

More words, fewer emojis. This isn't the shoutbox

Not sure what you're laughing at anyway cause the mg34 suppresses very fast compared to some other MGs...
Pip
14 Sep 2021, 19:24 PM
#33
avatar of Pip

Posts: 1546


More words, fewer emojis. This isn't the shoutbox

Not sure what you're laughing at anyway cause the mg34 suppresses very fast compared to some other MGs...


Better than the Maxim or Vickers, worse than the 42, 50 cal, or DHSK. It's really not an "Instant suppression" machine.
14 Sep 2021, 19:43 PM
#34
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17547 | Subs: 8

Friendly reminder for people who still, after 8 years, don't know how to fight M3, especially now that its more squishy then butter left on the sun - PFs still arrive with ATG.
Pip
14 Sep 2021, 20:37 PM
#35
avatar of Pip

Posts: 1546

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Sep 2021, 19:43 PMKatitof
Friendly reminder for people who still, after 8 years, don't know how to fight M3, especially now that its more squishy then butter left on the sun - PFs still arrive with ATG.


While Panzerfusiliers do arrive with their Anti-tank grenade, they are, of course, doctrinal. Ideally you shouldn't "need" to use doctrines to deal with vanilla equipment.
14 Sep 2021, 20:40 PM
#36
avatar of donofsandiego

Posts: 307

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Sep 2021, 20:37 PMPip


While Panzerfusiliers do arrive with their Anti-tank grenade, they are, of course, doctrinal. Ideally you shouldn't "need" to use doctrines to deal with vanilla equipment.


Yeah honestly playing as SOV against an OKW without pfusies was just losing for them from the beginning unless they got a raketenwerfer.

Then again this was before the armor got removed so you couls still pull off goofy shit like drive into the enemy's cover to scatter them and drive away nearly unscathed.

EDIT: SOV T1 with M3 I mean of course.
14 Sep 2021, 21:07 PM
#37
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3233 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Sep 2021, 19:24 PMPip


Better than the Maxim or Vickers, worse than the 42, 50 cal, or DHSK. It's really not an "Instant suppression" machine.

It's BARELY worse than the 42/.50 cal. Sanders tests from a while ago showed this, Im trying to find them. Don't remember if the dshk was included

Also he clearly doesn't mean literally instant... It's relative, especially to the maxim

Edit: Haven't found the full test but here's a mention of how close the 42 and 34 are:
https://www.coh2.org/topic/86413/okw-mg-34-buff-but-not-the-way-you-think/post/725745
14 Sep 2021, 22:11 PM
#38
avatar of Mr Carmine

Posts: 1139

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Sep 2021, 19:24 PMPip


Better than the Maxim or Vickers, worse than the 42, 50 cal, or DHSK. It's really not an "Instant suppression" machine.


It was obviously exgagerated.

Still Mg34 supresses a lot faster then what allies generaly get. The tiny arcs dont really make the .50 and duska better.

I would think that the supression of the mg 42 and 34 being really close would be common knowlidge.
15 Sep 2021, 08:08 AM
#39
avatar of GreenDevil

Posts: 392

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Sep 2021, 19:43 PMKatitof
Friendly reminder for people who still, after 8 years, don't know how to fight M3, especially now that its more squishy then butter left on the sun - PFs still arrive with ATG.


Friendly reminder - suggesting doctrinal counters to a non-doctrinal unit is a useless suggestion and worthy of such responses you are receiving.

To the OP, you must learn how to factor a roketen in to your build when facing M3 flamer play from Soviets.
15 Sep 2021, 16:28 PM
#40
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5268

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Sep 2021, 14:06 PMGrim


There is just so much.....wrong with all of what you said.



always is
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