about grens rifle nade.
14 May 2018, 04:27 AM
#1
Posts: 105
how about adding timer on rifle grenade like echelon in fighting position. dont mention about min range of rifle nade. it shoots farther. and dont mention prepare anime. there is no big differences btw normal grenade one.
14 May 2018, 05:36 AM
#2
Posts: 173
"I want to do everthing the same way" - guy again?
Why cant you boys just understand, that diversity in armies is what define unique expirience of playing them.
And, btw, german rifle nade is actually an remade HEAT grenade, so it should not have any sort of timer. At least i couldnt find anything about HE-rifle nades in wermacht. Correct me if im wrong.
Why cant you boys just understand, that diversity in armies is what define unique expirience of playing them.
And, btw, german rifle nade is actually an remade HEAT grenade, so it should not have any sort of timer. At least i couldnt find anything about HE-rifle nades in wermacht. Correct me if im wrong.
14 May 2018, 05:57 AM
#3
Posts: 1930
At least i couldnt find anything about HE-rifle nades in wermacht. Correct me if im wrong.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schiessbecher
14 May 2018, 06:32 AM
#4
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
how about adding timer on rifle grenade like echelon in fighting position. dont mention about min range of rifle nade. it shoots farther. and dont mention prepare anime. there is no big differences btw notmal grenade one.
I don´t know, it would make them pretty useless I guess. Rifle grenades are just a bad design for so many reason. There often is no animation whatsoever in my games, plus the input delay just makes it super annoying to play against. People say you can dodge rifle grenades easily but even in top-level games there are usually some wipes or at least near wipes every game. Much more than from other grenades. Especially on maps like Fayomville or Vaux with lots of hedges and sight blockers, they are super annoying.
Obviously they won´t be touched because it´s a Wehrmacht ability and thus perfectly balanced. Kappa
14 May 2018, 06:39 AM
#5
Posts: 1930
a minor damage reduction against yellow cover (10%) maybe it all that it needs. Greencover will protect you and squad usually spread out in open cover.
The issue is more to do with when the squad is bunched up next to a bush.
The issue is more to do with when the squad is bunched up next to a bush.
14 May 2018, 06:47 AM
#6
Posts: 353
normally PVP is Can focus and awareness Gren Model Use Rifle nade
but when PVE on Cpu Hard or Expert (more of MU mean more Rifle nade) I forget to aware and get Squad wipe
back to topic if input fuse delay is should trade some buff like Dmg or AOE
or lower MU use IMO
but when PVE on Cpu Hard or Expert (more of MU mean more Rifle nade) I forget to aware and get Squad wipe
back to topic if input fuse delay is should trade some buff like Dmg or AOE
or lower MU use IMO
14 May 2018, 08:00 AM
#7
Posts: 33
a minor damage reduction against yellow cover (10%) maybe it all that it needs. Greencover will protect you and squad usually spread out in open cover.
The issue is more to do with when the squad is bunched up next to a bush.
Same problem affects every faction, including Ostheer. I fail to see how nerfing the rifle grenade in such a way is a good idea. Every grenade can wipe squads in yellow cover, except for rifle grenades?
14 May 2018, 08:10 AM
#8
Posts: 17892 | Subs: 8
Same problem affects every faction, including Ostheer. I fail to see how nerfing the rifle grenade in such a way is a good idea. Every grenade can wipe squads in yellow cover, except for rifle grenades?
Given how modders hate literally everything and anything that can wipe squads, I wouldn't be surprised to see nades have this kind of reduction across the board or plain 60 damage in the future.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
14 May 2018, 08:31 AM
#9
Posts: 105
"I want to do everthing the same way" - guy again?
Why cant you boys just understand, that diversity in armies is what define unique expirience of playing them.
And, btw, german rifle nade is actually an remade HEAT grenade, so it should not have any sort of timer. At least i couldnt find anything about HE-rifle nades in wermacht. Correct me if im wrong.
that's what tester wants to do.
don't you undestand by seeing sov sniper n PIAT? they want to make balance just removing faction concepts.
ps. if you say sov sniper change is ok. your oppinion is so crappy in logic n you are totally axis fan boy noob.
14 May 2018, 11:10 AM
#10
Posts: 144
Given how modders hate literally everything and anything that can wipe squads, I wouldn't be surprised to see nades have this kind of reduction across the board or plain 60 damage in the future.
No problem with that if its just their own mod and not in a community mandated balance patch. Might as well remove all nades. Right.
Rifle nades have been nerfed several times and I rarely see them wipe. Like all nades (except USF nade and Penal satchels of course), they can wipe when all models are serously low on health. They can also wipe in the same conditions as SU 85s can wipe.
Otherwise, not so much.
14 May 2018, 17:58 PM
#11
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
No problem with that if its just their own mod and not in a community mandated balance patch. Might as well remove all nades. Right.
Rifle nades have been nerfed several times and I rarely see them wipe. Like all nades (except USF nade and Penal satchels of course), they can wipe when all models are serously low on health. They can also wipe in the same conditions as SU 85s can wipe.
Otherwise, not so much.
I don't think i have seen nerfs to Rifle nade since Beta. I think at some point they increase the cost and they removed the extra range on vet 2 but the weapon behaves equal since it's conception.
Edit:
Unless there's some ninjas, this is the changelog.
Rifle-grenade now cost 25 munitions
Updated AOE profile on Rifle Grenade (
Rifle-grenade munition cost from 25 to 30
Note: this were changes from +4 years ago.
