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russian armor

Soviets needs a buff

8 Apr 2017, 06:12 AM
#41
avatar of miragefla
Developer Relic Badge

Posts: 1304 | Subs: 13


I just did a test, when t34 vs kt facing the front, only 2 shots penetrated out of 10. Not moving, T34 really is not a game changer, even you have more than 3. Unless you have endless fuel. The accuracy T34 has is really bad.


Not a good test, mediums almost never want to face heavies head-on unless they're swarming unsupported tank.

8 Apr 2017, 06:40 AM
#42
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1


...
I was originally all for this idea btw.
...


One can adjust both tanks and CQ units if there is need for. Losing a model the first second of engagement make the fights mostly rng.
8 Apr 2017, 08:16 AM
#43
avatar of Stark

Posts: 626 | Subs: 1

For T-34, can also make armor for the veterans, but no one will draw another model of the tank.

T-34 with additional front armor


you wanna give t34 a armor buff/upgrade for the tank that costs only 80 fuel and you wanna make is as strong and p4 (135 fuel -ostheer version). yeah let's make hords of unkillable t34s, That's what this game needs right now.

I would mind this upgrade as long as price of a tank would go up up up
8 Apr 2017, 08:33 AM
#44
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066


I just did a test, when t34 vs kt facing the front, only 2 shots penetrated out of 10. Not moving, T34 really is not a game changer, even you have more than 3. Unless you have endless fuel. The accuracy T34 has is really bad.


80 fuel tank vs 300+ fuel tank, what did you expect lol.

How about people just calm down, get used to Soviets now requiring effort to play instead of being an a-move heaven. If you still want to have an easy time with Soviets, just maxim spam supported by one or two penals for that nifty at satchell and then get those lovely t34-85s out.

Cons need a buff if anything..
8 Apr 2017, 10:06 AM
#45
avatar of Korean Jesus

Posts: 85

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2017, 08:16 AMStark


you wanna give t34 a armor buff/upgrade for the tank that costs only 80 fuel and you wanna make is as strong and p4 (135 fuel -ostheer version). yeah let's make hords of unkillable t34s, That's what this game needs right now.

I would mind this upgrade as long as price of a tank would go up up up

If T34 was free, I wouldn't even want it. Free xp for germans. It has 0 impact to the game, only usefulness is to ram other tank, and get it a trade.
8 Apr 2017, 10:08 AM
#46
avatar of Korean Jesus

Posts: 85



80 fuel tank vs 300+ fuel tank, what did you expect lol.

How about people just calm down, get used to Soviets now requiring effort to play instead of being an a-move heaven. If you still want to have an easy time with Soviets, just maxim spam supported by one or two penals for that nifty at satchell and then get those lovely t34-85s out.

Cons need a buff if anything..

My point is, this tank can't do shyt vs anything that is medium tank or above... And it comes at such late stage of the game. Pretty much useless...
8 Apr 2017, 12:30 PM
#47
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066


My point is, this tank can't do shyt vs anything that is medium tank or above... And it comes at such late stage of the game. Pretty much useless...


It comes at the same time as a P4. A p4 can´t do shit against a comet, pershing or an IS2 either.
8 Apr 2017, 13:19 PM
#48
avatar of Jubey

Posts: 22

I totaly agree for DP-28 upgrade on cons when you reach T4 this will solve a lot of problems
With this long range up cons will be useful in late game
And this up will not affect player who cons spam without teching

For me soviet vehicle is fine except the KV-1, KV-2, and ISU-152 who deserve a little up or maybe a CP reduction
8 Apr 2017, 13:28 PM
#49
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 1225

Cons have never been useless in the lategame exept maybe in large teamgames...
8 Apr 2017, 13:55 PM
#50
avatar of Grumpy

Posts: 1947



Not a good test, mediums almost never want to face heavies head-on unless they're swarming unsupported tank.



Most of the complaining comes from team games, where the heavies are never unsupported. There are very limited flanking opportunities so any mediums that the allies have will eventually end up facing heavies straight on. It makes them worthless which is why allied players make so much arty in larger games.
8 Apr 2017, 14:15 PM
#51
avatar of Jubey

Posts: 22

Cons have never been useless in the lategame exept maybe in large teamgames...


Yea that's why the few people who still use conscript in 1v1 try to finish the game as soon as possible, they know they have literally no chance during the late game phase with these underperforming cons

In teamgame the long range fight come very quickly, so there is no reason to use cons in teamgame, they are just vet fooder :(
8 Apr 2017, 14:27 PM
#52
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2017, 06:40 AMVipper


One can adjust both tanks and CQ units if there is need for. Losing a model the first second of engagement make the fights mostly rng.

