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COH2.ORG » Forums » Parlor Room » COH2 Central » COH2 Balance » Weird for riflemen to lay the doctrinal mines faster?

Weird for riflemen to lay the doctrinal mines faster?

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LoopDloop
7 Jun 2017, 17:43 PM
#21
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jump backJump back to quoted post7 Jun 2017, 10:52 AMaomsinzana
Because USF doctrine mines so damn cheap and players always spam rifleman to the whole battlefield.
If it have the same speed like other faction mines it will gardening OP.
But hey the same slow speed planting this mines also happen to the Assault Engineer too for no reason.

I suggest give that mines to Rear Echelon and buff plant speed (Assault Engineer should benefit from this buff too).

Wait are they cheaper than normal mines? I thought they were the standard 30. Spamming riflemen isn't really their fault tho. What else are you gonna spam? Ambulances?

I would be on board with REs having the mines and having the them plant mines faster. It makes more sense.
jump backJump back to quoted post7 Jun 2017, 13:43 PMDangerous-Cloth



I literally made a post in this thread about agreeing that Riflemen should lay down mines faster lol. However it should't be at vet 0, thast is just too much. We have enough freebees in this game already.

Is that even possible to implement though? Because it is a doctrinal ability, and they can't construct anything eithout it.
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Alphrum
7 Jun 2017, 17:43 PM
#22
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they dont plant quickly cuz ther not engineers
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LoopDloop
7 Jun 2017, 17:44 PM
#23
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jump backJump back to quoted post7 Jun 2017, 17:43 PMAlphrum
they dont plant quickly cuz ther not engineers

Volks plant doctrinal s-mines at normal speed tho.
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Alphrum
7 Jun 2017, 17:48 PM
#24
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jump backJump back to quoted post7 Jun 2017, 17:44 PMLoopDloop

Volks plant doctrinal s-mines at normal speed tho.


if thats the case volks s-mine planting speed needs to be nerfed
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aomsinzana
8 Jun 2017, 00:54 AM
#25
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30 munitions for generalist mines (a bit lower damage against heavy vehicles) that can plant anywhere by mainline infantry, so damn cheap IMO.
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ClassyDavid
8 Jun 2017, 01:47 AM
#26
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Jun 2017, 00:54 AMaomsinzana
30 munitions for generalist mines (a bit lower damage against heavy vehicles) that can plant anywhere by mainline infantry, so damn cheap IMO.


One thing to note is how munitions heavy USF is. Every mine planted means another grenade, smoke grenade, BAR, etc. isn't used. Which is something every USF player has to consider and I think every time I plant a mine.

I do find the idea of giving RE the mines would work nicely, giving them a bit more utility aside. Also letting them have the same planting speed as Soviet engineers could work out and not be a issue.
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LoopDloop
8 Jun 2017, 02:20 AM
#27
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Jun 2017, 00:54 AMaomsinzana
30 munitions for generalist mines (a bit lower damage against heavy vehicles) that can plant anywhere by mainline infantry, so damn cheap IMO.

But 30 muni is the normal old mine cost right? So cost isn't really the issue here, but the ubiquity of riflemen.
jump backJump back to quoted post8 Jun 2017, 01:47 AMClassyDavid


One thing to note is how munitions heavy USF is. Every mine planted means another grenade, smoke grenade, BAR, etc. isn't used. Which is something every USF player has to consider and I think every time I plant a mine.

I do find the idea of giving RE the mines would work nicely, giving them a bit more utility aside. Also letting them have the same planting speed as Soviet engineers could work out and not be a issue.

To be fair, every faction is pretty munitions starved except okw (always except gardening okw) and maybe soviets with certain doctrines.
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aomsinzana
8 Jun 2017, 02:49 AM
#28
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30 munitions but your mainline infantry can plant generalist mines anywhere, that's why it so damn cheap for what it does .
OKW also starving munitions too (Flame nade/STG volks, mines and med pack if u rush t2) .
In 1v1 i rarely saw OKW player flood munitions .
Munitions flood is not a good play style for all factions .
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LoopDloop
8 Jun 2017, 05:49 AM
#29
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Jun 2017, 02:49 AMaomsinzana
30 munitions but your mainline infantry can plant generalist mines anywhere, that's why it so damn cheap for what it does .
OKW also starving munitions too (Flame nade/STG volks, mines and med pack if u rush t2) .
In 1v1 i rarely saw OKW player flood munitions .
Munitions flood is not a good play style for all factions .

I see what you're saying but cost isn't the factor here. Saying it's cheap for what it does is weird because the mine doesn't do anything special, it's just the fact that riflemen can plant it, which is really just more of an argument for why the speed should stay the same, not the cost, which is fine.

