Bring back Pack Howie suppression! kappa I do tend to agree that if USF Mortar gets increased range then Pack Howie will get neglected because the ability to retreat and be bought sooner will usually win over the Pak Howie's beefier AoE (Why invest 300+ Manpower on unit when you could have already gotten a 2nd mortar out if you really need indirect fire - especially if Mortars are better against garrisons which is when you usually need indirect fire).
Personally I'd like Pack Howie to be USFs designated support weapon wall buster - which Scott doesn't do that well against given it's long barrage CD and short autoattack range.
Pack Howitzer
9 May 2018, 15:20 PM
#21
Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1
9 May 2018, 16:30 PM
#22
Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1
They could make the pack howi the dedicated anti-bunker/garrison tool for USF. If I remember correctly the howi had smoke right? U can remove that and buff dmg against buildings and bunkers while keeping the USF mortar weak against garrisons and primarily used against static infantry/support weapons and smoke while the pack howi acts as a long-range anti-garrison unit to make them different and unique to one another.
bg /l
9 May 2018, 16:33 PM
#23
Posts: 17891 | Subs: 8
They could make the pack howi the dedicated anti-bunker/garrison tool for USF. If I remember correctly the howi had smoke right? U can remove that and buff dmg against buildings and bunkers while keeping the USF mortar weak against garrisons and primarily used against static infantry/support weapons and smoke while the pack howi acts as a long-range anti-garrison unit to make them different and unique to one another.
Pack howi never had smoke.
It have white phosphorous.
The mortar is literally anti garrison tool for USF, that is one of main two reasons it was implemented.
Plus, just go with what I've said early in the thread and pack howi will be both, unique and fixed.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
9 May 2018, 16:38 PM
#24
Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1
Pack howi never had smoke.
It have white phosphorous.
The mortar is literally anti garrison tool for USF, that is one of main two reasons it was implemented.
Plus, just go with what I've said early in the thread and pack howi will be both, unique and fixed.
Ah okay so it doesnt, I havent used the pack howi in ages and forgot.
I actually like your idea a lot, hopefully, something along that would come into a mod or something to test it out. My worry is that relic wouldn't allow something like that to happen in which just separating the two into specific roles would be more easy to implement instead.
bg /l
9 May 2018, 18:15 PM
#25
Posts: 1323 | Subs: 1
The planned buffs for it are good, I still think it should do 100 damage per shot, it either needs to be more rewarding to be put at risk to autoattack, or it's barrage needs to be a lot better to just use it as a Mini-Howitzer.
9 May 2018, 19:27 PM
#26
Posts: 17891 | Subs: 8
The planned buffs for it are good, I still think it should do 100 damage per shot, it either needs to be more rewarding to be put at risk to autoattack, or it's barrage needs to be a lot better to just use it as a Mini-Howitzer.
What buffs?
They want to make it into inferior mortar that can't retreat.
On a faction that already have a mortar.
That can retreat and is there to buy from get go.
They'll have equal range, equal damage, but one can retreat and other can't.
This is the one instance, where modders have absolutely no idea what they are doing.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
9 May 2018, 21:03 PM
#27
Posts: 495 | Subs: 1
So far, the best proposal is to rework the pack howi into a mobile on map howitzer that has no auto attack but instead has a sustained barrage that is effective at area denial and clearing buildings and garrisons, but lacks the one hit killing power of a buildable on map howitzer like the doctrinal WH and Sov howitzers and also has less range compared to those units, but better range than a mortar.
“Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the Marines don't have that problem.” ― Ronald Reagan
Semper Fi
Semper Fi
9 May 2018, 21:06 PM
#28
Posts: 2742
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
9 May 2018, 23:01 PM
#29
Posts: 2243
USF has scott...wgich wipes so many units...even when its drive...its awefull...guge range...high accuracy
10 May 2018, 01:12 AM
#30
Posts: 1323 | Subs: 1
USF has scott...wgich wipes so many units...even when its drive...its awefull...guge range...high accuracy
The Scott can only do that, kill infantry, it's good at the only thing it does.
10 May 2018, 03:08 AM
#31
Posts: 1930
The 81mm mortar was added in the first place because having their only non-doctrinal garrison clearer locked behind Captain tech was deemed too crippling by Relic.
The 81mm isn't amazing at clearing out emplacements and buildings but it can do it. Before that USF could be screwed over by a simple bunker if their early game went suboptimally.
it honestly was not an issue for the USF to get the delayed pack howitzer.
the USF will always beat the wehr to the midpoint in any 1v1 game, and the rifleman is better than the grenadier in an urban environment. It's extremely unlikely for the wehr to lock down an entire 1v1 map.
