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russian armor

Teller mines

20 Jan 2019, 07:54 AM
#21
avatar of gbem

Posts: 1979

actually 251 flamer HT rush + at gun is pretty strong and preferred over 222 or 444... likewise although i do agree that the T-70 is strong in both AI and AT... the stuart and AEC... not soo much
20 Jan 2019, 09:32 AM
#22
avatar of Widerstreit

Posts: 1392

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 07:54 AMgbem
the stuart and AEC... not soo much


For that AEC has better AT and Stuart has more armor.


20 Jan 2019, 09:53 AM
#23
avatar of Baba

Posts: 600

I dont know about the stuart. Feels week, misses a lot. Only good thing i can use it for is the crit shot
20 Jan 2019, 09:59 AM
#24
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17875 | Subs: 8



For that AEC has better AT and Stuart has more armor.



If only that Stuart armor advantage over AEC was relevant for any other unit then 222.
20 Jan 2019, 12:40 PM
#25
avatar of RollingStone

Posts: 173

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 09:59 AMKatitof

If only that Stuart armor advantage over AEC was relevant for any other unit then 222.

Armor on LV is unsufficient for fausts anyway.

However, Stuart skillshot is cheap and works on infantry aswell. Just found out week ago or so - "Block Vision" ability actually load canister rounds and shoots them superfast, so it is good against blobs, almost like buffed M42 from Urban Defence.
Just like everything else in american tech-tree: "You got to pay for it in order to get them effective".
20 Jan 2019, 12:44 PM
#26
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474



The Wehrmacht's 222, with a gren or 2 is enough to scare off any light vehicle short of a Valentine or Stuart. Their light vehicle play is hardly lacking. Its not like the Wehrmacht are lacking for AT. Their front line units can deal with light armor easily if it comes too close. Do the Wehrmacht really need an ability to instantly kill a vehicle? Between Paks, Pgrens, and fausts, its not exactly uniquely hard for them to deal with light vehicles. Its one thing to set a trap using mines and AT weapons for a light vehicle in the case, for every other faction. Its another thing entirely, to just set it, forget it, and laugh when it goes off.
by the logic people should remove the stuart cause the AA half truck has MORE pen than 222, the werh is missing a light tank not a LV that's why they have teller mines, as i said if the one shoot mecchanic aganist LV and LT is unfair lower the damage but make the critical better as the only way for werh to kill it is either pf or bring an at gun (other factions have puma,stuart,t70 and aec)
20 Jan 2019, 13:16 PM
#27
avatar of The amazing Chandler

Posts: 1355

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Jan 2019, 23:45 PMBaba


Agreed. Valentine just costs too much to get blown out of existence with 60 ammo


FYI, the Teller costs 50 Munitions.

On topic, i also think the teller is to good for the price.

IMO damage should be: Leave LV with a heavy engine crit. Just give a small chance (even if its only 1%) to save the LV.
20 Jan 2019, 13:20 PM
#28
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17875 | Subs: 8

Tellers are one thing I never understood.

Why is it oh so overpowered for 30 muni mine to kill 240 menpower, but its perfectly fine and balanced for 50 muni mine to kill up to 300 mp, up to 120 muni and up to 70 fuel?

I sense a bit of hypocrisy in that.

Sure, infantry, especially vetted hurts more to lose, but vetting it back is also easier and much cheaper then vehicle.
20 Jan 2019, 13:26 PM
#29
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 13:20 PMKatitof
Tellers are one thing I never understood.

Why is it oh so overpowered for 30 muni mine to kill 240 menpower, but its perfectly fine and balanced for 50 muni mine to kill up to 300 mp, up to 120 muni and up to 70 fuel?

I sense a bit of hypocrisy in that.

Sure, infantry, especially vetted hurts more to lose, but vetting it back is also easier and much cheaper then vehicle.


Not saying tellers are fine, but there is a big difference in being able to accompany the one light vehicle with a minesweeper versus being unable to accompany all the 3-5 spread out infantry squads with a minesweeper.
ddd
20 Jan 2019, 13:38 PM
#30
avatar of ddd

Posts: 528 | Subs: 1



Not saying tellers are fine, but there is a big difference in being able to accompany the one light vehicle with a minesweeper versus being unable to accompany all the 3-5 spread out infantry squads with a minesweeper.


And what if i go triple t70 strat? Is teller fine then?
20 Jan 2019, 13:39 PM
#31
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 13:20 PMKatitof
Tellers are one thing I never understood.

Why is it oh so overpowered for 30 muni mine to kill 240 menpower, but its perfectly fine and balanced for 50 muni mine to kill up to 300 mp, up to 120 muni and up to 70 fuel?

I sense a bit of hypocrisy in that.

Sure, infantry, especially vetted hurts more to lose, but vetting it back is also easier and much cheaper then vehicle.


The probability of triggering it. Unless you're baiting vehicles into it, you're just not that likely to hit any individual Teller mine, and if you put them in high traffic areas the sweeper's likely to spot them. Generalist mines go off on anything.

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 13:38 PMddd
And what if i go triple t70 strat? Is teller fine then?


