I'm not suggesting this should be in the game, I only want to discuss with you guys if this would be any good and what it would mean for the game.
In order to prevent spamming one single unit, I was thinking, what if it's population cost would be exponential ? meaning, if you get 2 maxims, the second one costs more in pop cap then the first one, and the third one more then the second one etc... this would make it very expensive population cap wise to spam unit sort of unit. Of course, the numbers should be different depending on the unit.
Thoughts ?
Exponential Unit Pop Cost ? (Discussion)
15 Jun 2014, 16:54 PM
#1
1 
Posts: 1006
15 Jun 2014, 17:32 PM
#2
Posts: 431
That would be nice. It would destroy every spam, no matter what faction or what unit and would better the meta.
15 Jun 2014, 17:36 PM
#3
Posts: 17891 | Subs: 8
It would also completely destroy balance of... all factions except ostseehr.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
15 Jun 2014, 18:02 PM
#4
1 
Posts: 3052 | Subs: 15
+1
Maybe Do the same thing for fuel as well.
Maybe Do the same thing for fuel as well.
15 Jun 2014, 18:10 PM
#5
Posts: 2115 | Subs: 1
Nein.
servant to the vet 5 königskübel
b4 and soviet FHQ enthusiast
fan of the illustrious black prince
b4 and soviet FHQ enthusiast
fan of the illustrious black prince
15 Jun 2014, 21:40 PM
#6
Posts: 783 | Subs: 3
I still think it's silly that people don't like when someone makes a bunch of one unit. It's an RTS. Sometimes there are good strategies that revolve around building one unit, and any time you are relying on a single unit there is going to be a counter to that unit your opponent can build.
That idiot thought he won. In fact, he was wrong. Completely mistaken.No M3 he what things are not，just one moron.
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
15 Jun 2014, 22:17 PM
#7
1 Posts: 889 | Subs: 1
It would also completely destroy balance of... all factions except ostseehr.
This is they key here. Soviets generally only access 2 of 4 Tiers. Why do Soviets spam Maxims, Snipers, Scout Cars, Penals, etc? Mostly because Conscripts scale worse than any other factions infantry. The faction is designed to limit combined arms, and this idea would deepen the limitation.
15 Jun 2014, 22:18 PM
#8
5 Posts: 1157 | Subs: 2
This would limit play styles and build orders too much IMO. Relic should try to balance the game by giving all units a proper counter, even if spammed. A developer trying to force a particular play style on their playerbase isn't going to make people feel like they have the freedom to play the way they want.
15 Jun 2014, 22:38 PM
#9
Posts: 1617
Give the soviets higher upkeep + supply yard, Ostheer only needs more expensive squads MVGame 
15 Jun 2014, 22:45 PM
#10
Posts: 2487 | Subs: 21
I honestly wouldn't mind this. +1 OP
15 Jun 2014, 22:48 PM
#11
4 Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2
This is they key here. Soviets generally only access 2 of 4 Tiers. Why do Soviets spam Maxims, Snipers, Scout Cars, Penals, etc? Mostly because Conscripts scale worse than any other factions infantry. The faction is designed to limit combined arms, and this idea would deepen the limitation.
+1.
back to OP...
different exponential values are too complicated. and you get punished for having two of the same unit?
con spam, penal spam with guards, maxim spam, "sniper spam (2 snipers)", m3 spam are supposed to be viable strat options IMO... yes, as many do think, some of those options maybe too good (i'm not saying anything), but that does not mean you nerf the spams by just punishing one faction EXPONENTIALLY over the other.
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15 Jun 2014, 23:27 PM
#12
Posts: 2053
Not possible. Popcap is entitled to each model/entity - How would conscript squad merging work? Popcap values would be changing all the time and screw every game up. Too much of a hassle, there are better ways to counter spam.
15 Jun 2014, 23:29 PM
#13
1 Posts: 1006
Not possible. Popcap is entitled to each model/entity - How would conscript squad merging work? Popcap values would be changing all the time and screw every game up. Too much of a hassle, there are better ways to counter spam.
that's a good point
15 Jun 2014, 23:49 PM
#14
Posts: 4928
My favourate potential solution is to just punish blobbing. The more of X you have in one area, the higher the accuracy penalty against them is. Make it so that rifle fire into blobs kills several people, or MG suppresses and tears into them. I hate that blobs can charge into machineguns and actually have a chance to win.
