yes, but theyre still a 4 man SMG squad that MUST get into close quarters to deal any form of damage. Once they spawn and retreat back to base, theyll struggle as regular troops on the battlefield. its very difficult for them to close the distance since you can focus them down. -17% honestly isnt very much for a 4 man squad. losing even one model means a whopping 25% decrease in dps.
This. Seconded.
Take into account that before, when only a handful of people used partisans, no axis player ever felt the need of looking behind their front line apart from the occasional paratrooper landing. But now finally the partisans pack a little more punch the "OP-OP calling" starts, and the worst thing is, a very predictable one at that. So lets take this 'new' situation axis players will find themselves in into consideration.
The "lazy" (before replying watch those quotation marks there) axis never had to deal with troops operating behind the line, having to get real close before doing some damage, otherwise quite unuseful troops before. Even in my earliest (and I have played tons of matches using partisans) use of these guys I had to ubermicro them and not use them as a combat unit to make them work. Back then they could not capture points at all, were (and still are) very fragile. Even a grenadier looking angry at them made them start dropping models. It was very hard to make them useful, only having some limited use in very specific situation only encounterable in 3v3 4v4's. Every partisan fielded behind enemy lines was a missing soviet squad on the frontline.
Their armor still sucks. they die like flies and most people tend to use them incorrectly and inefficiently. They finally do some damage, people use them properly and all axis camp starts barking and throwing in all the numbers to back up their case. While in all honesty, you should look behind the hurts of our collective butts and see that maybe these guys were very underpowered before.
Taking this into consideration I do not mind a small but noticeable nerf in their damage output. for their smg's.
And it's been less than 24 hours. I mean. Really people? Seriously? |
I don't think we can say much about it right now and there's no need for specualtions about it. We'll find out how it will be at the release. Until then let's just be happy with the good and interesting stuff we have right now. 
This. People can take an example of you there mate.
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I like the idea that most people put out : let them drop in by airplane instead of being able to spawn out of ambient buildings.
I mainly play team games, and it is always a bummer when you have a problem defending your front line and these guys come and attack you from behind. If properly executed they are amazing units to turn tides in team games. In that regard, i'd rather not see them buffed in any way, except if they get their ambient-building-spawn ability removed. |
Something in this thread is high, but its not the time.
You're attached ranks also are quite undeniable proof that your problem is exactly between chair and a keyboard, not in the balance section(which you still manages to miss).
Your assumption about having a low rank which in your opinion revokes the right to be knowledgeable on a subject is undeniable proof of subjective and detractive reasoning. Don't play the man Katitof, play the topic post. And if you insist on this practice for future posts: As Aerohank pointed out validly, before you spew your reasoning on others, make sure yours is ironclad. Currently it's not even near a leaky sponge.
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While i do agree with you on your statement that you hardly see them in top tier player matches, I do not agree with you on the evidence being given by people having issues with them. If I have to believe all the topics with more than 4 pages of replies on them, people have issues with just about every unit or ability in this game.
Perhaps you like to expand your wish for love of these units with a similar allied unit, the partisans. How do you feel about them? Following your logic in them hardly being used, you see the partisans even less than the fallschirms. Don't you think they deserve some love too? |
thanks for that footage. Yeah its hard to spot and see but this situation in particular doesn't seem weird. Even though the sniper squad retreats through red cover, they ARE retreating which gives them sort of a received accuracy bonus against anything that shoots them (as all units do when retreating). The fallschirms are being instantly engaged by 1 penal squad with flamer and a regular conscript squad. thats 12 people firing at 4 guys that are on the move and try to stop 2 sniper squads.
However it does not support my point of fallschirms shouldn't be given some "love", it does support my earlier claim that in this particular case they were improperly used (as I see more often and sometimes catch myself doing when using them). This was an instance of unlucky building popping (in the middle of a frontline with enemy units instantly harassing fallschirms whilst hoping to get a sniper kill) .
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By design they are glass cannons... High damage no health.
Such a statement should be supported with empirical evidence. Assuming you have some of that to back this claim?
And on multi occasions snipers have gotten away from perfectly placed fall insertions..
I can't judge on this without footage. I would love to see some of it if you happen to have it of course. Then we can pin it to RNG, lack of skill, Nerfed units or any other reason we might find.
So I guess I'll have to disagree with all your points and side with what most of the posters on this topic say. They need love.
I can understand you have your opinion about them that they need to be changed. I am trying to point out my experiences and common facts about fallschirms to make a discussion on your opinion and show you other viewpoints on the matter that also should be taken into consideration.
Right now you disagree on all my points without backing your statements up with reasoning or logic. Or even not going into mine. You are coming to a premature conclusion which makes your argument invalid in the first place.
And just because the majority says so, doesn't make it true. of course people with similar opinions will be more likely to pitch in on a topic like this than someone who opposes it.  |
I love this unit a lot, however they seem to be woefully underperforming. I know they are suppose to be glass cannons, but their health suffers badly. I spawned behind some snipers a few times and I couldnt manage to kill them! I just don't know their deal... Maybe I'm just not using them correctly but sometimes they perform, most of the time they don't... Maybe they could use some love? Aren't they the most expensive infantry in the game?
