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What is the weakness from Jackson?

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15 Jan 2018, 19:54 PM
#201
avatar of Mr.Flush

Posts: 450

It is not very dumb argument. Usf does well in open maps where their at guns and jaksons excel, but they do worse in maps with plenty of shot blockers. Okw p4s and reketans prove superior in these maps.

So the big question is how would you change each faction to combat the other in these maps?

15 Jan 2018, 20:12 PM
#202
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

It is not very dumb argument. Usf does well in open maps where their at guns and jaksons excel, but they do worse in maps with plenty of shot blockers. Okw p4s and reketans prove superior in these maps.

So the big question is how would you change each faction to combat the other in these maps?

u are missing trhe point this thread is about the lack of weakness of jackson not about balancing each unit to all maps , the jackson has speed, relod ,range,pen,turret
for example FF lack speed and fast turret rotation, the su 85 lack turret and is slow, the jagd panzer same but trade armor for pen,the stug lack range, the panther is in good spot:snfPeter::snfPeter::snfPeter:
15 Jan 2018, 20:29 PM
#203
avatar of Mr.Flush

Posts: 450

The jakson was buffed because usfs late game was non-existent. You are pushing your point to make usf seem like they can't be beaten. The Weakness to jakson is heavy td destroyers, or you can use shot blockers to your advantage. Usf does not have any other options to deal with heavies. The game would be better balanced if the jakson was a little worse, but usf would need better mediums tank in return. You have to consider the faction in which the jakson belongs to.
15 Jan 2018, 20:58 PM
#204
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

The jakson was buffed because usfs late game was non-existent. You are pushing your point to make usf seem like they can't be beaten. The Weakness to jakson is heavy td destroyers, or you can use shot blockers to your advantage. Usf does not have any other options to deal with heavies. The game would be better balanced if the jakson was a little worse, but usf would need better mediums tank in return. You have to consider the faction in which the jakson belongs to.
just make the range 55(so at gun can out range it while still outraging all the heavy and medium bar the jadg panzer) or lower the mobility and turret traverse time (so 2 medium might be able to flank and kill it)
15 Jan 2018, 21:22 PM
#205
avatar of Mr.Flush

Posts: 450

just make the range 55(so at gun can out range it while still outraging all the heavy and medium bar the jadg panzer) or lower the mobility and turret traverse time (so 2 medium might be able to flank and kill it)


Thank you for an actual suggestion! My suggestion would be to nerf the rate of fire and speed on the jakson, but increase its pen so the dps remains the same against heavy armor. A p4 will be able to 1v1 a jakson with its slower rof. Also, I would add a tier 4 to usf. Tier 4 would require extra fuel and mp and include access to easy 8s. Easy 8s are able to fight versus okw p4's where normal Sherman tanks cannot take on okw p4s.
15 Jan 2018, 21:43 PM
#206
avatar of mondeogaming1

Posts: 464

M-36 has the highest mobility of 60 range TD, has a turret, one of the highest moving modifier, a high penetration and 360 sight radius bonus.



wekaness from:

Jagdpz4: can only see to in a little part on front, is slow, no turrent, flankable, not usefull in urban maps
su76: no armor, no hp, no turrent, flankable
su85: can only see to in a little part on front, no turrent, flankable, not usefull in urban
firefly: flankable, less armor and HP
Jackson: ....

what is the wekaness from jackson?
omg leave jackson alone and firefo6 has more armor go play yout still OP UKF
15 Jan 2018, 21:44 PM
#207
avatar of Highfiveeeee

Posts: 1740

Answering the real topic:

M36 Jackson, weaknesses: AT infantry and AT guns, where it both can't do a single shit against. Case closed.

Against the inf you get an MG or two, case closed again.

It seems like you have a problem fighting combined arms, which is the way the game should be played. And in addition you seem to like whining.
15 Jan 2018, 22:29 PM
#208
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

Answering the real topic:

M36 Jackson, weaknesses: AT infantry and AT guns, where it both can't do a single shit against. Case closed.

Against the inf you get an MG or two, case closed again.

It seems like you have a problem fighting combined arms, which is the way the game should be played. And in addition you seem to like whining.
again he means weakeness compared to other tank , if so the m42at gun is a good at guns cause it's wekaness is infatry not the low pen and damage right ?
or even more absurd : make a 360 hmg arc woth instan pin but it's balnced guys cause its weak to tank and indirect fire right ? u see the point now ?
15 Jan 2018, 22:36 PM
#209
avatar of Kharn

Posts: 264



Thank you for an actual suggestion! My suggestion would be to nerf the rate of fire and speed on the jakson, but increase its pen so the dps remains the same against heavy armor. A p4 will be able to 1v1 a jakson with its slower rof. Also, I would add a tier 4 to usf. Tier 4 would require extra fuel and mp and include access to easy 8s. Easy 8s are able to fight versus okw p4's where normal Sherman tanks cannot take on okw p4s.



Use combined arms to fight, everyones yelled that at allied players for ages, and when axis has to use combined arms to counter a threat its basically impossible even if they have some of the best tools for the job.
15 Jan 2018, 22:36 PM
#210
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474



Thank you for an actual suggestion! My suggestion would be to nerf the rate of fire and speed on the jakson, but increase its pen so the dps remains the same against heavy armor. A p4 will be able to 1v1 a jakson with its slower rof. Also, I would add a tier 4 to usf. Tier 4 would require extra fuel and mp and include access to easy 8s. Easy 8s are able to fight versus okw p4's where normal Sherman tanks cannot take on okw p4s.
to me we could make the m 10 stock too if medium tank are a problem , with a price increase of course (i'm always in to adding more units to factions)
15 Jan 2018, 22:39 PM
#211
avatar of Kharn

Posts: 264

to me we could make the m 10 stock too if medium tank are a problem , with a price increase of course (i'm always in to adding more units to factions)


This is actually one of the main problems. When you duke it out tank vs tank, the jacksons really the only viable solution you can come up with non-doctrinally. The Sherman really can't fight off other mediums reliably at all, so everyone is just dumping into the jackson.

