I don't think the double schreck on fusiliers is as bad as many may think. The rifles on fusiliers are pretty bad and only having 3 of them is not nearly enough to fend off vetted and equipped allied infantry, even in team game blobs.
Double Panzerschreck Panzerfusiliers badly lose to Rear Echelons.
https://youtu.be/TpKHjls00zQ?t=1100 |
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Tank engagements are rarely fought at point blank range. Mid to long range are the stats that really matter.
Furthermore in your tech costs comparison you forgot that Ostheer starts with 15 more fuel. Add to that that Ostheer can generally fight the early-mid game with a 30 fuel vehicle while OKW needs 55 or 60 fuel vehicles (and that the 45 fuel Mechanized is the dominant meta), and that OKW needs to pay fuel for their medics, and Ostheer has a major advantage in Panzer IV timing. |
2. Better armor seems a bit stronger vs allied medium tanks. But even there, almost about 1 in 2 shots penetrates your OKW P4 at mid range. Thats not pretty much. And heavy mediums (T34/85 and Sherman E8) also don't care much about better P4 armor. They penetrate with ~65%, which means 2/3 of all shots fired will penetrate.
Even though I personally think the Jagdpanzer IV (instead of the Panzer 4 Ausf. J) would offer a more interesting strategic choice for Ostheer, I think you glossed over this part. 51% chance to get penned by Allied (premium) mediums at long range versus 67% chance is a pretty big deal, and it makes the P4J a much better stock tank than the Ostheer P4H. On top of that, the P4J also has better scatter values (better versus infantry) and gets better veterancy. And thirdly, Ostheer would get their hands on this quite enhanced version of the Panzer IV a lot sooner than OKW does.
A P4J at Ostheer T3 timing is very strong, and imo definitely worth a commander slot.
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I like how that Poll doesnt have a "change nothing" option for the allies commanders. Do you want to imply here that these 2 things MUST be changed?
Rigged imo 
Or the option to replace it with something else entirely. |
Frag bombs
For 180 munis, I expect more damage to tanks, for example the Soviet bombing run is very damaging to all units.
This ability is not meant to damage tanks. It is meant to completely obliterate infantry clusters and buildings. Which it does. It absolutely does.
I like using the Stuka Fragmentation Bombs with German Infantry doctrine but to be frank it is super overpowered on most team game maps (2s up to 4s) where the enemy will cluster (forward retreat points or turtling etc.) near the map borders. Near the map border the plane comes in really quick. The cluster bombs have a huge AOE and easily wipe squads. As a bonus it usually also oneshots Katyushas and Priests/Sextons.
Stuka Fragmentation Bombs is one of the most powerful offmaps in the game when used right and it does not deserve to be on this list.
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If they didnt lose dps when dropping models they would be fixed. To The Last Man is probably the most straightforward fix for them, yeah.
I think it would be more effective to give them an Obers IR STG44 profile. Giving them 2x STG44 and 2x KAR/G43/MP40 and concentrate most the DPS on the two transferable STG44s. That way the squad keeps most of its firepower until the last two models without sacrificing an ability for it, which is why it works so well for STG Obers. |
Where do G43 grenadiers and G43 panzergrendiers (they get 3) fit in this tier list?
They do not fit anywhere on a list for long range units, as the G43 is a near/mid range and mobility upgrade. |
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It doesn't matter how cheap the squad is or how many models they have when they can't fire the weapon effectively while using the ability. Which was my point. |
Good find, but i hope you noticed panzergrenadiers are significantly more expensive, come later, you cant use them as your baseline infantry and have 4 models, making them vulnerable to things like, for example, 75mm sherman.
What do these things have to do with Tactical Movement and Panzerschrecks?
Having concerns about Panzerschrecks on Panzerfusiliers is fine, but we weren't talking about that.
As for shrecks performing badly while sprinting, it doesnt seem to be the case when you "a click" your pgrens blob in general direction of enemy tank. From what i saw its pretty common strategy in team games.
That's great when the enemy player is afk. If they are reversing their vehicles however, you'll find that the sprinting Panzerschrecks can not keep up and won't fire properly most of the time because by the time they are done turning around the vehicle will be out of range. |
(btw congrats to genius who though mass sprint + double shreck is good idea).
Tactical Movement has been available for double Panzerschreck Panzergrenadiers in Ostheer's Lightning War for ages, and it never caused any problems. Mainly because if you'd actually bother to test things, you'd have noticed that the Schrecks tend to behave badly (models rotating instead of firing) while sprinting. |
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