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Feedback for New Commander mod 4.0 - OST core changes

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12 Apr 2019, 18:43 PM
#1
avatar of Smartie

Posts: 413

hi guys,

here is the link for the new patchnotes:

https://community.companyofheroes.com/discussion/245822/new-commander-preview-changelog#latest

I especially like the changes to OST core units. The earlier arrival of pzgrens could be really help imo.

But lets test first and give constructive feedback then!
12 Apr 2019, 18:46 PM
#2
avatar of SeductiveCardbordBox

Posts: 395

Why in the love of all things holy have the OKW uncounterable maphack flares been added to another commander.

Give it a UKF style command building recon run. Let AA actually do something.


Misread, only within 60m. Still not impressed but that's probably residual salt. Why isn't it a plane, like the Brit Commander Building gets?
12 Apr 2019, 18:56 PM
#3
avatar of DerbyHat

Posts: 442 | Subs: 1

Why not give ostheer raid tactics as the recon ability? It's the USF Recon Support ability that gives extra sight to infantry and allows light vehicles to cap. It would have more use in a faction without tank crews and 55 sight infantry.

The observation bunker in its current state seems a bit pricy for what it does imo.
12 Apr 2019, 19:09 PM
#4
avatar of Aarotron

Posts: 283

Rangers seem to balance out a bit. I still think some specialised weapon upgrade choice could be good for them.
12 Apr 2019, 19:10 PM
#5
avatar of Kirrik

Posts: 467

>>IL-2 Rocket Strafe
>>A slight delay has been added due to the high damage this ability can deal to armored vehicles in a short period of time, before players can react.
>>Added a delay of 2 seconds before the airstrike arrives.

This was only usable on small maps before nerf, on all 4v4 maps and chunk of 2v2's plane already was too slow to ever hit anything unless you used it near the edge of the map

Now it's utterly worthless on any maps that are larger than 1v1 in size. CAS commander has similar strafe, with 1.5 sec delay, I've never seen it hit anything in my life after it received delay, even on small maps

Also, it's looking even more pathetic compared to PTAB or or IL-2 bombing run. At this point recon would be more useful that *this*
12 Apr 2019, 19:14 PM
#6
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 1333 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Apr 2019, 19:10 PMKirrik
>>IL-2 Rocket Strafe
>>A slight delay has been added due to the high damage this ability can deal to armored vehicles in a short period of time, before players can react.
>>Added a delay of 2 seconds before the airstrike arrives.

This was only usable on small maps before nerf, on all 4v4 maps and chunk of 2v2's plane already was too slow to ever hit anything unless you used it near the edge of the map

Now it's utterly worthless on any maps that are larger than 1v1 in size. CAS commander has similar strafe, with 1.5 sec delay, I've never seen it hit anything in my life, after it received delay even on small maps


I look at the Soviet changes and understand that it is senseless to discuss anything, trying to offer constructive proposals is pointless.
12 Apr 2019, 19:24 PM
#7
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 1521

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Apr 2019, 19:10 PMKirrik
>>IL-2 Rocket Strafe
>>A slight delay has been added due to the high damage this ability can deal to armored vehicles in a short period of time, before players can react.
>>Added a delay of 2 seconds before the airstrike arrives.

This was only usable on small maps before nerf, on all 4v4 maps and chunk of 2v2's plane already was too slow to ever hit anything unless you used it near the edge of the map

Now it's utterly worthless on any maps that are larger than 1v1 in size. CAS commander has similar strafe, with 1.5 sec delay, I've never seen it hit anything in my life after it received delay, even on small maps

Also, it's looking even more pathetic compared to PTAB or or IL-2 bombing run. At this point recon would be more useful that *this*


https://www.coh2.org/replay/89121/epic-2v2-commander-test-match
Taking out two Tiger Aces and one OKW Tiger (all three at 30-40% health) hardly seems weak to me.
12 Apr 2019, 19:32 PM
#8
avatar of Kirrik

Posts: 467

I've watched that game, all I've seen is mindless blobbing from Axis and afk-tier micro with tigers, which would've died to su-85 and at gun fire after ram anyway. And with 2 second delay those strike would've never hit anything in first place.

P.S. So rocket strike hitting afk/stunned tigers for 30% damage in health was determined to be OP compared to sprinting 5 man 2 schreck piss-cheap blobs and 6 man assgrens who have shock-tier survivability and can take on rangers and couple squads of BARmen after sprinting up and nuking nearby support weapons, really?
12 Apr 2019, 19:45 PM
#9
avatar of A. Soldier
Social Media Manager Badge

Posts: 2542 | Subs: 2

I don't see a reason why the Soviets get a forward retreat point in their new Airborne commander building while Ost can't get one as well in their overpriced Radio bunker.
12 Apr 2019, 19:58 PM
#10
avatar of thekingsown10

Posts: 97

The observation bunker is an april fools joke right?

This thing is total garbage for 300 manpower and 60! munitions for some flares??? LOL

Wehr need a field hq like soviets... or even better remove all field hq's from the game as its a broken mechanic or at the very least make them so they can be unhq'ed
12 Apr 2019, 20:02 PM
#11
avatar of Flyingsmonster

Posts: 125

Changes to Ostwind are good, but they seem like they will make it a little too good, but I have yet to actually test it yet so we should see.

My main issue with the Ostwind is that it takes too long to get it vetted up as well, so this will definitely speed that up.
12 Apr 2019, 20:04 PM
#12
avatar of DerbyHat

Posts: 442 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Apr 2019, 19:10 PMKirrik
>>IL-2 Rocket Strafe
>>A slight delay has been added due to the high damage this ability can deal to armored vehicles in a short period of time, before players can react.
>>Added a delay of 2 seconds before the airstrike arrives.