I don't know man... there's still so many problems that would come with it. You would have to rebalance snipers, all anti infantry vehicles, mortars, grenades, even crushing probably, and unit speed would still be an issue, even if all cqb infantry was nerfed.
8 Apr 2017, 15:39 PM
#53
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2017, 14:15 PMJubey


Yea that's why the few people who still use conscript in 1v1 try to finish the game as soon as possible, they know they have literally no chance during the late game phase with these underperforming cons

In teamgame the long range fight come very quickly, so there is no reason to use cons in teamgame, they are just vet fooder :(

Actually I feel like in team games the ability to meatshield is pretty valuable for infantry. I'm not saying conscripts are fine as-is, far from it, but I often find that there's so much high explosives being tossed around that all your infantry really do is run around and cap anyway.
8 Apr 2017, 17:15 PM
#54
avatar of GenObi

Posts: 553

Actually i would say scripts are fine as is, they are suppose to be meat shields and keep them alive long enough they become super durable, dps is still weak but by then you should have either tanks or elite infantry pushing.

Honesty this is really more a OKW problwm being a little to good at the start. Wer and sov are exactly where they need to be and if anything we should bring the other factions in line with them

If we had to have a change for scripts, IMO and i think most would at least consider it is a slight price reduction like 210-220 so it also cost a bit less for reinforcing.
8 Apr 2017, 17:46 PM
#55
avatar of RealName

Posts: 276

Soviets are meant to have meh stock units, meaning they have to be reliant on doctrines, so it's fine right?

Oh wait... LUL M4Cs LUL Shocks LUL KV1 LUL doucheka LUL baby AT gun and now... LUL guards. RIP soviet.

I say, buff the damn soviet commanders(and not just the units), let soviet keep its flavor of being reliant on commanders. Now I'm not against buffing cons and t34 (I'd like it a lot, t34 has been ignored for too long), I am just showing an alternative to maybe potentially ruining yet more units *cough* penals *cough*.
10 Apr 2017, 02:14 AM
#56
avatar of Nano

Posts: 212

I got a good idea how to balance okw. simply by change the starting unit, volks start instead of storm pio, and give the difference in mp to the okw player. So cons and eng can actually have a chance to fight okw early.


I think if you did this you would increase the USF and USSR balance at the start but then you would really break the British vs OKW matchup at the start.
10 Apr 2017, 07:49 AM
#57
10 Apr 2017, 09:30 AM
#58
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301

Dunno, but Cons lack DPS in all stages, even PPsH's are not scary. Plus 6 men is a prize for any AOE.

And T34-76's lack Pen and Vision.

And the most terrible tool in Soviets - their nades. Guards, Shocks or Partisans - HE nades won't kill anyone if you don't make a blood offerings to RNG GOD. Just compare them to PzGrenadiers bundles.

Balance in this game is like
- Okay. Let's give BOOM to X for 55 carrots.
- But this would kill the balance?
- Hmm, right. Then we give boom to Z for 40 carrots.

If you don't get it. Most of Axis units, abilities and analogs are 10-15% costly but 50% powerfull. Thats sad.
10 Apr 2017, 09:38 AM
#59
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

T-34/76 has the same vision (sight radius)as most other units of 35...
10 Apr 2017, 09:39 AM
#60
avatar of ruzen
Patrion 15

Posts: 243



Since that time there have been some changes
-Sandbag nerf
-Mg 34 nondoctrinal
-Mg42 from hq and buffed
-Pgs buffed
-Volks buffed
-OKW full munitions and fuel income
-222 buffed
-Flamer Ht buffed
-Pios buffed

Most of these units counter conscripts and cons have remained unchanged while every change on this list makes conscripts less effective. Furthermore when the strat started cons had lower recieved accuracy amplifying how much worse they are against all of these improved units.

OP is correct in saying that Penals and Maxims were good but cons are meh. After nerfing the two units you could open the game with soviets are in a tight spot

That is a very bias approach to point out opinions.

It's not like OKW received huge amounts of resources with "full" income. All unit cost increased (fuel and muni) except Kubel while MP bleed threat still exists! 222 buff was necessary, you rarely see someone uses It and always blows up in seconds. Flamer HT is only a cheesy build It's like clown car build and both have solid counters. They are like Scholars Mate move in chess.

I would say Volks are closer to been balanced. It was much more stupid to trying to defend 4-5 squads of Volks with panzerfaust. MG was a really necessary change for OKW since previously, It forces players to pick one specific commander every game.
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