Even the m10 isn't great, and it shouldn't be considering its so cheap, it's like a beefy Su76, that seems.. worse?

Nobody makes shermans...
15 Jan 2018, 22:44 PM
#212
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Jan 2018, 22:39 PMKharn


This is actually one of the main problems. When you duke it out tank vs tank, the jacksons really the only viable solution you can come up with non-doctrinally. The Sherman really can't fight off other mediums reliably at all, so everyone is just dumping into the jackson.

Even the m10 isn't great, and it shouldn't be considering its so cheap, it's like a beefy Su76, that seems.. worse?

Nobody makes shermans...
dude the m10 is a beast medium td (think of it as a fusion betwenn the old jackson and the stug) 160 pen that can be bosted to 225 with ap round , 50 range , 560 life, zooomy tank,has flanking speed (oh the old 4 m10 vs kt all to the rear)
16 Jan 2018, 07:15 AM
#213
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243

its funny thats the only weakness is AI from jackson, while all other TDs have this weakness.


i mean a explicit weakness like to have no turrent, slowly, low accurracy etc


i mean a explicit weakness compared to other TDs.


i cant find one. its the best TD in game
16 Jan 2018, 09:14 AM
#214
avatar of zarok47

Posts: 587

Answering the real topic:

M36 Jackson, weaknesses: AT infantry and AT guns, where it both can't do a single shit against. Case closed.

Against the inf you get an MG or two, case closed again.

It seems like you have a problem fighting combined arms, which is the way the game should be played. And in addition you seem to like whining.


jump backJump back to quoted post15 Jan 2018, 22:36 PMKharn



Use combined arms to fight, everyones yelled that at allied players for ages, and when axis has to use combined arms to counter a threat its basically impossible even if they have some of the best tools for the job.


You see, when this exact argument was brought up to defend the elephant, it was screamed at that the elephant was not alone.

It was supported by the rest of the army. And so is the jackson.

Any argument you guys make in favor of the jackson is one that has been made for the elephant/JT in the past.

Neither is/was okay.

If you still think jackson is ok, we should bring back 85 range JT which ignores shotblockers but remove the AI barrage.

Since it won't do jack shit vs infantry.............

16 Jan 2018, 09:23 AM
#215
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243

Solution: weaken the jackson and give USF a commander with a T28 or T95 or something.

so usf can have a good lategame with a doctrinal OP TD with huge price tag...and not have cheap OP BS unit like now
16 Jan 2018, 10:02 AM
#216
avatar of Highfiveeeee

Posts: 1740

jump backJump back to quoted post16 Jan 2018, 09:14 AMzarok47




You see, when this exact argument was brought up to defend the elephant, it was screamed at that the elephant was not alone.

It was supported by the rest of the army. And so is the jackson.

Any argument you guys make in favor of the jackson is one that has been made for the elephant/JT in the past.

Neither is/was okay.

If you still think jackson is ok, we should bring back 85 range JT which ignores shotblockers but remove the AI barrage.

Since it won't do jack shit vs infantry.............



I don't think that anyone here besides the hardest Axis fanboys will deny that Elefant and JT where OP in team games. The Jackson still has a paper armor though. I had a game yesterday where a dug up Ostwind beat up a Jackson so badly that it had to retreat with a destroyed gun.

Additionally the large range of Jackson is almost twice as big as its view range (afaik 35 to 60). So without a proper spotter it is useless.
16 Jan 2018, 10:12 AM
#217
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243




Additionally the large range of Jackson is almost twice as big as its view range (afaik 35 to 60). So without a proper spotter it is useless.


you tell us "alternative Fakten" or..you lie.

Look again the vet bouns from jackson and come here again with the right info about its view range.
16 Jan 2018, 10:15 AM
#218
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1


...
Additionally the large range of Jackson is almost twice as big as its view range (afaik 35 to 60). So without a proper spotter it is useless.

We have been thru this before the sight range is unrestricted 40 and 45 at vet 2, which is more than all axis Tds.
16 Jan 2018, 10:49 AM
#219
avatar of zarok47

Posts: 587



I don't think that anyone here besides the hardest Axis fanboys will deny that Elefant and JT where OP in team games. The Jackson still has a paper armor though. I had a game yesterday where a dug up Ostwind beat up a Jackson so badly that it had to retreat with a destroyed gun.

Additionally the large range of Jackson is almost twice as big as its view range (afaik 35 to 60). So without a proper spotter it is useless.


Ele/jt lacked a turret and had shitty mobility so could be flanked.
In theory that is.

In practice, the superior range made all the difference. With the jackson, there is mobility and superior sight aswell (40 at vet0).

Armor that can bounce p4 shots (watch the Dave vs talisman game) is not paper and even when it was, it's not a weakness when said p4 cannot even get close to a jackson.

16 Jan 2018, 12:04 PM
#220
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243


yeah..loks like the jackson has no armor, is like from papoer and german armor have high accuracy ..even when still standing and raketen can do its job..

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/218826084?t=57m26s
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