Profile of Vaz

The 5 year plan without income was such a great idea

Oh he got fed very well. It was on stalingrad, they parked the truck near the fuel and 2 of them constantly attacked the fuel sector. 1 of my ally was decent, the other not so much. There was some delay in my tech, but man I was surprised to see that JT so fast. I'm not surprised he had enough fuel, I'm just surprised he had killed enough riflemen to get all way there. That's just 1 game though. I felt this discussion was relevant to the goals presented in the dormant fbp that was supposed to look at the heavy tank destroyers impact on team games. I actually destroyed the JT, he didn't use it well, but even then I really couldn't gain ground because of powerful okw is in team games and the skill level of my team as a whole that game. If they were weakened I don't think it would be such a big deal that they could arrive kind of fast in ideal conditions.

Those are reference values, they aren't very good for actual in-game combat. How does that prove anything? There is cover, abilities, vet. All in the real game. The reference dps values are an average from one set of calculations, they aren't guaranteed.

The only thing this proves is a higher POTENTIAL for rifles to do well at close range. We all already knew that, but even then there are still other variables that will mess with these reference values. We don't just teleport to close range. Someone has to close in. Whoever closes in is going to suffer a dps drop, completely invalidating the reference values. Then there will be model losses, most likely by the closer. These lab values just don't work when we are discussing real gameplay, unless you adjust the formula for a wide variety of real gameplay scenarios. The best you can do with these reference values is calculate a long range battle, which of course is in the grenadiers favor, followed by volks.

You aren't going to arrive at close range on a volks or grenadier squad with just 60 munitions worth of expense. At best, you would need 15 munitions more to use smoke so models aren't dropped in the approach and your opponent has to be stupid enough to sit there waiting in the smoke to get hit by that 40+ close range dps potential.

You two have no proof that equally invested mu will result in allied win.

You guys supporting axis are outright lying on here. P47 was fine before the nerf, if the current stuka is fine to you. They pretty much did the same thing.

The p47 is NOT currently bugged. Relic intentionally set its accuracy so that will miss all it does. This used to be how the stuka was, it would miss a lot. Then it was nerfed and now it only misses if your vehicle is moving at max speed. If you are still in the process of accelerating, kiss your vehicle goodbye. It's literally what Vipper says is bad for the game, you click it and win. I've had multiple opponents do this to me in games. They just send a couple units into the area where they know I have vehicles (usually there is an attrition they are losing), they call in the stuka and I have to move way back. If I don't notice it, I will lose not 1, but multiple vehicles. No panther assistance, no p4, nothing. It's cheap and it cools down fast enough such that once I have been able reorganize after the planes have gone, that another one is ready for the next time I make push into contested territory. All they have to do is keep their munitions income up. Not very hard for Ost, since they actually aren't munitions hungry ALL game. They need about 400 munitions to max out all their troop held weapons, maybe some more for bunker upgrades, and better players will lay a few mines. Once into the late stages, they really aren't doing anything but calling in high skill off map attacks. The p47 is innefective against OKW since they start with AA and get good AA with that gun truck.

There was a little discussion about priest being an annoyance. This couldn't be more wrong. At least in team games I run into a lot of stupid allied players that will make like 4 priests and try to hit moving targets with them. That doesn't work. I do quite well with priest. OKW retreat to truck, they are getting bashed and the player is going to have to fuss with trying to move unhealthy squads out of the blast zone. You run over a heavy mine and are stuck. I'm going to wait a while for your repair technicians to come save it, then I'm going to bash it and kill your tank and the techs. You don't move your walking stuka or werfer? Getting pounded. Hogging buildings? Pounded. You put your gun truck somewhere on the field? Destroying that. The way I use priest, most people make pretty risky moves to drop it. My favorite is when I'm ahead in resources and they send a suicide panther that gets through, but I exit the priest. The panther destroys it, I destroy the panther, then I call in a new priest and recrew it, still got that vet. Priest just has it's place and it's not as good for using as an oh shit button for advancing infantry, like rockets are. Allied players are allergic to laying mines too, at least the ones I get stuck with most of the time.

Bottom line: If Axis players are comfy with current p47, that's fine. Stuka needs nerfs to bring it to a similar level and cost.