Why panzerfusiliers are buildable?
30 Jan 2020, 11:09 AM
#1
Posts: 1389 | Subs: 1
I would like to know, why this squad, unlike any other doctrinal infantry unit in the game, is buildable from HQ and not working as call-in. Is there any balance reason for that or what?
30 Jan 2020, 11:10 AM
#2
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
It’s an alternative mainline infantry unit, not a special call in squad.
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30 Jan 2020, 11:19 AM
#3
Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1
I do not see any reason balance wise.
Osttruppen are also alternative mainlines and are call in.
It would only make some sense if Pf where designed as an "alternative/replacing" option to completely replace VG similar how Penal replaced conscripts but that is not the case according to the MOD team.
Osttruppen are also alternative mainlines and are call in.
It would only make some sense if Pf where designed as an "alternative/replacing" option to completely replace VG similar how Penal replaced conscripts but that is not the case according to the MOD team.
30 Jan 2020, 12:32 PM
#4
Posts: 1389 | Subs: 1
It’s an alternative mainline infantry unit, not a special call in squad.
Other units, who supposed to be replacement for mainline infantry, are on 0CP or close to it (like cavrifles) and are call-in. So, i think it was not a reason here.
I make this thread to get some official approvement for balance reason. If it's not because of balance - i would like to vote for make it call-in on 0CP, like any other infantry call-in.
30 Jan 2020, 12:40 PM
#5
Posts: 17884 | Subs: 8
Other units, who supposed to be replacement for mainline infantry, are on 0CP or close to it (like cavrifles) and are call-in. So, i think it was not a reason here.
Cav rifles are in no way replacement for rifles. Just like assault grens and assault engies or assault tommies are NOT replacement for mainline. Neither are osttruppen, just to be fully clear.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
30 Jan 2020, 12:43 PM
#6
Posts: 1389 | Subs: 1
Cav rifles are in no way replacement for rifles. Just like assault grens and assault engies or assault tommies are NOT replacement for mainline. Neither are osttruppen, just to be fully clear.
So, there is no builds in the game, based on MG42 + Assgrens/Osttruppen or assenginers instead of rifles and etc. Got it.
30 Jan 2020, 12:50 PM
#7
Posts: 17884 | Subs: 8
So, there is no builds in the game, based on MG42 + Assgrens/Osttruppen or assenginers instead of rifles and etc. Got it.
That makes these units just as much of a mainline as it makes Ambulance an assault a troop transport akin to UC or M3 just because you can put rifles inside.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
30 Jan 2020, 13:08 PM
#8
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
There is literally no reason whatsoever to make Pfusies a call in infantry unit just like other call in doctrinal infantry. Just because it’s different doesn’t mean it’s wrong.
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30 Jan 2020, 16:49 PM
#9
Posts: 2358
Ill tell you OP why. When PF got reworked into what they are now, with the grand offensive commander. The Pshrek upgrade specially, started a huge forum war because mostly allied players said they are going to be volkshreks 2.0, OPAF to keep it short.
To keep the beasts tamed the dev team proceed to nerf the squad in rather stupid ways, like decreasing its squad size, make it buildable and other stuff.
Doom prophets are always wrong, literally always.
To keep the beasts tamed the dev team proceed to nerf the squad in rather stupid ways, like decreasing its squad size, make it buildable and other stuff.
Doom prophets are always wrong, literally always.
30 Jan 2020, 16:54 PM
#10
Posts: 4474
Because they need a weakness other than : costing 270 mp but performing same as cons, when upgraded costing more than penal for equal dps performance, when upgrading to shreck losing at nade
only allies are allowed to have better stuff in doctrine than stock : easy 8 and t34 85 > ost doc p4 and okw p4, stv cons> volks stg, penal ppsh > assault gren strom mp40
so pfusi need to be worse than stock inf and not at least the same
only allies are allowed to have better stuff in doctrine than stock : easy 8 and t34 85 > ost doc p4 and okw p4, stv cons> volks stg, penal ppsh > assault gren strom mp40
so pfusi need to be worse than stock inf and not at least the same
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
30 Jan 2020, 17:43 PM
#11
Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1
Probably to avoid the early game powerspike of having Sturms, volks and a Fussie squad out by the same time as a soviet player has 1 combat engineer and 1 Conscript out. To avoid the power spike, the unit would need to have a very long cool down, but if the cooldown is very long, then you cannot use fussies as a replacement for your volks. Solution: make them buildable in the HQ so you cannot get them and Volks at the same time.
30 Jan 2020, 18:56 PM
#12
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Probably to avoid the early game powerspike of having Sturms, volks and a Fussie squad out by the same time as a soviet player has 1 combat engineer and 1 Conscript out. To avoid the power spike, the unit would need to have a very long cool down, but if the cooldown is very long, then you cannot use fussies as a replacement for your volks. Solution: make them buildable in the HQ so you cannot get them and Volks at the same time.
Get that logic out of my forums
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
30 Jan 2020, 19:16 PM
#13
Posts: 2358
Probably to avoid the early game powerspike of having Sturms, volks and a Fussie squad out by the same time as a soviet player has 1 combat engineer and 1 Conscript out.
First, there are 3 allied factions, only SU has the weakest start unless they go T1.
SU
400MP - 240 (conscripts). When the first squad finishes SU has 290MP left and +290MP/min. No T1/T2 built.
But certainly SU can field another cons squad immediatly after
OKW
320MP - 260 (volks). When the volks squad is trained, OKW has 170MP and + 278MP/min. It takes roughly 30 seconds more to field a PF call in if it could be done.
The mentioned powerspike is not existant.
30 Jan 2020, 19:20 PM
#14
Posts: 563
They were rather obnoxious to use when they were 2 cp call in. They were bit better than volks sure, but buying them at the time you had already fielded plenty of volks screwd them over. I personally like them this way more.
"Pain is almost euphoric sam!"
30 Jan 2020, 20:01 PM
#15
Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1
Because they need a weakness other than : costing 270 mp but performing same as cons
Pretty good deal since cons need to spend MP and fuel to get worse snares AND worse grenades that fussies come with. The post below yours explains perfectly why fussies can't be called in
30 Jan 2020, 20:25 PM
#18
Posts: 3260
I would like to know, why this squad, unlike any other doctrinal infantry unit in the game, is buildable from HQ and not working as call-in. Is there any balance reason for that or what?
Call-ins don't share a build queue with T0 units, which lets you deploy infantry faster.
The point of Panzerfusiliers is to be an alternative opening for OKW: less powerful initially but with more powerful upgrades which allow them to scale better into the late game.
Making them call-ins would improve Breakthrough and Grand Offensive's early game, which is counterproductive to the design goals of the unit.
30 Jan 2020, 20:26 PM
#19
Posts: 4474
I'm ok with not being a call in if it did not have all the other weight around it
Pretty good deal since cons need to spend MP and fuel to get worse snares AND worse grenades that fussies come with. The post below yours explains perfectly why fussies can't be called in
katitof-2018
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