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russian armor

Fall balance patch - Raketen nerf

22 Jul 2017, 20:54 PM
#1
avatar of Domine

Posts: 500

I was reading through the FB patch notes and noticed that the raketen got it's durability nerfed, without anything to make up for it.

Definitely needs to be reverted. I can't think of many units in the game which are as bad at what they're supposed to do compared to alternatives.
23 Jul 2017, 02:15 AM
#2
avatar of insaneHoshi

Posts: 911

Its not a huge nerf, after all the crew almost always dies right away anyways, so you dont have to worry about the nerf once you recrew it
23 Jul 2017, 02:20 AM
#3
avatar of karolllus

Posts: 172

For all of you interested in giving Relic some usefull feedback on the Fall Balance Patch Ive created a topic with 9 questions (polls). Show your support for the game by anwsering the questions in polls.

https://www.coh2.org/topic/62455/fall-balance-patch-community-feedback-poll
23 Jul 2017, 05:40 AM
#4
avatar of Waegukin

Posts: 609

Maybe give the Rak yellow cover? It wouldn't stop tank shells or anything, but would hopefully make them a few more seconds against small-arms before they have to retreat.
23 Jul 2017, 08:36 AM
#5
avatar of DonnieChan

Posts: 2257 | Subs: 1

Raketen hitting ground, especially with first shot, is one of the biggest insults in this game
25 Jul 2017, 07:05 AM
#6
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243

give okw a AT unit like the other faction. raketen can`t do their job for what they in the game = destroy armor. Cause they wipe in most cases with the first shell / easily through small in arms in no time.

the have not wide range like other AT guns...can only sneak around with no big impact.

ur enemy must very bad to lose a tank to raketen...or u must spam them.

the aren´t push armor away like other AT guns...the enemy laugh abpout them and wipe the crew with the first shot
25 Jul 2017, 07:34 AM
#7
avatar of Highfiveeeee

Posts: 1740

...can only sneak around with no big impact.




That's like the absolute best feature of the RW. You can cloak up, wait for a tank to eat the first shot and then you get a free engine damage with your nearby Volks. Also Finishing tanks that are being repaired is pretty awesome.
25 Jul 2017, 08:37 AM
#8
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243





That's like the absolute best feature of the RW. You can cloak up, wait for a tank to eat the first shot and then you get a free engine damage with your nearby Volks. Also Finishing tanks that are being repaired is pretty awesome.
´
'
yeah.,.i had some moments it was wonderfull to sneak around...but the most time it should push away armor...and it cant it in a effecive way...u cant tell me u sneak all games around and search after armor...it most cases (much more than 85%) u need a anti tank unit...okw lack much against armor since volks nerf. a puma? around 150 fuel?? pios? they are to expenseive and ineffective vs armor.

25 Jul 2017, 08:54 AM
#9
avatar of Highfiveeeee

Posts: 1740

´
'
yeah.,.i had some moments it was wonderfull to sneak around...but the most time it should push away armor...and it cant it in a effecive way...u cant tell me u sneak all games around and search after armor...it most cases (much more than 85%) u need a anti tank unit...okw lack much against armor since volks nerf. a puma? around 150 fuel?? pios? they are to expenseive and ineffective vs armor. I honestly think that Volks got a pretty good compensation with their Fausts.



I get your point. Of course I am not sneaking around every game but I think the Raketenwerfer is not THAT bad honestly. First it is hard at Vet0 but once it gained up some veterancy it is a killer. Even more since Volks got Panzerfausts. Before you had a T70 simply circle around all your troops and there was absolutely nothing you could do.

It is true that OKW lacks viable AT somehow but not in the early game. If you really struggle against light armor you can get a Puma that can also take care of medium armor somehow. Sturm Panzerschreck is also pretty good as you also Vet up very fast which means faster repairs.

