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Clown Car Accuracy Consistency

1 May 2019, 14:04 PM
#1
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

From the patch notes:

WC 51 Dodge and M3
-Passenger moving accuracy from 50% to 30%.

Will this be applied to all the open-top halftracks when the full patch comes out? It doesn't make much sense to only apply it to these two.
1 May 2019, 14:07 PM
#2
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358

I agree. But you meant to reduce the acc if all vehicle crews among factions?
1 May 2019, 14:19 PM
#3
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

Since you are talking about consistency the armor/hp values of these vehicles should also be brought in line.
1 May 2019, 14:29 PM
#4
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

I agree. But you meant to reduce the acc if all vehicle crews among factions?


Apologies in advance if I'm explaining something you already know here.



Infantry squads have lower accuracy while moving. For the majority of weapons, it's a 50% penalty.

While in a halftrack they count as stationary, so this penalty doesn't apply.

Therefore, the vehicle itself applies an accuracy penalty to the squad inside it while it's in motion. This is 50% for most vehicles, and the patch makes it 30% for the WC51 and M3 Halftrack.

It doesn't matter what squad's in the vehicle: that squad will fire at 30% accuracy if the vehicle's moving.



I think this should apply to all the open-top halftracks rather than arbitrarily apply to just these two.
1 May 2019, 14:29 PM
#5
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

They probably should be applied, but I won't lose sleep if they aren't. Don't see squads fighting out of HTs too often
1 May 2019, 14:32 PM
#6
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

They probably should be applied, but I won't lose sleep if they aren't. The Soviet m5 comes late enough.


True, it's hardly a catastrophe: only the 250 HT and the M3A1 will really care.

However, there's a principle here: if the game doesn't give you these stats, they should be consistent and predictable wherever possible.

Squads being inaccurate firing out of a moving halftrack makes sense.

That inaccuracy only applying to these two? That makes a bit less sense.
1 May 2019, 14:44 PM
#7
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post1 May 2019, 14:32 PMLago

However, there's a principle here: if the game doesn't give you these stats, they should be consistent and predictable wherever possible.


In the name of all that is holy, coh3 better have more transparency with this. Preferably something in-game
1 May 2019, 14:47 PM
#8
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post1 May 2019, 14:32 PMLago


That inaccuracy only applying to these two? That makes a bit less sense.


It does to Relic - it's clearly a kneejerk reaction to meta of Calvary Rifles and Flamer M3 (though 250HT should definitely be included for Infantry Doctrine cheese). M5 isn't a super concern but I agree should probably be included for consistency and for silly things like Bazooka bus which while not super meta probably shouldn't be *as* good at hunting light tanks. It's a great change regardless because honestly clown car run-downs are pretty cancerous.
1 May 2019, 14:48 PM
#9
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

It does to Relic - it's clearly a kneejerk reaction to meta of Calvary Rifles and Flamer M3 (though 250HT should definitely be included for Infantry Doctrine cheese). M5 isn't a super concern but I agree should probably be included for consistency and for silly things like Bazooka bus which while not super meta probably shouldn't be *as* good at hunting light tanks. It's a great change regardless because honestly clown car run-downs are pretty cancerous.


As written, this targets the USF M3 halftrack. Not the Soviet M3A1 Scout Car.
1 May 2019, 15:02 PM
#10
avatar of SuperHansFan

Posts: 833

Can we have a moment of silence for twistedtootsy?

But why are only allied clowncars getting nerfed? Why is wehr clowncar allowed 50% accuracy
1 May 2019, 15:32 PM
#11
avatar of JibberJabberJobber

Posts: 1614 | Subs: 3

Changing the moving accuracy of the Soviet M3A1 and Ostheer 250 probably won't change much, considering most players use a flamer in them, which is not affected by accuracy.

Atleast the USF M3 has 5 passengers shooting out of it and 320 HP, which is good for the time it comes out.

I think the moving accuracy penalty for just the USF M3 should be changed to 40% instead. 5 equally strong passengers in the USF M3 would have the same dps as 4 equally strong passengers of other halftracks then (5*0,4 vs 4*0,5). The WC51 can stay at 30% moving accuracy, considering its super early timing and abundant utility.

