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Let's speak about OST AT mine

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27 Nov 2018, 17:46 PM
#21
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1



So use more time to lay 2 mines that also can be hit by infantry unlike teller meaning u will never know its there unless u run over it with a tank and get it instagibbed or sweep it....

You can still get a wipe from a 4 men squad with the 2 mines so its far from wasted.
27 Nov 2018, 18:20 PM
#22
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

Daily reminder that we got Soviet demo nerfed because it wiped 250 MP squads for a little ammo price but its bad for ostheer mines to one shot kill 70FU 260? Light vehicles. And both had the same counterplay


Yeah I don't understand how anyone can argue with this. And demos even required you to pay attention, once the teller is planted you don't need to do anything.

No reason for it to one-shot light tanks.



I think you don't got my point: Tellers NEED to insta kill allied light vehicles because its the only real counter vs them. A T70 or AEC can just overrun a WEHR Player by flanking.


Please explain how a teller mine that left the t70 with a dead engine and 20hp would not be fair to Ost. Would it really be that hard for you to go over and finish off a dead engine 20 hp light vehicle? The 222 could even easily mop it up. Saying it NEEDS to kill completely is pure laziness.
27 Nov 2018, 18:27 PM
#23
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

I for one would trade the tellar mine for the OKW Schu mine.
27 Nov 2018, 18:34 PM
#24
avatar of TheGentlemenTroll

Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1

The demo nerf was warranted and was 100% needed. It’s ludicirous that people are saying otherwise.

27 Nov 2018, 18:53 PM
#25
avatar of Felinewolfie

Posts: 868 | Subs: 5

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2018, 11:15 AMNot
This beautiful thing can kill any light vehicle by letting them press on them. And this is just for 50 munitions. Why that easy for OST? Are there any factions that can destroy Axis vehicles so easy? I can imagine wehraboos crying that without their vehicle it will be GG. Just play allies and watch how one mine destroying half of your army capabilities in early-mid game.


Nerf allied units. Buff Axis units.
Nerf units that can wipe axis inf squads.
Buff units that can wipe allied inf squads.

Easy!

Game now balanced.
27 Nov 2018, 19:15 PM
#26
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

The demo nerf was warranted and was 100% needed. It’s ludicirous that people are saying otherwise.



Who is saying otherwise? I think the only reference to demos is to ask why the teller gets to continue behaving the same way but against much more expensive units.
27 Nov 2018, 19:15 PM
#27
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

Yeah I don't understand how anyone can argue with this.


Literally one argument: tellers require 1 sweeper squad to accompany the 1 light vehicle, to make them counterable. Old demos would've required 3-5 sweeper squads to accompany the 3-5 normal infantry squads spreading all over the map, thus demos were not counterable.
27 Nov 2018, 19:42 PM
#28
avatar of Thamor

Posts: 290

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2018, 15:35 PMLoxley

As Wehr player, I would always prefer spammable 30 ammo mines, instead visible AI minefields or 50 ammo tellers.


Amen and pretty certain 95% of Wehr players agree on this.
27 Nov 2018, 21:10 PM
#29
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1



Old demos would've required 3-5 sweeper squads to accompany the 3-5 normal infantry squads spreading all over the map, thus demos were not counterable.


By your logic, a t70/AEC/su76 is equal in value to 1 infantry squad. That's a shit argument, you're saying 90 muni to maybe wipe a squad (which you need vision to do) is equal to 50 muni knocking out a 75 fuel vehicle? No



27 Nov 2018, 21:14 PM
#30
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17880 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2018, 14:10 PMVipper

Use 2 soviet mines one next to other. It only cost 60 munition.

Why are you trying to separate players into Ostheer and OKW? Why are you being toxic?

You do realize infantry triggers them, right?
27 Nov 2018, 21:15 PM
#31
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

By your logic, a t70/AEC/su76 is equal in value to 1 infantry squad. That's a shit argument, you're saying 90 muni to maybe wipe a squad (which you need vision to do) is equal to 50 muni knocking out a 75 fuel vehicle? No


I'm not saying that at all, but I'm done explaining.
27 Nov 2018, 21:26 PM
#32
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1



I'm not saying that at all, but I'm done explaining.


You don't need to explain anything, you have no point. Somehow sending a sweeper around with your infantry is too hard, but keeping a sweeper on pace with a light ****ing tank is totally practical? No, it isn't.

Can someone explain what would be so unfair to Ost if it did 380 damage instead of 400? A stolen ptrs could even finish of that tank. In other words, it would require you to have something else in the area to actually kill it. Sound familiar? It should, because the old demo required vision for you to get the wipe (or a hell of a lot of luck)....
27 Nov 2018, 21:34 PM
#33
avatar of insaneHoshi

Posts: 911


It should, because the old demo required vision for you to get the wipe (or a hell of a lot of luck)....