Most of the time after I got my Flak HT up I go straight to JP IV. And you can't deny that it is probably the best Tank Hunter in the game.
25 Jul 2017, 10:24 AM
#10
avatar of Mr.Smith

Posts: 2636 | Subs: 17

Let's conveniently ignore the squad formations buff and the stealth QoL buff that the raketen received, and let's focus on the bulletproof crew, right?
25 Jul 2017, 10:57 AM
#11
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243

Let's conveniently ignore the squad formations buff and the stealth QoL buff that the raketen received, and let's focus on the bulletproof crew, right?


it doesnt help, when raketen crew die after the first shell from mostly every alli tank.

i seen other AT gun crews (sovjet ratsch bumm 76mm) which was still alive sourrended by 3 PIV which all shot 3 times.
RNG? maybe...but every time i seen raketen as allie player..i laugh and drive around them or kill the crew. pretty to easy.

tell us / show us a game where u seen last time a vet 5 raketen. plz.
25 Jul 2017, 11:09 AM
#12
avatar of Mr.Smith

Posts: 2636 | Subs: 17


it doesnt help, when raketen crew die after the first shell from mostly every alli tank.


The "nerf" described in the OP is removed the moment the raketen becomes decrewed. The actual buffs I described are permanent.
25 Jul 2017, 13:50 PM
#13
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1



it doesnt help, when raketen crew die after the first shell from mostly every alli tank.

i seen other AT gun crews (sovjet ratsch bumm 76mm) which was still alive sourrended by 3 PIV which all shot 3 times.
RNG? maybe...but every time i seen raketen as allie player..i laugh and drive around them or kill the crew. pretty to easy.

tell us / show us a game where u seen last time a vet 5 raketen. plz.


Except received accuracy doesn't affect tank shells just small arms fire... pretty sure you could give them .5 received accuracy and they'd still get blown up by tank shells just as easily. The stealh QoL buff is pretty big though for how much micro it eliminates.
25 Jul 2017, 13:56 PM
#14
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243



Except received accuracy doesn't affect tank shells just small arms fire... pretty sure you could give them .5 received accuracy and they'd still get blown up by tank shells just as easily. The stealh QoL buff is pretty big though for how much micro it eliminates.


than tell us why raketen crew dies much more faster than from other at guns? Maybe they get all the green cover bonus!?
25 Jul 2017, 18:03 PM
#15
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2



than tell us why raketen crew dies much more faster than from other at guns? Maybe they get all the green cover bonus!?


Old post copy paste

1-The AT gun does not provide green cover for the guys operating the weapon. You do full damage (i can't test accuracy outside of making a mod) either through small arm fire or explosives (grenades or mortar shells for example). Easy to check by either killing the crew with a grenade/mortar or activating the dmg indicator on cheatmods.

2-The AT gun ITSELF does create green cover and each of them has a hitbox (which can blocks incoming shots). The thing is, it's mostly irrelevant for the crew due to formation.
Check the pic (for some reason the rak 4th guy spread out)

So yeah, green cover on the AT gun for the crew is useless, cause a shell landing on top of it will kill the 2 operating guys and heavily wound the 3rd guy which might be nearby.

That been said, it's not worthless putting AT guns behind cover, cause that will protect the operators.


Hitbox on AT guns might differ (not to confuse with size) which might intercept shots but would still wound crew operators.
25 Jul 2017, 18:43 PM
#16
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1



than tell us why raketen crew dies much more faster than from other at guns? Maybe they get all the green cover bonus!?


Squad formations (addressed in patch) and the type of units it faces (HE Shermans, Pershing, Comets and the like all have good AI splash damage). Especially if you are comparing it to ZiS gun which has 6 man crew and theoretically some green cover from the gun shield.
26 Jul 2017, 06:39 AM
#17
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243

Once again: why cant we see a vet 5 raketen in some games? its like a vet 5 kubel or unicorn.

Are all player to dumb to play with it? or maybe...they die like flys?

i seen every cast from Danes propacandacast (about 1500 games)..but seen only 1-3 times a vet5 raketen.

all these players must be noobs, right?
26 Jul 2017, 07:39 AM
#18
avatar of Mistah_S

Posts: 851 | Subs: 1

Once again: why cant we see a vet 5 raketen in some games? its like a vet 5 kubel or unicorn.

Are all player to dumb to play with it? or maybe...they die like flys?

i seen every cast from Danes propacandacast (about 1500 games)..but seen only 1-3 times a vet5 raketen.

all these players must be noobs, right?


I've managed to get a squad up to vet 5 twice in my entire career going up against hard CPU.

Granted I had to get them to withdraw 12 times tho
26 Jul 2017, 07:56 AM
#19
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

What would it be like to add to its vet 1? Something like a range increase when in cover? That unit really isnt bad... The camo is great even, but it does find itself on the front (and close to infantry) fairly often...
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