This was only usable on small maps before nerf, on all 4v4 maps and chunk of 2v2's plane already was too slow to ever hit anything unless you used it near the edge of the map

Now it's utterly worthless on any maps that are larger than 1v1 in size. CAS commander has similar strafe, with 1.5 sec delay, I've never seen it hit anything in my life after it received delay, even on small maps

Also, it's looking even more pathetic compared to PTAB or or IL-2 bombing run. At this point recon would be more useful that *this*


I tested it. The first rocket of the soviet strafe hits the ground 1 full second before the first round of the AT CAS strafe (5 seconds vs 6 seconds, about 200 distance from the edge of the map). Both last about 3 seconds until the full payload is delivered. The rocket strafe seems to benefit more from being dropped at the absolute edge of the map, shaving off another second (4 seconds before impact), while the AT CAS strafe stays at around 6 seconds.

The rocket strafe seems to have about the same time of impact as the CAS suppression strafe now.

I personally consider that to be fair.
12 Apr 2019, 20:11 PM
#13
avatar of Kirrik

Posts: 467



I tested it. The first rocket of the soviet strafe hits the ground 1 full second before the first round of the AT CAS strafe (5 seconds vs 6 seconds, about 200 distance from the edge of the map). Both last about 3 seconds until the full payload is delivered. The rocket strafe seems to benefit more from being dropped at the absolute edge of the map, shaving off another second (4 seconds before impact), while the AT CAS strafe stays at around 6 seconds.

The rocket strafe seems to have about the same time of impact as the CAS suppression strafe now.

I personally consider that to be fair.


Would be fair if this commander had some endgame armor, as of now it provides literally zero scaling into lategame. Why would anyone pick this over Isu+guards+bombing strike or IS-2+shocks+incendiary arty? Infantry is a cannon fodder by the end of the game and that commander has only infantry and support weapons with FRP, perfect combo to receive stukas and werfers into face.
12 Apr 2019, 20:17 PM
#14
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 12677 | Subs: 6

The observation bunker is an april fools joke right?

This thing is total garbage for 300 manpower and 60! munitions for some flares??? LOL

Wehr need a field hq like soviets... or even better remove all field hq's from the game as its a broken mechanic or at the very least make them so they can be unhq'ed

You are aware that command bunker exists?
Paired with med bunker, you have cheaper HQ like soviets, which can be placed anywhere on the map.
12 Apr 2019, 20:18 PM
#15
avatar of A. Soldier
Social Media Manager Badge

Posts: 2542 | Subs: 2

The observation bunker is an april fools joke right?

This thing is total garbage for 300 manpower and 60! munitions for some flares??? LOL

Wehr need a field hq like soviets... or even better remove all field hq's from the game as its a broken mechanic or at the very least make them so they can be unhq'ed


They already are, Soviet FHQ spawns with medics and has a slight buff aura around it if I remember correctly, UKF FHQ can call in Artillery, reinforce and so on. I don't see a reason why the Ost FHQ couldn't keep it's repair pioneers but have them reduced to like 3 or 4, and then just add the Radio Relay ability and a forward retreat point and be done with it.

Perhaps making an upgrade for an upgrade like I imagined it would be for the Command bunker is impossible so they went with the radio bunker instead similar to the Soviets.

Still each FHQ is pretty unique if you ask me, they could still do it as part of the Radio Bunker as well.
12 Apr 2019, 20:22 PM
#16
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 1333 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Apr 2019, 20:11 PMKirrik


Would be fair if this commander had some endgame armor, as of now it provides literally zero scaling into lategame. Why would anyone pick this over Isu+guards+bombing strike or IS-2+shocks+incendiary arty? Infantry is a cannon fodder by the end of the game and that commander has only infantry and support weapons with FRP, perfect combo to receive stukas and werfers into face.


And therefore, in my proposal for the Czechoslovak Corps was the IS-2:
- Soviets need doctrine tanks for more flexibility
- maybe a new commander with IS-2 will finally force the repair of IS-2
12 Apr 2019, 20:22 PM
#17
avatar of thekingsown10

Posts: 97

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Apr 2019, 20:17 PMKatitof

You are aware that command bunker exists?
Paired with med bunker, you have cheaper HQ like soviets, which can be placed anywhere on the map.


You don't ever play axis do you? the problem has nothing to do with med bunkers its to do with super hp buildings durability and wehr and okw complete lack of anything like satchels to counter it properly until late game.
12 Apr 2019, 20:26 PM
#19
avatar of SeductiveCardbordBox

Posts: 395



You don't ever play axis do you? the problem has nothing to do with med bunkers its to do with super hp buildings durability and wehr and okw complete lack of anything like satchels to counter it properly until late game.


Stuka Zu Fuss

Mortar HT flame rounds

LeiG flame rounds

Flamethrowers

Flame Halftracks

Etc.
12 Apr 2019, 20:58 PM
#20
avatar of DerbyHat

Posts: 442 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Apr 2019, 20:11 PMKirrik


Would be fair if this commander had some endgame armor, as of now it provides literally zero scaling into lategame. Why would anyone pick this over Isu+guards+bombing strike or IS-2+shocks+incendiary arty? Infantry is a cannon fodder by the end of the game and that commander has only infantry and support weapons with FRP, perfect combo to receive stukas and werfers into face.


I can see what you mean. I would keep the rally point purely for Engineers and make it similar to the pathfinder beacon. A free structure where only Airborne Guards can reinforce and that can spot nearby enemy units. All gimmicks like forward retreat point and med crates removed.

This would free up a slot for either mark target, fuel drop or recon plane, which seem like fitting options that can give the doctrine some more utility outside of better infantry.
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