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I just played a second game this time vs OKW with Falls. Decided to go a completely turtle style of play and rushed the M3 halftrack and pushed up little by little using the M3 healing and reinforcement. Slowly built Bunkers/Howi/AT gun and forced him to keep poking me until I would catch him out of position and push hard with E8 game was slow and boring but effective.
The E8 really didn't push the game in my favor aside from the fact that I slowly blobbed them over time. The biggest issue is its consistency. It bounces shots when you don't expect, wipes opposing infantry off of random lucky shots, and gets its own shots bounced. It just isn't reliable compared to regular Sherman and Jackson.
To the guy I played, sorry for the boring ass game. |
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It has only been one game but this unit is straight up useless. I know I got a bad roll of rng in my game but I literally lost for trying to use it. I had control of the map for most of early game, opponent sw3itched to blobbing JLI to stall for P4J. Our tanks came out around the same time, out of a total of say 6 shots I think 1 penetrated. I ended up making 2 to see if maybe I was just being unlucky. It was more of the same. What is the point of accuracy if it doesn't damage the enemy tank. The game snowballed and I lost after that.
No big deal but at this point I am struggling to figure out what is the point of the E8, it cant tackle more than a P4 with side skirts nor infantry. The commander does not give you a way to get immediate wipes such as rocket art or indirect. The crazy thing was in my game I flanked him and got 3 or 4 wipes using 1 white phos ability. But I couldnt capitilize on killing his tank because my shit kept bouncing.
To hopefully figure out how to use this commander can the mods form a 1v1 tournament where they have to use USF and Rifle company when they play Allies. |
Ehh I think it would hurt. AT satchel becomes a lot easier to use if you add hoorah back to penals. That would be too strong imo
It could be balanced easily by making it part of the assault package which can lock out the AT upgrade. No yolo satchel. |
https://coh2.serealia.ca/
Relatively up to date if I'm not mistaken
I think hoorah really makes a big difference though. Really useful for getting behind an MG, closing on a long range squad, etc.
And in the end, just get shocks. They're just a better version of ppsh penals, whereas cons give more utility and a good discount compared to both
Thanks, I completely forgot about that website. Looking at the curves the Penals would hit harder early while the conscript would deal close enough while having better Vet3 durability. If I am reading the graphs correctly the PPSH upgrade is massive from short to mid range(16). My next question is if this is a single model DPS graph or for the whole squad? If it is single model, it would make sense to have at least one penal run around in a clown car as a chase unit.
On a different note why does OKW have better RA compared to Ost when they have larger squads? They always seem to float MP unless there are team wipes. |
https://www.coh2.org/guides/29892/the-company-of-heroes-2-veterancy-guide
This veterancy guide is up to date *I believe*. The penal veterancy seems up to date anyway
Penals don't get an RA bonus until vet 3, except from to the last man. Cons get a bonus at vet 1 and another at vet 3, and they always have hoorah. Throw in the fact that they are cheaper in every way, and that just makes them better at CQC
I believe penals get 6 shock ppshs when they pick up the crate though. So their close range dps is higher than ppsh cons, I just think they have a harder time closing the distance
Thanks. To bad it doesn't give starting stats unless I did not see it.
It seems Penal would be better until Vet 3 due to their vet 1 ability and weapon cooldown at vet2. Not sure if accuracy would make help due to ROF. biggest issue would be bleed. Do people make the graphs on their own for DPS for cl/med/far. That would be cool to see how it would change. |
what would something to this tune feel like?
penals start with a mix of ppsh and SVts (make em cheaper if needed)
-this makes penals more aggressive, but also enables them to coexist better with cons instead of basically replacing them. it synergizes with the clown car and also gives soviet more brazen aggression which fits the units inspiration
allow them to upgrade to either upgrade and replace the PPSHs with more SVTs or PTRS.
this keeps their versatility and still allows soviet to have a "standard" fighting squad
as for the airdrop SVTs.... they shouldnt exist. cons were never meant to outfight the enemy, they are supposed to outlast them.
replace that with airdropped medical- something the soviet will certainly want, especially if it comes early. replace the airborne hut medical with a strafe or intel or something else.
I like the idea might be too much to implement though. most of us are pushing for the penal "upgrade" since we assume it would be easy to implement. I agree about SVT upgrade, it literally lets conscript do everything at a semi elite level with elite level durability. |
Not to mention you do it with the call-in that puts SVTs on your cons. Using that call-in on cons is much more cost effective than using it for ppshs on penals. I also do not see the reason to make ppsh on penals more common, it's not super useful
But that is not a reason for making it option. Let me make the choice. Some people just want to have fun.
That's a strong ability to give another commander so we'd need to be careful about that. And there's not much reason for ppsh on penals, they're available enough already on other units, which are better suited for them
Cons target size (with vet) + hoorah makes them a much better ppsh squad then penals imo
I can't find the VET for penal hopefully you can help answer or point me where to look(What would be Penal squad specs with 4PPSH and vet). Wouldn't a penal in a clown car with vet 2 make a good chase unit. The VET would help its accuracy right? Also doesn't the VET 1 passive help? |
I just think you're downgrading your men with PPSHs overall for reasons already discussed (bleed on approach with expensive models etc.) Either way they're still grossly weaker than Shock Troops which will just make them get used less. We have penal PPSHs already in the Airborne commander iirc and how often do you see those?
It is an airdrop in exactly 1 commander that can also upgrade conscripts. I would like to see the drop in at least 1 more commander
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Penal have very high rifle damage and would be punished overall by getting PPSHs imho. Will outshoot volks and grens at all ranges. If you desire a squad with close range PPSHs, there's none better than Shock Troops.
But then your penciled in to certain commanders, or people just want something different. Also with the VET1 ability of Penals wouldn't it provide more synergy then conscripts which aren't really designed for it. Why is it such a problem when their is the jaeger upgrade that can be used by all of ost.
EDIT
As an example the new Soviet Reserve army with T1 opening would allow a complete army. The penals would be the backbone with options for CQC, medium range and some AT. The team weapon drop would allow for a weak hmg and true AT along with a commisar which could boost performance of troops and provide healing. The down side would be no prem med or heavy and heavy MP load.
Advance Warfare Tactics/Conscript support tactics could have 2 different openings instead of conscript spam. |
Its probably too late now for any suggestions because the patch is probably ready for release, but here's to future changes.
In the patch, both cons and penals will benefit from conscript repair package. This is a great change which adds versatility without making the ability too strong. It would be nice if conscript assault package got the same treatment where it would give access to ppsh for both cons and penals. Wehrmacht already has jaeger light infantry upgrade which affects grenadiers, panzergrenadiers and stormtroopers which is awesome and I don't see a reason why soviets shouldn't get the same privilege.
I have been bugging for this for 2 weeks now. |
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