Remember how their feedback also told them that putting the flak-half track behind Medic's was a good idea, because the FLak truck has SUCH A LONG AND SORDID HISTORY OF BEING AN OVERPERFORMING UNIT.
And it took the ENTIRE Axis playing community calling them hacks for, oh, the entire holiday season, for them to half-ass revert it to a build-time nerf?
Pepperidge farm remembers.
Relic Winter Balance Preview v1.4 Update
8 Jan 2017, 20:57 PM
#161
Posts: 48
8 Jan 2017, 21:02 PM
#162
Posts: 2742
I just wanted to note that I have yet to upgrade penals with PTRS in a match where my explicit goal wasn't "upgrade PTRS on penals and test it."
Every time I've been met with 222s or flak HTs I've just... Gone T2 for an AT gun, gone Guard Motor doc, or used conscripts. (Well not cons against the flak HT.) But still, as much as I love AT Satchels, behind a PTRS upgrade is not where it should be locked.
Every time I've been met with 222s or flak HTs I've just... Gone T2 for an AT gun, gone Guard Motor doc, or used conscripts. (Well not cons against the flak HT.) But still, as much as I love AT Satchels, behind a PTRS upgrade is not where it should be locked.
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
8 Jan 2017, 21:09 PM
#163
Posts: 3600 | Subs: 1
Note for the modders, imo the USF mortar is still too potent. it still wipe full heal squad faster than you can react.
8 Jan 2017, 21:31 PM
#164
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Or was assault grenadiers "fixed" now? lol
Reinforce cost lowered from 28 to 26
Grenade Assault munitions cost lowered from 45 to 30.
Grenade Assault aim-time and ready-aim time reduced by half to allow faster throwing.
Squad leader armour reduced from 1.5 to 1.
Medical kits removed.
Veterancy 1 now Grants -10% received accuracy and reduces recharge on sprint by 25%.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
8 Jan 2017, 21:40 PM
#165
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Quick question if someone can test it 
Who wins:
vet 3 PTRS Penals versus vet 3 PTRS Cons?
If Penals, RIP this patch
Who wins:
vet 3 PTRS Penals versus vet 3 PTRS Cons?
If Penals, RIP this patch
8 Jan 2017, 21:55 PM
#166
Posts: 1466 | Subs: 4
Quick question if someone can test it
Who wins:
vet 3 PTRS Penals versus vet 3 PTRS Cons?
If Penals, RIP this patch
It SHOULD be cons from Dank hunters, but it is indeed Penals, as they have 1 more now, which albeit is supposed to stem their damage output a bit, but doesn't do so effectively/reliably since it is only a 33% mis-chance at long range.
So the only saving grace for con dank hunters is they still have sprint and can snare, but that is it.
8 Jan 2017, 22:12 PM
#167
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
It SHOULD be cons from Dank hunters, but it is indeed Penals, as they have 1 more now, which albeit is supposed to stem their damage output a bit, but doesn't do so effectively/reliably since it is only a 33% mis-chance at long range.
So the only saving grace for con dank hunters is they still have sprint and can snare, but that is it.
Thanks.
So like I thought. RIP this patch.
Penals with PTRS which should be punished in terms of AI are still better than PTRS Cons.
I feel like this patch wants to make mainline infantry from Penals, instead of semi-elite infantry.
So... Intead of making new doctrines viable, we can end up with even fewer doctrine viable (depends what upgrades Penals will have finally) since PTRS Penals are better than PTRS Cons and PPSH Penals are better than PPSH Cons, so you can scratch tank hunter and all ppsh doctrines.
No point in making cons apart from snare.
8 Jan 2017, 22:55 PM
#168
1 
Posts: 144
One unit decides the fate of this patch.... 
8 Jan 2017, 23:08 PM
#169
Posts: 2636 | Subs: 17
Thanks.
So like I thought. RIP this patch.
Penals with PTRS which should be punished in terms of AI are still better than PTRS Cons.
I feel like this patch wants to make mainline infantry from Penals, instead of semi-elite infantry.
So... Intead of making new doctrines viable, we can end up with even fewer doctrine viable (depends what upgrades Penals will have finally) since PTRS Penals are better than PTRS Cons and PPSH Penals are better than PPSH Cons, so you can scratch tank hunter and all ppsh doctrines.
No point in making cons apart from snare.
PTRS Penals lose at all ranges and all vet levels to PTRS Conscripts. Tric seems to have misunderstood your question about which one has more powerful AT.
Why don't you run the tests for yourself?
Also, why the hell should we care about preserving the viability of 1 single doctrine, if we can make multiple other doctrines viable?
You have a great idea that improves the QoL aspects of the game? Please, drop your idea here:
https://www.coh2.org/topic/57860/some-qol-suggestions
Check out Cruzz's DPS calculator:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7gwy65JLbSRMEJ3M2ZPandMMW8/view?usp=sharing
(Download the file, open it with your browser)
https://www.coh2.org/topic/57860/some-qol-suggestions
Check out Cruzz's DPS calculator:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7gwy65JLbSRMEJ3M2ZPandMMW8/view?usp=sharing
(Download the file, open it with your browser)
9 Jan 2017, 00:21 AM
#170
Posts: 2742
Penals having PTRS doesn't make their combination with Guards any less powerful.