It would be less drastical and more fair. Add a handbrake option to all halftracks, while we're at it, so players can play around the moving accuracy penalty.
1 May 2019, 15:53 PM
#12
avatar of aerafield

Posts: 2977 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post1 May 2019, 14:29 PMLago




It doesn't matter what squad's in the vehicle: that squad will fire at 30% accuracy if the vehicle's moving.



Does this mean the squad inside has a 100% accuracy multiplier if the vehicle is standing still or rotating?
1 May 2019, 16:00 PM
#13
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

Does this mean the squad inside has a 100% accuracy multiplier if the vehicle is standing still or rotating?


Standing still, I believe so.

Rotating, I don't know.
1 May 2019, 16:05 PM
#14
avatar of JibberJabberJobber

Posts: 1614 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post1 May 2019, 16:00 PMLago


Standing still, I believe so.

Rotating, I don't know.


They don't have 100% accuracy when it's rotating, you'd have to spam the halt command for full accuracy.

It's why I suggest a handbrake mode for all shooty-outy halftracks.
1 May 2019, 16:57 PM
#15
avatar of murky depths

Posts: 607



They don't have 100% accuracy when it's rotating, you'd have to spam the halt command for full accuracy.

It's why I suggest a handbrake mode for all shooty-outy halftracks.


Sorry to jump in but I've been curious about the rotation thing.

If a tank with a turret shoots while the hull is rotating, is that considered "moving"?

If a turretless vehicle, like an SU-76 shoots while rotating, is that considered moving?
1 May 2019, 17:29 PM
#16
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358

Can we have a moment of silence for twistedtootsy?

But why are only allied clowncars getting nerfed? Why is wehr clowncar allowed 50% accuracy

Lago's is asking to put the 30% acc on all "open top" vehicles and we all agree with him.

Don't start a flame war
1 May 2019, 17:36 PM
#17
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 2358



Sorry to jump in but I've been curious about the rotation thing.

If a tank with a turret shoots while the hull is rotating, is that considered "moving"?

If a turretless vehicle, like an SU-76 shoots while rotating, is that considered moving?

I don't know for certain but it would make some sense. Moving can be though as traverse and rotation since both make the tracks/wheels move and the small bumps in the floor would transfer to the hull hence accuracy decreases and it should be harder to aim.
If someone understands the game engine better and knows please do tell us.

It's kind of problematic for turretless tanks but I think they stop at the moment their target gets in the firing cone. Iirc that shouldn't be a big issue.
1 May 2019, 17:48 PM
#19
avatar of SuperHansFan

Posts: 833

Changing the moving accuracy of the Soviet M3A1 and Ostheer 250 probably won't change much, considering most players use a flamer in them, which is not affected by accuracy.

Atleast the USF M3 has 5 passengers shooting out of it and 320 HP, which is good for the time it comes out.

I think the moving accuracy penalty for just the USF M3 should be changed to 40% instead. 5 equally strong passengers in the USF M3 would have the same dps as 4 equally strong passengers of other halftracks then (5*0,4 vs 4*0,5). The WC51 can stay at 30% moving accuracy, considering its super early timing and many utilities.

It would be less drastical and more fair. Add a handbrake option to all halftracks, while we're at it, so players can play around the moving accuracy penalty.


Ptrs clown car and shreks are used to bully light vehicles quite often. It's especially good to run down flamer HT or univeral carrier for easy kill.

Hans has pulled it off once or twice, Jove I've seen use both. And captain molo uses clown cars like a fine wine, you imagine the unit inside and he's done it.
1 May 2019, 18:04 PM
#20
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1


I don't know for certain but it would make some sense. Moving can be though as traverse and rotation since both make the tracks/wheels move and the small bumps in the floor would transfer to the hull hence accuracy decreases and it should be harder to aim.
If someone understands the game engine better and knows please do tell us.

It's kind of problematic for turretless tanks but I think they stop at the moment their target gets in the firing cone. Iirc that shouldn't be a big issue.

As far as I know rotating is considered moving for applying moving penalties.
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