Yes it took real luck and or vision to know that when that point begun decapping, there was a unit there ready to be blown up.
27 Nov 2018, 21:36 PM
#34
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4



You don't need to explain anything, you have no point. Somehow sending a sweeper around with your infantry is too hard, but keeping a sweeper on pace with a light ****ing tank is totally practical? No, it isn't.

Can someone explain what would be so unfair to Ost if it did 380 damage instead of 400? A stolen ptrs could even finish of that tank. In other words, it would require you to have something else in the area to actually kill it. Sound familiar? It should, because the old demo required vision for you to get the wipe (or a hell of a lot of luck)....

Comparing it to the demo is a joke, not even in the same league.

Yes, it is completely practical to sweep for one light tank compared to all 6 of your infantry squads at the same time. If you can't keep a sweeper up with your light tank then you are overextending, mines are designed to punish that. Deleting random infantry squads has no counter besides blobbing on a sweeper. Not good for gameplay.
27 Nov 2018, 21:36 PM
#35
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17880 | Subs: 8



Yes it took real luck and or vision to know that when that point begun decapping, there was a unit there ready to be blown up.


And this is where playing both sides gave you advantage.
If you were aware of it and opponent possibly using it, you entered capping circle from another angle.
Been there, done that. Demos didn't covered whole capping area at any point in time you know.
27 Nov 2018, 21:40 PM
#36
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1



Yes it took real luck and or vision to know that when that point begun decapping, there was a unit there ready to be blown up.


All you had to do too avoid territory point demos was literally not be an idiot and blindly click on territory points to capture. Just had too tell your squad to put 1 or 2 models in it, and you were fine. I still do that so that my opponent doesn't know what type of unit is capping the point....

And let me be VERY clear, I think demos were OP. If you think demos were OP you shouldnt have a problem with nerfing the Tellers damage by a whopping 20. It makes all the sense in the world, and is an incredibly minor overall nerf. I don't see how anyone who isn't super biased could be opposed to that.
27 Nov 2018, 21:44 PM
#37
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

You don't need to explain anything, you have no point. Somehow sending a sweeper around with your infantry is too hard, but keeping a sweeper on pace with a light ****ing tank is totally practical? No, it isn't.


Thankfully Tobis explained again what was already explained 3x in this thread just so I didn't have to explain it to you a 5th time.

Yes sending a sweeper around with infantry is too hard impossible when when you have 1 (maybe 2) sweepers and 3-5 infantry squads that need to run and cap all over the map ???
Sending a sweeper around with the 1 light vehicle on the other hand is very doable.

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2018, 21:36 PMTobis
Yes, it is completely practical to sweep for one light tank compared to all 6 of your infantry squads at the same time. If you can't keep a sweeper up with your light tank then you are overextending, mines are designed to punish that. Deleting random infantry squads has no counter besides blobbing on a sweeper. Not good for gameplay.

27 Nov 2018, 21:44 PM
#38
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2018, 21:36 PMTobis
Deleting random infantry squads has no counter besides blobbing on a sweeper. Not good for gameplay.


For the love of Christ, can everyone stop responding to way less important part of my posts? You quoted me and then ignored the only question that mattered there, what would be the tragedy if tellers did 380 vs 400? How exactly would that not "punish me for over-extending"? Still leaves a good chance the tank will die.

I will say it again, DEMOS WERE OP. I'm 100% in agreement. Jesus Christ please stop coming at me like I want them back
27 Nov 2018, 21:47 PM
#39
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1



Thankfully Tobis explained again what was already explained 3x in this thread just so I didn't have to explain it to you a 5th time.



And I will ask you again that where is this "NEED" coming from? You are implying that it is as important to keep every single squad alive as it is a 75 fuel vehicle?

If you lost a squad to a 90 muni demo, yeah that was cheesy. But boohoo it's a squad. These are t3 vehicles we're talking about, for 50 muni. Please stop emphasizing the unimportant issue here.
27 Nov 2018, 21:53 PM
#40
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

And I will ask you again that where is this "NEED" coming from?


The need was coming from the unjust comparison being thrown around that tellers should be nerfed just because demos were nerfed, while they are - because of their counters - not comparable. I was pointing out that the demo treatment is not a 1:1 argument/justification in the teller discussion because it is comparing apples to oranges.

Demos were broken, tellers are arguably not. Still, I think it would be fine to make tellers do a little less damage while perhaps giving heavy engine damage so LV can survive initial impact and possibly escape but will be easily finished off if fausts or any AT is nearby. This would give Allied players at least a chance to save their vehicles and require the Axis players to make an effort for the 1-2 punch rather than letting the teller do all the work.
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