The Grenadier Squad has long been the gold standard of CoH2 Infantry and if there are issues with them being ineffective, the issue lies somewhere else. USF and UKF have introduced the ability to double-upgrade your Infantry and I believe this is where the problem lies.
Though it's true they have to invest more to get more power, you literally cannot invest more to counter it because you are limited by unit design, you could have 200 munitions and you wouldn't be able to get a second MG 42 on your Grenadiers or more StG's on your Volksgrenadiers; they are simply outclassed by design.
I believe UKF is a worse offender than USF, the BAR isn't overly special imo. For 60 (50?) munitions it is worse than a single Panzergrenadier StG, and Riflemen were designed to be inherently more powerful than other mainlines. Infantry Sections are more of an issue though, double Bren means they can stack long-range firepower which means A+move or Cover play is much stronger. They can reach 3/4 the DPS of Obersoldaten or Vet 3 Grenadiers for a mainline infantry squad. This is also often combined with free unlimited field healing.
The UKF are such a strange faction, a pendulum swinging between overpowered and underpowered. I believe the cheesebility of certain units is why they're so hard to balance. Being allowed to stack so much firepower on a 5 man mainline infantry squad is certainly a problem. Most Armies require you to use an elite unit or doctrine unit for this, like Obersoldaten or Guards. |
-snip i posted this in the wrong place- |
As it should be.
Or when they are not fully repaired.
Or hit by other soft units/abilities outside of 160dmg tank/AT guns.
That's boring though. As more and more features are peeled away from the game in favor of cold hard consistency, I begin to wonder if a separate tournament mode with more classic RTS mechanics (all attacks connect and deal damage with no rng accuracy or deflection) would have been a better path. What is the point of keeping random criticals around if they're relegated to obscurity? Most players are in casual team games, and while some consistency is good, overly sterilizing the game risks losing some of the flavor. |
"All armies should have"
Stopped reading after that, this is an asymetrical balanced game.
All armies should be equipped to effectively deal with all other armies. Relic already tried doing things like releasing OKW without an HMG or a Medium Tank and it was hell to balance them because of it. |
I like the way it sounds personally, I think it's a cool concept. I'm not sure about the speed buff, but I'm glad the Scoped Enfield is back in place. |
My problem with Mechanized and Battlegroup is that Mechanized has all OKW's strongest field units, the Panzer II is better than the Flak HT and the Stuka is better than the LeIG, plus there's the Puma.
We'll see how these new changes work out. |
An interesting change though OKW without volks StG44 will be rather rare I predict (due to being overpowered quite easily without them and thus heavily favour BGruup openers), unless they seek to bypass with the MP40s(?) Or some kind of Falls/Ober heavy build . This change might shift ppl even further away from Mech as a viable tech. Does Mech HQ gets the Infantry Weapon Upgrades upgrade by default?
It seems implied that Mechanized will still unlock them normally. Battlegroup is cheaper to build and the changes to Hetzer/Ostwind and Obers made Fast BG into Schwere for Hetzer/Ostwind and Obers strats a bit too lucrative. |
About Penals, I actually like them having the PTRS package, it seems really fitting. Overall Penals really don't feel "expendable" to me, yet nothing screams expendable like being handed an Anti-Tank Rifle and being told to shoot at that Heavy Panzer over there. I still think a second PTRS package should be unlocked at T4's construction, possibly with a Vet 3 penetration boost.
As for a rework to feel more expendable, I'm not sure what I would do about them personally, I've considered making them 5 (6 with PTRS upgrade) and giving them the Flamethrower back, but then you'd have to take away the SVT, but I like having a stock unit that uses the SVT. Maybe create a new unit that fields SVT and upgrades to PPSH, based along the lines of the 'Assault Squad' one in my signature. |
How do Sturmpioneer StG44 and Stormtrooper MP40 compare? Since they're technically the same unit IRL, if the Stormtrooper MP40 is weaker than the StG44 the Sturmpioneers could get 4x Stormtrooper MP40s.
As said above, the Stormtrooper MP 40 is vastly superior. It ties with the Thompson SMG for close DPS, but has inferior mid-range DPS. Assault Grenadier MP 40 has similar DPS at exactly range 10, but inferior in every other range. I assume the Assault Grenadier version would be used, as the Stormtrooper version would be an overall upgrade. And just for curiosity, the IR StG 44 to the Stormtrooper MP 40 is like the Sturmpiuoneer StG 44 to the Assault Grenadier MP 40. Not really relevent, but I found it interesting. |
They only get the Penal SVT, and only 4 of them. That's 4 of the lowest DPS semi-automatic rifle in the game. StG Volksgrenadiers or G43 Panzerfusiliers should easily be par. |