The logic of increased incoming accuracy is if 20 people are charging at you and you shoot back, even if you're a bad shot, you'll probably hit SOMEONE. It's so weird seeing an MG 42 or Maxim shoot into a large crowd of people and only kill a couple before being forced off.
The logic of increased incoming accuracy is if 20 people are charging at you and you shoot back, even if you're a bad shot, you'll probably hit SOMEONE. It's so weird seeing an MG 42 or Maxim shoot into a large crowd of people and only kill a couple before being forced off.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
15 Jun 2014, 23:50 PM
#15
Posts: 783 | Subs: 3
This would limit play styles and build orders too much IMO. Relic should try to balance the game by giving all units a proper counter, even if spammed. A developer trying to force a particular play style on their playerbase isn't going to make people feel like they have the freedom to play the way they want.
This is a really good point. Punishing building more than one unit forces very specific builds, and you'd end up seeing much less variety in builds.
That idiot thought he won. In fact, he was wrong. Completely mistaken.No M3 he what things are not，just one moron.
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
16 Jun 2014, 00:02 AM
#16
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
My favourate potential solution is to just punish blobbing. The more of X you have in one area, the higher the accuracy penalty against them is. Make it so that rifle fire into blobs kills several people, or MG suppresses and tears into them. I hate that blobs can charge into machineguns and actually have a chance to win.
The logic of increased incoming accuracy is if 20 people are charging at you and you shoot back, even if you're a bad shot, you'll probably hit SOMEONE. It's so weird seeing an MG 42 or Maxim shoot into a large crowd of people and only kill a couple before being forced off.
Bingo.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
16 Jun 2014, 00:29 AM
#17
9 
Posts: 2072 | Subs: 1
This would limit play styles and build orders too much IMO. Relic should try to balance the game by giving all units a proper counter, even if spammed. A developer trying to force a particular play style on their playerbase isn't going to make people feel like they have the freedom to play the way they want.
This. Build orders will become so predictable that you're going to be bored after only a few weeks.
16 Jun 2014, 01:28 AM
#18
Posts: 611
This is a really good point. Punishing building more than one unit forces very specific builds, and you'd end up seeing much less variety in builds.
This is true and ost builds atm are a very good example of how boring limited builds can become. The problem is infantry heavey builds into call ins. The upkeep and pop size of infantry and support weapons needs to be looked at imo. Further more I would adjust cps and manpower req for callins. If someone wants to use t1 and t2 and stall for callins then that should remain a legit strat but only vs an opponent doing the same strat. If the opponent opts to tech then they should gain the advantage until callins arrive.
Going heavey t1 / t2 is actually a viable counter to t3 / t4 and slightly favours sov when used in conjunction with guards spam, mines and at nades. This seems imbalanced imo...
16 Jun 2014, 01:37 AM
#19
5 Posts: 1157 | Subs: 2
My favourate potential solution is to just punish blobbing. The more of X you have in one area, the higher the accuracy penalty against them is. Make it so that rifle fire into blobs kills several people, or MG suppresses and tears into them. I hate that blobs can charge into machineguns and actually have a chance to win.
The logic of increased incoming accuracy is if 20 people are charging at you and you shoot back, even if you're a bad shot, you'll probably hit SOMEONE. It's so weird seeing an MG 42 or Maxim shoot into a large crowd of people and only kill a couple before being forced off.
I like this idea a lot, and actually suggested it on the alpha forums. Blobs require very limited tactical thought, and it makes sense both logically and from a game design stand point for there to be some sort of increase in leathlity based on the number of units in proximity. Hopefully something like this gets implemented.
16 Jun 2014, 02:15 AM
#20
Posts: 611
I like this idea a lot, and actually suggested it on the alpha forums. Blobs require very limited tactical thought, and it makes sense both logically and from a game design stand point for there to be some sort of increase in leathlity based on the number of units in proximity. Hopefully something like this gets implemented.
While I think this idea is appealing, implementing it may not be worth the effort. Players that adopt this play style are easily countered by getting extra mg / maxims and then dropping incendiary / arty on the pinned squads thus forcing mass retreat. At which time you can spam mines/ s mines and punish them when they return to the field. Once it is evident that a player is blobbing building extra mg/maxim and keeping them together is the appropriate response.
What is difficult to depend against is 5 - 7 squads attacking from multiple directions which highlights the advantage of infantry heavy builds.
Edit : This is entirely situational and map dependand and does highlight how a player needs multiple strats in coh2.
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