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VG only win under certain circumstances, namely being at max range in green cover when Allied infantry has to charge. They lose in most other scenarios.
Sturmpioneers are good early game but they do not scale at all (bad veterancy bonusses and too high requirements) and they are a manpower sink to reinforce.
Obers are cheap but they're also the only 4-men elite infantry and they are very vulnerable to wipes because of this. |
Yeah, OKW drop flare and another use Zeroing Artillery over British emplacement. No counter, no avoidance. What could go wrong?
So the enemy spends 360 munitions to take down an emplacement. I think that's a fair trade. |
Those are moderate changes (as in not completely overhauling the entire doctrine with new abilities) and these are exactly like I proposed at the beginning of this topic. See below.
I think Elite Armor doctrine and Overwatch Doctrine were voted for most. I don't have much experience with Overwatch so I won't mention that one.
As for Elite Armor: the doctrine overal isn't that bad but needs a few tweaks to make it more viable compared to other doctrines.
2CP) Signal Relay
- This ability isn't bad but it generally isn't particularily useful either (at least not in team games) and when ammunition is scarce it's definitely not a priority to spend munis on.
- Could use some minor tweaks like lower cost and longer duration.
- Could also be made into passive vehicle tank awareness, which spots enemy vehicles in FOW on the minimap and tactical map within XX meter radius of friendly vehicles.
4CP) Emergency Repairs
- This ability isn't practical at all. It takes too long to repair critical damage (I think it takes 15 seconds) which means it can only be used in safe positions, making it extremely situational.
- Either reduce critical damage repair time drastically
- Or turn ability into a passive self-repair like the similar Soviet ability. This would make the doctrine more attractive for heavy vehicle based builds because it frees up Sturmpioneers for tasks other than repairing.
7CP) HEAT Shells
- This ability is fine. Greatly increases damage output of tanks for a cost-effective amount of munis.
- Perhaps customize the ability duration time to match vehicle ROF. I think this would be OP as a passive ability.
8CP) Panzer Commander
- This ability needs to be overhauled in order to be worth it over the pintle mounted MG. Needs to give more vision and perhaps an accuracy bonus. Or maybe give it a significant bonus to veterancy gain (like 20-30% faster veterancy).
- The artillery call-in takes way too long to land making it nearly useless. It either needs more range or it needs to activate quicker. If so, maybe change it to a light artillery barrage.
11CP) Sturmtiger
- IMO this vehicle is fine the way it is right now, difficult to use but can be very effective.
- Veterancy requirements need to be looked at though. Unless it's constantly hitting vehicles it just doesn't vet up at all really.
- Maybe switch Sturmtiger with Special Operations Doctrine's Command Panther. This would make more sense to both doctrines. Command Panther might be OP with HEAT shells and mark target ability combined, though.
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I'd put the Hetzer AT into T1 as an Su-76-like stopgap light tank destroyer as an alternative to Rakettens and to open up T1 strategies as an alternative to a Puma to counter enemy light vehicles.
But this topic isn't for discussing new commanders. Unless you guys are talking about the Elite Armor doctrine in which case I don't think it needs such drastic changes to become viable. |
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I don't think the OKW flares are as powerful as people make them out to be. 60 munitions isn't cheap and you can't spam them forever, especially not since OKW is pretty munitions heavy to start with. It's like most other recon: it's annoying but you can reposition your units accordingly or keep them moving.
Its ability in team games to spot for other teammates' off-maps is unfortunate, but then against most recon can do that. Even planes will usually be able to spot whatever someone wishes to off-map before being taken down.
I could get behind a better visual clue though, like a green marker or the flares appearing sooner. |
The best way to balance the game in its current state and to avoid unintended second and third order of effects, is to adjust cost. If the unit is over performing for cost, then make it cost more. If it is underperforming for cost, like the M20, then make it cost less. Keep it simple.
QFT. Nothing wrong with the current performance of the M20, no need to change anything drastically and risk creating imbalance. It's just too expensive. Lower the cost according to Tobis' proposal and it should be fine. |
Buff it but make it slow like the Churchill I'd say. It's an infantry tank so that's probably more historically accurate and a 'light' vehicle that's durable rather than fast isn't something the game has right now.
Kind of like the Churchills back in CoH1 then. They could come out very quickly (3CP I think) for such a heavy tank so they could be pretty effective against an unexpecting enemy, forcing them to develop counters. As the CoH1 Churchills didn't really have any AT, they could be outclassed fairly quickly. It wasn't an overpowered strategy but it could catch your enemy off guard, and provided variety in strategies. Having a similar unit for CoH2 Brits would be fun I guess. I like the proposal. |
Thread: vickers19 Aug 2018, 17:39 PM
Bofors?
Seriously? Are you Trolling? If Brits go Bofors they will get eaten by Light Vehicles because no AEC.
Not in team games, where a single Bofors can lock down an entire chokepoint-section of the map. At least until Axis can gather enough resources to counter it. |
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I don't really understand why everyone is so hostile. I'd say forcing units to retreat is a big enough reward for a 25 munis ability. All other tools that slowed retreats or enabled cheesy wipes on retreat have been removed (stun grenades, grenades on infiltration infantry, etc.) so I don't see a reason this ability still should. Buff the damage or let it kill models, but the movement penalty on retreating units should be removed. |
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Tiger IIs were deployed on the Eastern Front in September 1944, so it still fits the Ostheer perfectly fine. It isn't more of a stretch than giving the Brits the Comet or OKW the MG-34. |
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