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russian armor

OH officer

13 Mar 2020, 13:09 PM
#21
avatar of Widerstreit

Posts: 1192

At the moment the MP40 are a good boost for Osttruppen weak close-combat situations.

I never tought Officer needs a buff etc., it is a good unit as it is.

Edit: Better fix other stuff lol
13 Mar 2020, 13:16 PM
#22
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8524 | Subs: 1

At the moment the MP40 are a good boost for Osttruppen weak close-combat situations.

I never tought Officer needs a buff etc., it is a good unit as it is.

Edit: Better fix other stuff lol

I doubt that it will continue to be with his time frame, the new UKF smgs units, Assault Engineer, PPSh conscripts, SVT Cosncripts, shock troops.

Even As. Grenadier that arrive earlier and can upgrade to an extra man will probably struggle.

At the very least the units could use reinforcement time and cost discount.
13 Mar 2020, 14:26 PM
#23
avatar of Widerstreit

Posts: 1192

jump backJump back to quoted post13 Mar 2020, 13:16 PMVipper

I doubt that it will continue to be with his time frame, the new UKF smgs units, Assault Engineer, PPSh conscripts, SVT Cosncripts, shock troops.

Even As. Grenadier that arrive earlier and can upgrade to an extra man will probably struggle.

At the very least the units could use reinforcement time and cost discount.


Isn't it a problem other stuff is simply too good for its price, or some other things simply sucks?

For me it would be more relevant to:

Ostheer:

- buff Ostheer's Pios: giving them Lugars instead, giving them K98k (Volks version) if upgraded to Flamer or Sweeper, so they become as effective as soviets Pios in that role, while un-upgraded their weapon-profile is for close-combat WITHOUT using MP40 for evey bull-sh*t.

- giving Grens non-doc shock-nade, so they get a more individually use on assault and defense. Ability to hold ground to move support weapons, so e.g. Shock-troups can't simply overrun eveything. (change doc-shot-nade to Granatenhagle-M24 as OKW, or Assaultgrens have)

general:

- nerfing all line-infantry grenades to level of Panzerfüseliers/Guards, HARD nerf to prevent all that fast fuks while using standard stuff.

Soviets:

- reducing soviets crews to 5 men, after all the buffs (and nerf for Germans) support weapons.

There are so many things changing game into a direction so Officer doesn't need to become better.
13 Mar 2020, 14:55 PM
#24
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8524 | Subs: 1

...

Generally I agree that other factions need more nerf than Ostheer buffs.

In this case the unit simply needs to be looked at and I simply pointing out that the other officer including the "new" UKF one are far superior.
13 Mar 2020, 15:39 PM
#25
avatar of SuperHansFan

Posts: 814

jump backJump back to quoted post13 Mar 2020, 14:55 PMVipper

Generally I agree that other factions need more nerf than Ostheer buffs.

In this case the unit simply needs to be looked at and I simply pointing out that the other officer including the "new" UKF one are far superior.


Last time I checked ukf officer can't synergize with late game artillery with a ton of abilities

Try using the arty officer with a panzerwerfer, it's a complete beast. Brit officer is just a cqb squad with a charge ability.
13 Mar 2020, 15:44 PM
#26
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8524 | Subs: 1



Last time I checked ukf officer can't synergize with late game artillery with a ton of abilities

Try using the arty officer with a panzerwerfer, it's a complete beast. Brit officer is just a cqb squad with a charge ability.


I do use it. On other hand as I have pointed out the officer was not built once even when osttruppen where selected. It fail in its role as combat unit. The UKF officer on the other hand is a stock and does not take up a commander while it arrives earlier.

It is quite simple either buff it combat capability to match other officers or make 3-4 men with a cost of 200-220 and pop 3-4 to match the major.
16 Mar 2020, 15:25 PM
#27
avatar of DerKuhlmann

Posts: 315

If officier oconer gets a flame thrower from a dropped one, he´s actually decent.

But the unit is badly designed, cause the unit want to stand close to your tanks for the aura. And you don´t stand in the enemys face with your tanks.

Just give him 2 lmg42 and 2 gren bolts.
16 Mar 2020, 21:38 PM
#28
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 2946



I see the OH officer more as an utility unit (like USF major) than a dedicated combat squad (like UKF officer), it's close range capability (+self buff ability) is just an extra, the focus should be on the very useful smoke arty, aura buff and arty call-ins. In other words, you are not meant to put this unit in the first row of combat.

It's exactly like the UKF officer. That being said, UKF officer 30 muni to reinforce too? IMO both are fine at that cost since they're both very effective CQB squads though.
16 Mar 2020, 21:58 PM
#29
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8524 | Subs: 1


It's exactly like the UKF officer. That being said, UKF officer 30 muni to reinforce too? IMO both are fine at that cost since they're both very effective CQB squads though.

OH Officer was not built once in WC2019 so doubt that he is a "very effective CQB squad"
16 Mar 2020, 22:14 PM
#30
avatar of JibberJabberJobber

Posts: 1352 | Subs: 3

The OH Officer's firepower is fine at 240mp, but you'Il bleed dry if you try to use it in combat cause of the overpriced reinforcement cost. Assault Grenadiers cost 26mp as a comparison and have an additional MP40. I find it hard to justify getting it with how much Ostheer has to invest in anti infantry.

Maybe it would be better to let them start with Kar98k's to let it synergize better with the early composition of Grens and MG42's. Then let them swap to MP40's once they reach veterancy 2 with the RA reduction. Perhaps even let the Officer himself switch from a Luger to an MP40 at that point.

