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Pathfinders are anal cancer

26 Jun 2022, 13:32 PM
#1
avatar of the_onion_man
Patrion 14

Posts: 115

Pathfinders are anal cancer
26 Jun 2022, 14:17 PM
#2
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1076

yes
26 Jun 2022, 15:10 PM
#3
avatar of BlueKnight

Posts: 320

Yes, but without them USF has 0 pickrate in 2v2 tournaments. Pathfinder spam is not fun for anyone.
26 Jun 2022, 15:47 PM
#4
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1076

Yes, but without them USF has 0 pickrate in 2v2 tournaments. Pathfinder spam is not fun for anyone.


sad but true

at this point it would be way better to delete usf completely.
26 Jun 2022, 19:56 PM
#5
avatar of Willy Pete

Posts: 174

Lmao they sure are. But playing usf without them will give u cancer everywhere
26 Jun 2022, 20:48 PM
#6
avatar of Rosbone
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1740 | Subs: 2

Only Relic could conceive of giving a unit ridiculous vision and have them actually have some offensive ability. Then put that unit in the faction that has Scotts that can erase your inf from a million meters away and are much more accurate with said path vision. And can eat a couple of shots before exploding so tank dives are almost useless.

But haven't Paths always been OP. Its not like they were suddenly buffed. I remember people playing BarFinders all the time in 2017.

So is it really just that the balance team has done such a good job that now paths are one of the few remaining issues?

Just like no one complained about DSHK until VonIvan started using them after a balance patch... OP begat OP
26 Jun 2022, 20:49 PM
#7
avatar of Rosbone
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1740 | Subs: 2

Lmao they sure are. But playing usf without them will give u cancer everywhere

26 Jun 2022, 20:52 PM
#8
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13149 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Jun 2022, 20:48 PMRosbone
Only Relic could conceive of giving a unit ridiculous vision and have them actually have some offensive ability. Then put that unit in the faction that has Scotts that can erase your inf from a million meters away and are much more accurate with said path vision. And can eat a couple of shots before exploding so tank dives are almost useless.

But haven't Paths always been OP. Its not like they were suddenly buffed. I remember people playing BarFinders all the time in 2017.

So is it really just that the balance team has done such a good job that now paths are one of the few remaining issues?

Just like no one complained about DSHK until VonIvan started using them after a balance patch... OP begat OP

Think you oversimplifying since Pathfinder have received several buffs including reduction in CP and can now be used as mainline infatry.

USF as faction has little to do with USF of 2017...

Same goes for IR&Pathfinder (who had 3 entities) and recon commander.
26 Jun 2022, 21:21 PM
#9
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 964 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Jun 2022, 20:48 PMRosbone
Only Relic Mod Team could conceive of giving a unit ridiculous vision and have them actually have some offensive ability. Then put that unit in the faction that has Scotts that can erase your inf from a million meters away and are much more accurate with said path vision. And can eat a couple of shots before exploding so tank dives are almost useless.


Fixed it for you.

Relic Path and Relic Scott has nothing to with their state atm. Well, you could always say that Relic made those units in the first place, therefore its only relic to blame. :romeoHairDay:
27 Jun 2022, 01:10 AM
#10
avatar of Katukov

Posts: 702 | Subs: 1

pathfinders were god's punishment for spotting scope and sturmtiger abuse
27 Jun 2022, 02:46 AM
#11
avatar of theekvn

Posts: 266

Nah, Just Community team fucked up USF indirect fire and run away.

27 Jun 2022, 04:07 AM
#12
avatar of Support Sapper

Posts: 1212



sad but true

at this point it would be way better to delete usf completely.


delete UKF and OKW along the way. game fixed.
27 Jun 2022, 04:30 AM
#13
avatar of Rosbone
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1740 | Subs: 2

Fixed it for you.

You cheeky monkey

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Jun 2022, 20:52 PMVipper
USF as faction has little to do with USF of 2017...

Probably. I don't pay enough attention to balance patches since they do not affect me in any way. I just keep hearing they are OP and no one has said why they are all of a sudden OP. So that was my question, why now?

27 Jun 2022, 07:03 AM
#14
avatar of minhuh064

Posts: 63

So 222/ Brumbar Spotting scope is not a thing anymore?
27 Jun 2022, 07:54 AM
#15
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13149 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jun 2022, 04:30 AMRosbone

...
Probably. I don't pay enough attention to balance patches since they do not affect me in any way. I just keep hearing they are OP and no one has said why they are all of a sudden OP. So that was my question, why now?