IMO when I play okw I have a lot more muni than when I play other factions. Playing usf or brits, I always have to weigh either getting more BARs/zooks or brens/piats (because double equipping, which takes twice as much muni as volks stgs) or throwing more nades, popping more smokes. As okw, I pretty much grab stgs on all my volks when I set up the first truck and then a schreck for my sturms and then I'm free to spam nades and fausts and mines and things everywhere for the rest of the game. There's also the pintle 42 and maybe obers too. Ost seems to chew through muni as well because of all the upgrades they have to get and soviets are very diverse in how much/little muni they spend depending on doctrine and tier choice.
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Taksin02
8 Jun 2017, 07:56 AM
#30
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laying speed limited at 5 men I have tested
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The amazing Chandler
8 Jun 2017, 09:10 AM
#31
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Posts: 1355

I am also for giving RE mines and not RM.
Its a basic element/mechanic of the game (like suppression) and all factions should have the same elements/mechanics (crew repairs are not a basic element/mechanic, for those who jump on this :D).
I can live with USF not having non doctrinal mines but at least let the RE have them.
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Mirdarion
8 Jun 2017, 10:45 AM
#32
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jump backJump back to quoted post7 Jun 2017, 02:52 AMzerocoh
Sturms plant mines even faster, it's just absurd.

also, S-mines need also to get looked, you can plant 4 s-mines (sufficient for a squad wipe) in 6 seconds and it only costs 15 or 20 munitions.


You are simply wrong on that, Sturmpioneers plant their mines at exactly the speed Pioneers plant a single S-Mine field.

On top of that, you are wrong about S-Minen as well, they do 40 damage each and (unlike all mines except Soviet tripflares) are capped at killing one model maximum. Four S-Minen thus have a damage potential of 160, which is just enough to kill two models. They also have less penetration than all other mines, allowing even a Universal Carrier to drive over them without taking any damage, and they come with fucking signs around them.

Ergo: If you lose a squad to S-Minen, you are either among the most stupid players of this game, or you didn't keep an eye on your backyard (to prevent a player laying mines in your retreat path) and didn't use healing, which means you are among the worst players of this game. Take your pick…
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Ful4n0
8 Jun 2017, 14:45 PM
#33
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Posts: 345

jump backJump back to quoted post7 Jun 2017, 13:43 PMDangerous-Cloth



I literally made a post in this thread about agreeing that Riflemen should lay down mines faster lol. However it should't be at vet 0, thast is just too much. We have enough freebees in this game already.


yep, I know you made it, that is the post I replied....and yeah, I got you want riflemen laying down mines faster but not at vet0, becouse that is too much in your opinion...

And I just asked why not at vet0.....yet, u didn´t quote the part of my post asking this, and of course, you have not given reasons why at vet0 usf rifles must lay down (doctrinals) mines slowly than any other faction lay non-doctrinal mines....is it due to being rifles mainline inf??? is it due to USF being too much strong in the early game??? is it due to USF faction only being able to spam rifles??? why is not fair at vet0 but it is fair at vet1, or vet2 or vet3???

tbh after seeing your new reply, pretty sure you won´t give your reasons anyway.....of course, it is ok if you don´t want to tell me them, but it could be nice, you know...when someone support his suggestions/ideas with reasons it is easier for others to aggre/disagree....


anyway thanks.
jump backJump back to quoted post22 Jun 2016, 16:21 PMBudwise
An already muni starved faction (OKW) is now more muni starved and still can't build caches.

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Dangerous-Cloth
9 Jun 2017, 10:48 AM
#34
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Jun 2017, 14:45 PMFul4n0


yep, I know you made it, that is the post I replied....and yeah, I got you want riflemen laying down mines faster but not at vet0, becouse that is too much in your opinion...

And I just asked why not at vet0.....yet, u didn´t quote the part of my post asking this, and of course, you have not given reasons why at vet0 usf rifles must lay down (doctrinals) mines slowly than any other faction lay non-doctrinal mines....is it due to being rifles mainline inf??? is it due to USF being too much strong in the early game??? is it due to USF faction only being able to spam rifles??? why is not fair at vet0 but it is fair at vet1, or vet2 or vet3???

tbh after seeing your new reply, pretty sure you won´t give your reasons anyway.....of course, it is ok if you don´t want to tell me them, but it could be nice, you know...when someone support his suggestions/ideas with reasons it is easier for others to aggre/disagree....


anyway thanks.


The post you quoted had your answer: "it is just too much". Isn't it good enough they can lay mines and then do this faster at vet 2 or 3 or whatever? It just sounds like you want your riflemen to even more powerful in the early game..

As for the part where you go on a ramble about not supporting some statements with reason. I did support my statement with reasons, it is also in the post you quoted lol.

Read :foreveralone:
Kappa
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VonIvan
9 Jun 2017, 14:59 PM
#38
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Slightly increasing the speed would be the best change imo. The shock value is still valuable considering most USF players encountered by axis never use mines much.
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elchino7
9 Jun 2017, 17:25 PM
#40
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Invis some comments for Off. If you have issues with each other, resolve it through PM.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.

Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.

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