A different option would be to make Diversion allot cheaper at like 10 munitions.
17 Mar 2020, 00:19 AM
#31
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4087 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post16 Mar 2020, 21:58 PMVipper

OH Officer was not built once in WC2019 so doubt that he is a "very effective CQB squad"

Ostheer also have like 30 commanders and more have the very meta tiger tank than have the oh officer. You of all people should know that a doctrinal unit not seeing use doesn't mean much about the specific units balance but more that there are more attractive/accessible alternatives.
17 Mar 2020, 07:17 AM
#32
avatar of NaOCl

Posts: 292

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Mar 2020, 18:56 PMVipper

?
The unit has an ability called "diversion" because it is meant to fight at the front line.

Is meant to be support unit it should be cheaper have and have less pop.

"Artillery Field Officer
The AF officer has received a major overhaul to allow this unit to not only provide a potent support role, but also act as a unit that can lead an assault to help breakthrough the enemy lines and push away infantry units at close range."


Its good we have you around to state what should be completely obvious to anyone who has played this game for more than 25hrs, but seemingly is not at all obvious.

"Artillery Field Officer"

in literally every sense of the word, from all possible angles of nomenclature, is intended to be a front line combat unit.
17 Mar 2020, 08:30 AM
#33
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8524 | Subs: 1


Ostheer also have like 30 commanders and more have the very meta tiger tank than have the oh officer. You of all people should know that a doctrinal unit not seeing use doesn't mean much about the specific units balance but more that there are more attractive/accessible alternatives.

The difference here is that not only "Assault Support Doctrine" that combines a Tiger and an Officer did not even make it into the load out but even when the Officer was available in the Osttruppen doctrine it was not even build.

A unit that is "very effective CQB squad" would probably had been built.
17 Mar 2020, 08:32 AM
#34
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8524 | Subs: 1

The OH Officer's firepower is fine at 240mp, but you'Il bleed dry if you try to use it in combat cause of the overpriced reinforcement cost. Assault Grenadiers cost 26mp as a comparison and have an additional MP40. I find it hard to justify getting it with how much Ostheer has to invest in anti infantry.

Maybe it would be better to let them start with Kar98k's to let it synergize better with the early composition of Grens and MG42's. Then let them swap to MP40's once they reach veterancy 2 with the RA reduction. Perhaps even let the Officer himself switch from a Luger to an MP40 at that point.

A different option would be to make Diversion allot cheaper at like 10 munitions.

When comparing the Officer and Assu. Gren one has also to keep in mind that the officer holds little shock value since it comes at CP 2 instead of CP 0 and does not scale as combat unit as good.
17 Mar 2020, 22:20 PM
#35
avatar of Fire and Terror

Posts: 224

the unit stats is fine, but i dont like to pay 30mp for a mp model to refesh, when assgrens come at 0 cp and cost 26. then the officer should also cost 26

Espacially since gren cost gets toned down to 28 next patch after t4, but officer remains at 30.
18 Mar 2020, 08:53 AM
#36
avatar of oootto92

Posts: 121

You could just turn it into pure Ostheer equivalent of Major and call it a day. Ostheer is currently only faction without access to forward retreat point. This would finally bring balance to this.

For example:
-250mp
-2 men with kar98s and commander with luger
-forward retreat point
-leig artillery call in within x range for y munies
-some fancy flavor ability to distinguish from equivalents of other factions (like passive 20m camouflage aura that hides vehicles after they hold still for 5s etc.)
18 Mar 2020, 14:41 PM
#37
avatar of Unit G17

Posts: 215

You could just turn it into pure Ostheer equivalent of Major and call it a day. Ostheer is currently only faction without access to forward retreat point. This would finally bring balance to this.

For example:
-250mp
-2 men with kar98s and commander with luger
-forward retreat point
-leig artillery call in within x range for y munies
-some fancy flavor ability to distinguish from equivalents of other factions (like passive 20m camouflage aura that hides vehicles after they hold still for 5s etc.)


Ostheer FRP sounds good, but considering the doctrines the officer is present in, one of them having a tiger and the other having lefh and pak 43, I say the FRP should be put into a different or completely new doctrine, preferably something that lacks decent late game abilities (similar to soviet airborne doctrine).
However the upcoming ostheer changes may substitute for an FRP, we gotta see that in action first.
18 Mar 2020, 15:04 PM
#38
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4087 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Mar 2020, 08:30 AMVipper

The difference here is that not only "Assault Support Doctrine" that combines a Tiger and an Officer did not even make it into the load out but even when the Officer was available in the Osttruppen doctrine it was not even build.

A unit that is "very effective CQB squad" would probably had been built.

I've never argued that it's a "very effective CQB squad" but not seeing it often isn't surprising. Utility in units is almost always criminally overlooked In favor of more directly applicable stats.

What's more, the oh officer seems more tuned to team games where it's abilities will see more use as opposed to smaller modes where every drop of manpower needs to pull its weight on the front.

The comparisons to ass grens in both combat power and reinforce are Lilley the issue- I'm guessing people are using the officer like ass grens and that's not his jam.
18 Mar 2020, 15:11 PM
#39
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8524 | Subs: 1


I've never argued that it's a "very effective CQB squad" but not seeing it often isn't surprising. ...


You did not argue that but others did:

It's exactly like the UKF officer. That being said, UKF officer 30 muni to reinforce too? IMO both are fine at that cost since they're both very effective CQB squads though.


I have simply respond to them and I happy to see that you agree that Oshteer officer is not very "effective CQB squad"
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