Moreso. Discouraging that sort of spam strat is an argument in favour of leaving Tellers be.
ddd
20 Jan 2019, 13:44 PM
#32
avatar of ddd

Posts: 528 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 13:39 PMLago


The probability of triggering it. Unless you're baiting vehicles into it, you're just not that likely to hit any individual Teller mine, and if you put them in high traffic areas the sweeper's likely to spot them. Generalist mines go off on anything.



Moreso. Discouraging that sort of spam strat is an argument in favour of leaving Tellers be.


But where is allied teller to discourage 222/luchs spam? Or does it work only one way?
20 Jan 2019, 13:56 PM
#33
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17875 | Subs: 8



Not saying tellers are fine, but there is a big difference in being able to accompany the one light vehicle with a minesweeper versus being unable to accompany all the 3-5 spread out infantry squads with a minesweeper.

I think I'm going to blow your mind here, but light vehicles are not hard capped to 1 and you can have more of them, its not always smartes way to do so, but USF is perfectly fine with having multiple lights and so is OKW.
20 Jan 2019, 14:37 PM
#34
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 13:44 PMddd


But where is allied teller to discourage 222/luchs spam? Or does it work only one way?
where is the werh LT oh wait
20 Jan 2019, 14:43 PM
#35
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 13:44 PMddd
But where is allied teller to discourage 222/luchs spam? Or does it work only one way?


USF have a super-Teller that inflicts Immobilize.

OKW, SOV, USF and UKF have nondoctrinal light tank destroyers.
20 Jan 2019, 17:22 PM
#36
avatar of ferwiner
Donator 11

Posts: 2885

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jan 2019, 13:20 PMKatitof
Tellers are one thing I never understood.

Why is it oh so overpowered for 30 muni mine to kill 240 menpower, but its perfectly fine and balanced for 50 muni mine to kill up to 300 mp, up to 120 muni and up to 70 fuel?

I sense a bit of hypocrisy in that.

Sure, infantry, especially vetted hurts more to lose, but vetting it back is also easier and much cheaper then vehicle.


Tellers are fine. It is the universal mine being capped to 2 men that is bullshit, especially now when formations try to spread a squad. If you place your mine in a smart place, you should be rewarded for that. You should not be rewarded for using your cheap troops as minesweepers.

At this point, I think that if, playing as soviets, I was given a choice of 30muni universal mine or 40 muni AT mine that does exactly the same as universal one, except not blowing up when stepped on by troops, I would choose the AT only one in most cases.
20 Jan 2019, 17:32 PM
#37
avatar of Blebfeesh

Posts: 129

On one hand we have superiour Light Tech(Stuart, AEC/Valentine, T-70) with both AT and AI abilities and Sdkfz.222 in OST tech tree, with little to zero ability to hurt anything above infantrymen.

But on the other hand we have superior, but slow to set up and aim AT-gun(best movable AT-gun in game, AFAIK) and superb mines to cover flanks of said AT-gun. I see nothing wrong with that.

L2P

However, S-mines are really cancer, especially in OKW's hands. Fast to place, cheap( You still have to have at least 60 munis in your pockets however), and deadly. Some say "Watch for signs", but they are small and easy to hide in bushes or somewhat similar, if well-placed. I would look at them, not Teller mines.


S mines are fine lol. They work as area denial. and if you do accidentally walk into the field and lose a model or two, you get a mine sweeper to ensure there are no further losses. In addition, they are easily cleared harmlessly by tanks. It's an effective tool that isn't excessively punishing due to its drawbacks.


A OHK ability to cover a dedicated AT gun's flanks against LVs is a bit silly (considering it's a goddamn AT gun). If anything it helps my argument. If you are using it to defend the flanks of an AT gun, and they kill the threat, why even bother building an AT gun? If the mines brought the LV to an inch of its life, then the AT gun in question is more than enough to finish off the crippled vehicle.
20 Jan 2019, 17:45 PM
#38
avatar of Blebfeesh

Posts: 129

If the one shoot mechanic against LV and LT is unfair lower the damage but make the critical better as the only way for werh to kill it is either pf or bring an at gun (other factions have puma,stuart,t70 and aec)


Congrats, you accidentally agreed with me.
If it gave a heavy vehicle engine crit, and left the LV or LT within an inch of its life, I'd have no problem with it. All I want is for some sort of follow up against the vehicle to be needed. This way it rewards you if someone drives into the mine, but doesn't immediately win you the game in 1v1s and 2v2s.
20 Jan 2019, 18:32 PM
#39
avatar of Fire and Terror

Posts: 306

the problem is with the fact that a heavy engine dmg would make it op against mediums/heavies the only way to fix this is to differentiate between lights and mediums/heavies on mines which is not the case now as far as i know.


One should also fix the odd the odd behaviour when a 222 triggers the mine and wipes my inf sqad completly
20 Jan 2019, 18:44 PM
#40
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474



Congrats, you accidentally agreed with me.
If it gave a heavy vehicle engine crit, and left the LV or LT within an inch of its life, I'd have no problem with it. All I want is for some sort of follow up against the vehicle to be needed. This way it rewards you if someone drives into the mine, but doesn't immediately win you the game in 1v1s and 2v2s.
i have been saying it for years teller mines rant are not something new (in ur opening post u don't mentions any change to the critical)
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