I do not agree with your title or your statement. Fallschirms do not need love. They are not underperforming and here is why. I know better than to respond on these forums regarding the flamewars with all the usual suspects already have posted in here. But here's it:
I know they are suppose to be glass cannons
Where or who did it say they are supposed to be like that? Because they surely are not. They pack quite a punch, yes, but they can also handle some damage even tho of the received accuracy modifications to the unit. they do outDPS any vanilla / non upgraded allied unit on the field from medium and long range.
spawned behind some snipers a few times and I couldnt manage to kill them! I just don't know their deal... Maybe I'm just not using them correctly but sometimes they perform
On every occasion of which I used them to kill snipers they did. Flawelessly. Imagine the power of spawning a unit behind enemy lines that does amazing damage on medium / long range, can faust AND throw nades…..
Aren't they the most expensive infantry in the game?
…. Yes. They are expensive. but look at my statement above on why this is justified. Being able to spawn a unit behind enemy lines (especially in team) games that actually packs quite a punch (unlike the partisans who deserve more love if you take this topic into the same consideration) is supposed to be expensive in my eyes. Their potential is huge, but many people, including me on several occasions, use them wrong. The danger of dropping a unit behind enemy lines is that they are unable to cross that line when they need to (in case of a retreat, or leaving engagement).
In these regards I think the problem here lies not within the unit itself, but with the way you deploy and use this unit. When you accept the risk of dropping something behind enemy lines you automatically acknowledge the dangers that come with that risk. A 400 manpower unit that deploys behind enemy lines, packs a punch and can disrupt / distract the enemy, giving you more room to exploit a potential break in a frontline? Thats a steal. |
I agree with Corsin that I am not sad to see her go.
As I have just said in the other topic of her leaving from a marketing / communication / PR perspective she has only made the gap between community and relic bigger than it was. I have no actual proof of the mismoderation but i'll take Corsins word for it. it falls in line with everything else that has happened last year, community wise that is.
It's not an easy job that she had to do. But that doesn't make for a proper excuse to fail at it. |
Even though I do not know you personally here's my mandatory "I wish you the best of luck with your future endeavors".
The next bit might get deleted. Or the entire post. Lets hope this doesn't happen and there stays room for constructive discussion.
This next bit is less politically correct and more of a critique regarding the last year of relics community management. I do not know what the days over there must have been like for you. Maybe the mandatory office politics were in play. Maybe your job description was wrong or maybe you didn't just do your job sufficiently. It could be any of these reasons or another reason. We may never know because you might not (want) to reply to this next bit.
As respectfully as I can muster myself to write this down, In my opinion (and in the job description you had for the past year) it is stated as following that you "Develop and improve on current community architecture to drive engagement and interaction". It's literally the first thing it says on the job description. I can quote the other bits of the description aswell and critique you on this, but lets stick to this for now as it will be enough to make my point (as I hope, respectfully and valid). You have failed here.
In speaking of terms of the way that you have " driven" engagement and interaction, it seems like the bigger half of this engagement you drove was negative.
When someone complained, be it community influencers like Helpinghans, Barton, Jesulin or Luvnest with vocal frustrations over the sound bug, plane crashes, RNG, lack of marketing or the endless ravings of less known people on streams, forums and on reddit, it all seemed more often negative than positive. That's something you should have managed.
We get onto the next bit for that, called " interaction". Interaction is where there is reciprocal action or influence. And on this bit I find that you have failed to fully interact with the community. From a marketing and PR perspective, the theory of the ol' injection needle where one speaks and the majority listens this has changed drastically over time to a more balanced way called dialogue. But the way you have done your job looks a lot like this injection needle. You talked, we listened. There was no feedback, no dialogue and therefor in this current era where companies, institutions or governments no longer have the absolute power of communication you didn't go with the flow of current Marketing / communications mechanics. there is always a so called divide or " gap" between a company and it's customers or clients, or a brand and its fans. it was your job to make this gap smaller. There's a lot of ways to do this but the first way, 99% of the time is dialogue. Simple as that. Yes that takes a lot of time. Yes that is hard. Yes you can't just dialogue with everyone in this community but that doesn't mean you should not even try.
Like I stated earlier. Maybe you wanted to have more dialogue and didn't happen because of office politics, maybe the publisher didn't agree on it or maybe you just didn't care to put any effort in it. Who knows. The thing is, you failed in making this figurative gap smaller, and your way of "managing" the "community" (of which I am not a very vocal and a VERY SMALL part) and your style of one-way-communication may have made this worse. The gap between us, the community - and you, as the main representative for Relic is noticeably bigger than before. The amount of negative posts I see on this forum, on the official forums and even on reddit (not counting the you tubes here because that seems like a cesspit for bad comments) have only gotten bigger, more noticeable and harsher. Maybe the fault is ours and are the more vocal ones in our community exponentially more negative than last year and shout over the positive comments. But theres not theory supporting that to be honest.
therefor I want to conclude with this. I hope you are reading this with a healthy amount of self knowledge to at least muster a reply to this in and at least expressing your view on this matteror explaining the past year. Do not take this as an insult as it's not meant as one to you as a person, not even as an insult to you in your professional position as a community manager, but more as a vocal critique towards the way you have done your job the last year.
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