If you're in that of a hurry you can still get grenades and smoke.
in the early game only the stormpio can actively beat the rifleman at close range.
We already tried to give the USF a wehr 81mm clone. It break the game balance.
What buffs?
They want to make it into inferior mortar that can't retreat.
On a faction that already have a mortar.
That can retreat and is there to buy from get go.
They'll have equal range, equal damage, but one can retreat and other can't.
This is the one instance, where modders have absolutely no idea what they are doing.
the 81mm needs to go and the smoke be given back to the rifleman.
the pack howie needs the ability to retreat.
11 May 2018, 18:29 PM
#32
Posts: 495 | Subs: 1
The way I see it, either the US mortar should be removed, allowing the Pack Howitzer to become the US dedicated only light artillery piece, or the Pack Howitzer needs to be reworked into a the proposed barrage only mobile on map artillery unit.
For sake of interesting gameplay I hope the spring balance patch attempts to implement the latter.
Dear God (modders), if you’re listening, please do this for us.... send us a sign. Lol
For sake of interesting gameplay I hope the spring balance patch attempts to implement the latter.
Dear God (modders), if you’re listening, please do this for us.... send us a sign. Lol
“Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the Marines don't have that problem.” ― Ronald Reagan
Semper Fi
Semper Fi
12 May 2018, 20:28 PM
#33
Posts: 728
make it like the ISG from actuall game patch: never kill a model..even when u hit 1m in front of it...bad aiming and reload time.
not that huge range high explosive like actually.
#FactsAreFunny
You know what counters the bofors and desent cost 1000000 mp. Lieg!
13 May 2018, 02:01 AM
#34
Posts: 3053
PACK howi should never be standarized to a mere mortar.
With requierment of 3 men crew and being very slow, it always should be long range focused.
USF already has a mortar, 2nd one that requires bigger crew and can't retreat is not needed, its beyond me how did it even happened to even get the idea.
However only longer range will also not cut it as then it'll be vastly inferior 120mm.
I've said it once in the past, I'll say it again with a small update:
Was it up to me, I'd make PACK howi act as an actual, mobile howi.
Performance somewhere between sexton and 120mm, BARRAGE ONLY, 160 range.
Price, pop, cooldown, number of shells adjusted to desired effect.
This way USF receives something akin to other factions rocket arty, but not just a copy and it wouldn't be long term muni strain, like Major arty is.
This. It always frustrated me how the pack howie was some sort of weird merger between mortars and howies that it never had any business being, and I think that’s why it’s such a problematic unit. IMO it should also shoot more than 3 shells per barrage if such a change was made.
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13 May 2018, 12:41 PM
#35
Posts: 50
2 major issues with this pack howie is the cost and the competitiveness of its tier. In the current meta lieutnant is way better than captain tech, mostly because of those 50.cals.
not sure in 1v1, but in 2v2s it's utility is way more limited, quickly hardcountered by stukas (not so strange to see a fast stuka in team games).
not sure in 1v1, but in 2v2s it's utility is way more limited, quickly hardcountered by stukas (not so strange to see a fast stuka in team games).
13 May 2018, 20:10 PM
#36
Posts: 868 | Subs: 5
I never understood why they removed suppression from artillery/katyusha/
Panzerwerfer and what not.
... Isn't that INVITING everyone to blob?
People complain the Soviets are useless.
Well, they are useless if you fight your units 1vs1. But they are all about Synergy.
What do I care if you have a Panther? Once you are crippled from running over a mine
I wait until you repair it with your 3x SturmPioneers and tell my 3x Mortars to fire at it.
did you know Vet 1 Mortars get FLARE?!
- 900 Manpower down the drain. - Panther still can't move worth a damn.
Well, they are useless if you fight your units 1vs1. But they are all about Synergy.
What do I care if you have a Panther? Once you are crippled from running over a mine
I wait until you repair it with your 3x SturmPioneers and tell my 3x Mortars to fire at it.
did you know Vet 1 Mortars get FLARE?!
- 900 Manpower down the drain. - Panther still can't move worth a damn.
13 May 2018, 20:29 PM
#37
Posts: 17891 | Subs: 8
I never understood why they removed suppression from artillery/katyusha/
Panzerwerfer and what not.
... Isn't that INVITING everyone to blob?
Pwerfer suppresses just fine.
Its hard to notice, because it just wipes the squad.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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