Penals having PTRS doesn't do anything but give a subpar option in addition to the other AT options soviets have early game. (Mines, ZiS, con PTRS, a faster T3, and the m42 at worst, and Guards at best.)
A tier that combines the maxim and the ZiS is still going to overshadow the tier that doesn't have an ability to handle team weapons or vehicles bigger than a kubel.
Maxim + ZiS in T2 is a bigger factor than Penals having PTRS or not for the strength of T1.
But the issue is the combination of guards with penals, which is actually just the ability for guards being a crutch for handling light vehicle rushes. (Which I isn't entirely true, imo.) Guard Motor is just a power commander and had dominated Soviet 1v1 since launch.
Penals having PTRS doesn't do anything but give a subpar option in addition to the other AT options soviets have early game. (Mines, ZiS, con PTRS, a faster T3, and the m42 at worst, and Guards at best.)
A tier that combines the maxim and the ZiS is still going to overshadow the tier that doesn't have an ability to handle team weapons or vehicles bigger than a kubel.
Maxim + ZiS in T2 is a bigger factor than Penals having PTRS or not for the strength of T1.
But the issue is the combination of guards with penals, which is actually just the ability for guards being a crutch for handling light vehicle rushes. (Which I isn't entirely true, imo.) Guard Motor is just a power commander and had dominated Soviet 1v1 since launch.
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
9 Jan 2017, 01:05 AM
#171
4 
Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2
ok, i dont like PTRS penal any less than the next man who does not like it but let's not act like that one factor in this patch is going to ruin everything.
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9 Jan 2017, 01:39 AM
#173
Posts: 2260 | Subs: 1
In between i like the PTRS penal idea, because it gives soviets cool non-doc and lategame handheld-AT options. I already think about stuff like stunning with guard mg + AT satchel ambushes.
good job, Mod Team
good job, Mod Team
9 Jan 2017, 03:06 AM
#174
Posts: 149
The problem is only the flamer on penals, ptrs could be ok. Why not remove that flamer on mainline infantry and downgrade cost like a rifleman? Your anti infantry early will be a not upgraded penals, and at ptrs penals like the mod. 280 mp is ok cause you have no way to clear garrisons without flamer on eng or snipers. Giving ppsh will not nerf so much the power of flamer upgraded penals squad. If you want something new and remove penals, change with the ppsh guards like the commanders call in.
9 Jan 2017, 05:14 AM
#175
Posts: 301
Looks like AA HT can now beat the T70.
I was fortunate enough to rush a Zis3 otherwise it would've wrecked my infantry
I was fortunate enough to rush a Zis3 otherwise it would've wrecked my infantry
9 Jan 2017, 05:55 AM
#176
Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7
Looks like AA HT can now beat the T70.
I was fortunate enough to rush a Zis3 otherwise it would've wrecked my infantry
This is actually really serious issue that can nerf tier1 even further. I suggest decreasing flaptrack armor pen if your statement is true
9 Jan 2017, 05:57 AM
#177
Posts: 875 | Subs: 6
This is actually really serious issue that can nerf tier1 even further. I suggest decreasing flaptrack armor pen if your statement is true
Ah, that's not exactly True. Stuart/T-70/AEC will still wreck Flak Half Track. Quad Half Tracks get the job done too.
9 Jan 2017, 05:58 AM
#178
Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7
The problem is only the flamer on penals, ptrs could be ok. Why not remove that flamer on mainline infantry and downgrade cost like a rifleman? Your anti infantry early will be a not upgraded penals, and at ptrs penals like the mod. 280 mp is ok cause you have no way to clear garrisons without flamer on eng or snipers. Giving ppsh will not nerf so much the power of flamer upgraded penals squad. If you want something new and remove penals, change with the ppsh guards like the commanders call in.
Penals don´t get any survablity bonuses like riflemen. Riflemen were too dorable with flamers. Penals are as dorable as 6 man enginner squad.
Also ppsh are best on the move, rifles at long range and flamer at medium while standing, so you get jack of all trades squad that fail its job at anything except at clearing garrisons. Its not like rifles with flamer and bar.
BTW also sturmpioneers with 3 STGs and beter recieved acc can get flamer and no one is crying about.
Also 5 men enginners can get flamer and BREN, no one is crying about. They are also full close range squad apart from current penals
9 Jan 2017, 05:59 AM
#179
Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7
Ah, that's not exactly True. Stuart/T-70/AEC will still wreck Flak Half Track. Quad Half Tracks get the job done too.
Thank God. Also thank you for explanation
9 Jan 2017, 09:12 AM
#180
9 
Posts: 1194 | Subs: 29
I don't really see an issue with t1 taking a long time to build as long as the units are good. I enjoy a good risk/reward decision.
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