I am not asking for an overnerf for a unit. Just make it less no brainer and punishing when you give your rear to enemy (Spoiler alert : Just like any other heavy tank)
Pretty much. I've yet to see any justification as to why flanking (or really bad plays) should be so unrewarding for this specific heavy, when it's devastating to (almost) every other one (and those others should be looked at, too). |
And we are talking about the churchill crocodile, aren't we ? As far as i know, it is doctrinal and cost 230 fuel.
If you want to bring the normal churchill in the argument then dont forget thet KT is stock, too, so the "They're also all doc-locked" need a correction.
Both fair points, not sure how I missed the KT. Regardless, all other heavies had their rear-armor nerfed a while back to at most 140.
LOL Panthers and King Tigers aren't "doc locked"
Well, the panther is a premium medium with 90 rear armor, and Heavy Sapper already pointed out I missed the KT somehow. |
And all of the tanks that got this treatment had very potent main guns that never bounced off of mediums.
They're also all doc-locked and significantly more expensive units, too; of course they're going to be more powerful. It doesn't excuse the churchill sitting far above the curve. |
Well it doesn't matter if it happens to have the highest rear armor of any other tank that's irrelevant. What does matter is how much more does it have than the next highest tank and what is that?
What? Yes, the value does matter. Tanks were brought down from exactly 180 rear armor (and higher) because it was making flanking too unrewarding. That +40 rear armor over other heavies might not seem like a lot, but it actually is, since a TON of AT sources sit between 140 and 180 pen. |
Oh no you found another Allied unit that Wehrmacht and OKW can't mop the floor with, get out the nerf hammer!
It's normalization, not a nerf random nerf. The June 21st 2016 patch had this specific section:
Developer Comments: We felt the risk associated with flanking a Heavy Armored Vehicle was much too great because of the high rear armor. To help balance this risk vs reward we are reducing rear armor on all heavy armor across the board.
Soviet IS-2 rear armor reduced from 205 to 140
Wehrmacht Tiger & Tiger Ace rear armored reduced from 180 to 140
Wehrmacht Elefant rear armor reduced from 150 to 110
OKW Jagdtiger rear armor reduced from 150 to 110
OKW King Tiger rear armor reduced from 225 to 150
British Comet Tank rear armor reduced from 180 to 130
For some reason the Churchill was missed, and still sits at 180 rear armor - significantly higher than any other heavy, both in terms of raw value, and in terms of front:rear armor ratio. |
Yes. I don't know why such a powerful unit like the MG42 is T0 especially on these small maps were you win the game in 2 minutes just by rushing it into a building
Swapping Grens with the MG42's tech position wouldn't really change much. T1 only takes a handful (30s?) to build, so it would only delay the MG42 by that much; meanwhile Grens would be hitting the field earlier. If anything, the swap might actually ( slightly) buff OST, since they'd be able to defend the MG42 better while it's moving around, making early MG-stealing (or flanking) much harder.
This is really a non-issue. |
I don't think there's a need to complicate things with extra units. The 221 -> 222 upgrade from ages ago was replaced with just the normal 222, because it was an awkward system to use and balance. I'd just make the WASP (and/or vickers) upgrade similar to the OKW 221's "FuG 21 Radio Set" upgrade, where it not only gives a new ability (in the UC's case, a flamer or MG), but also increases HP and armor. Then make the upgrade pre-req some tech and cost a decent amount of MP/F to justify the buff.
My answer is to scrap the upgrade and split the 222 into two different units similar to what was done with the wasp and vicker. Current 221 will remain at current stats in tier 2 but only has access to mg upgrade.
222 can be built for a mirror cost of the AEC fuel, armour ,pen and health buffed to AEC level to match
Not sure if you're serious or not, but an AEC-level 222 would be incredibly strong. +30mp/+30f/+3pop for 6.1x the armor (9 -> 55) and +80hp, not to mention the DPS and armor-pen increases. OST is currently held back a lot by not having a strong LV (that can actually fight other LVs effectively), so this would be a huge buff.
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In general, ALL mainline infantry units need a nerf. They've been power-creeped over the years so far that some of the core game designs don't really hold up anymore (blobs winning vs MGs head-on). |
TFW rifles are more expensive than tommies 
Not just that, now the Vet3 double-bren blobs do even more damage (well, slightly more). Really not sure how this is justified. |
i actually prefer them small
something like vaux or lierneux is way too big for 2v2
Pretty much, yea. The "big" maps like "Fields of Winnekendonk", "Vaux Farmlands" and even "Elst Outskirts" are far too big, imo. For me, the 480x352 size maps are perfect; big enough to allow for some interesting plays, but small enough that FRP-factions aren't at a massive advantage. |
Doomlord52
Relic Entertainment
cblanco ★ 