Removed ability max range modifier at veterancy level 2
Grenadiers’ Rifle Grenade ability’s weapon delay decreased from 3 to 2.125
Note: this were changes from +2 years ago.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
15 May 2018, 04:14 AM
#12
Posts: 6
I don't think i have seen nerfs to Rifle nade since Beta. I think at some point they increase the cost and they removed the extra range on vet 2 but the weapon behaves equal since it's conception.
Edit:
Unless there's some ninjas, this is the changelog.
Rifle-grenade now cost 25 munitions
Updated AOE profile on Rifle Grenade (
Rifle-grenade munition cost from 25 to 30
Note: this were changes from +4 years ago.
Removed ability max range modifier at veterancy level 2
Grenadiers’ Rifle Grenade ability’s weapon delay decreased from 3 to 2.125
Note: this were changes from +2 years ago.
Don't forget the throw range when suppressed. That applies to all grenades, though.
Not complaining. Just felt it warranted inclusion.
15 May 2018, 04:37 AM
#13
Posts: 959
Rifle nade is fine? Not sure why it would need a change. Yes, it has more range, but it also has an incredibly obvious animation, and comes on a 4man squad that is both squishy early on, and awful at medium/close range for basically the entire game. Also the further you fire it the longer the travel time, so max-range rifle nades are incredibly easy to dodge.
If they could make it a CONSISTENT 60 damage, that would be great. The problem right now is that the damage is incredibly variable; sometimes it can insta-wipe a 5 man squad at full HP, other times it doesn't wipe a single model. I'd trade the RNG for consistency any time.
Given how modders hate literally everything and anything that can wipe squads, I wouldn't be surprised to see nades have this kind of reduction across the board or plain 60 damage in the future.
If they could make it a CONSISTENT 60 damage, that would be great. The problem right now is that the damage is incredibly variable; sometimes it can insta-wipe a 5 man squad at full HP, other times it doesn't wipe a single model. I'd trade the RNG for consistency any time.
Opinions reflect all team modes (not 1v1)
I often edit my posts several times after posting
I often edit my posts several times after posting
15 May 2018, 04:49 AM
#14
Posts: 1930
Rifle nade is fine? Not sure why it would need a change. Yes, it has more range, but it also has an incredibly obvious animation
You're almost always in range of the rifle nade, considering it has a range of 30.
enemy trying to throw a nade is blindingly obvious, because they are aggressively try to get close enough to throw it. Most player is wary of enemy squad getting with 20 meter.
meanwhile the riflenade can happen anytime there's a firefight since most fireflght happen under 30m.
15 May 2018, 05:39 AM
#15
Posts: 647
riflenades are the bestest nades imo, just not used in the same manner as regular nades.
using them right almost always guarantee a hit because they can fire from a range where they do not have to break cover, easily juking opponents and have them eat a couple of squad wipe nades.
aim them against squads in yellow cover and watch the wipes happen.
i really dont know the arguement of it having obvious cues, it isnt obvious when a full on push is going on, compared to infantry with regular nades breaking cover and pushing up aggressively into nade range.
using them right almost always guarantee a hit because they can fire from a range where they do not have to break cover, easily juking opponents and have them eat a couple of squad wipe nades.
aim them against squads in yellow cover and watch the wipes happen.
i really dont know the arguement of it having obvious cues, it isnt obvious when a full on push is going on, compared to infantry with regular nades breaking cover and pushing up aggressively into nade range.
15 May 2018, 06:17 AM
#16
Posts: 5279
I'd be behind reducing the damage to 60 in favor of a bit better AOE profile. Seems to be all in or nothing. I think some more consistency is what we need for potential wipe units not gutting them and leaving their rotting carcasses in the game to spread rot.
#stalinwept
15 May 2018, 18:09 PM
#17
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Don't forget the throw range when suppressed. That applies to all grenades, though.
Not complaining. Just felt it warranted inclusion.
TBF, i left it out cause it was a wide spread mechanic applied to all grenades.
other times it doesn't wipe a single model. I'd trade the RNG for consistency any time.
But there's no RNG on it i think. If your aim is good and models are clump together (cover), it will hit hard.
Alternative:
Speed up animation and flying by a certain amount and translate that to a timer when it lands. You keep the same time as now but translate the reaction from been able to watch the animation been done to seeing the grenade landing on your units.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
15 May 2018, 19:57 PM
#18
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
But there's no RNG on it i think. If your aim is good and models are clump together (cover), it will hit hard.
When models are clumped in cover, sometimes the rifle grenades kill 50-100% of the squad and other times they do like 50% health damage with no model drops. For the same kind of hits.
15 May 2018, 21:39 PM
#19
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
When models are clumped in cover, sometimes the rifle grenades kill 50-100% of the squad and other times they do like 50% health damage with no model drops. For the same kind of hits.
Because people perceive something as random, it doesn't mean it's random at all. Heavy cover reduces explosive damage by 50% when the direction of the grenade comes from the opposite side. LETHAL AoE (80dmg) is small (0.75) but mid range damage is still 60dmg (1.5). Normal nades follow the same damage profile but with different distance (1-2-3) and radius.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
16 May 2018, 01:05 AM
#20
Posts: 495 | Subs: 1
I’d like to see a small damage reduction to units in yellow cover from all forms of grenades, AoE and indirect fire, just to counter the clumping problem. Yellow cover is often worse than no cover right now and is counter intuitive at times.
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