There are many reasons since buffs included:
Population from 9 to 6
- Reinforce cost from 37 to 30
- Reinforce time from 7 to 6
- CP 2 to CP 0

That in addition to changes to tech that allow USF to challenge axis indirect weapons allowed Pathfinder to act as mainline infatry and USF to change the play style to indirect weapon attrition relying on the superior scouting.
27 Jun 2022, 08:26 AM
#16
avatar of theekvn

Posts: 266

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jun 2022, 07:54 AMVipper

There are many reasons since buffs included:
Population from 9 to 6
- Reinforce cost from 37 to 30
- Reinforce time from 7 to 6
- CP 2 to CP 0


that was 2017 pre nerf BAR finder 2017. After that, nerfed pathfinder from 2017 is the same as 2022 pathfinder.
27 Jun 2022, 08:37 AM
#17
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13149 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jun 2022, 08:26 AMtheekvn

that was 2017 pre nerf BAR finder 2017. After that, nerfed pathfinder from 2017 is the same as 2022 pathfinder.

Nope CP 0 is December 12th 2018.
That change is the most important since it allow a unit with elite carbines to become mainline infatry.

Even if pathfinder where identical the USF as faction and the commander they are available are not (mostly IR&pathfinders).
27 Jun 2022, 09:18 AM
#18
avatar of Protos Angelus

Posts: 1460

Pathfinders should have been brought up to JLI offensive (accuracy....) and defensive (RA) levels and made CP2. Start off with long range carbines or something and upgrade to snipers, same as JLI.
However, then pios should get the sight bonus locked behind vet so that no starting infantry can scout out right out of the gate (especially potent in 3v3s).
Scott should have had 60 autofire range and a high scatter, fast barrage that can act as sort of a retarded katyusha barrage. Slower, not as high a saturation as many rockets at once, but you get autofire in return.
Basically a mini brummbar.
Pak howi should have had an autofire accuracy nerf, and a buff to barrage so it's more against static opponents. Not just straight up nerf the AOE by 50% and in return give it one extra man which does not help it survive one bit.
M1919s should have been locked behind the major so that rifles don't lose as hard against grens late game on most large, open maps. Grens should have been reworked because they are currently the most potent mainline, especially in 3v3s+ where you can blob them with LMGs and just melt away infantry (especially USF as USF is close range).
OKW should have been looked at with the KT spearhead + commander/HEAT shells combination. HEAT shells themselves should have been reworked.

There are plenty of things that could have been made better in my opinion. But with the current state of the US, pathfinders are necessitated by facts:
Grens are long range, combined with pios sight + MG42 wide cone, makes it a horror to play against on lane-y maps (Rheine, Redball, ...)
Volks are long range, and you want to spot rushing spios to position the REs as perfectly as you can since REs deal 0 dmg in reality.
OST also has a sniper which can be a cancer to USF. Can't remember how many times I've flanked a sniper only to fail to kill it in multiple volleys from medium-long range (rifles are close range).

Biggest weakness, once that I've seen exploited many times in 3v3s by fellow USF players that played Airborne into scott is the absolute lack of AT/snare. M1 57mm is generally not enough to contest OKW P4 without a muni sink (which goes into pathfinders to make them viable later on with double BARs). With the caches and all, you can get the OKW P4 and a brummbar quite fast, which spells doom against pathfinders/scott. (unless all OKW team)
Best you can hope is to close the game before minute 15.

Hell, I pretty much exclusively play Heavy Cavalry and I'm around rank 10 as USF in 3v3s, which kinda does mean that Pathfinders are not as necessary as they seem to be at first glance. But they do make the game easier. What I have to do basically is send the RE first to get pinned and reveal the position of the MG, and then play 3 rifles vs 3 grens + MG42 + pio with superior positioning and micro. After those starting engagements against spios and MG42s it gets easier and I usually have the Pershing around minute 19-20. Still, having pathfinder sight makes it sooo much easier. Sure the pathfinders are quite shi* in combat until BARs, but the starting sight more than makes up for it.
27 Jun 2022, 10:10 AM
#19
avatar of VonManteuffel

Posts: 85

Make them 1CP and 60 ammo sniper upgrade like JLI => USF fixed.
27 Jun 2022, 10:28 AM
#20
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 2068 | Subs: 2

Nobody thinks that having two infantry units in one commander is a very bad design? Maybe move the Pathfinders somewhere to another commander? And maybe add the Paratroopers to another commander?
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