You quoted the patch notes and should know that their performance against vehicles was not effected The build was though to beat before the patch and it still is now.
I'm not sure if nerfing guards ai would be helpful since then the unit goes back to not being used besides the people that specifically want to go for that strat. A better route would be to have a one man/woman sniper and limit the guards' slow ability to anything above light vehicles (excluding them) or remove it. That way it is possible to dive with light vehicles to chase a sniper down.
All changes are always included in patch notes aren't they. Only mods can answer for sure, and I was unaware of any At changes until watching tightrope stream last night and he said deflection damage was too high on guards and from in game performance that looked to be true.
However, the real issue is how good guards are at AI because it gives soviets a very solid unit composition with very few weaknesses. Soviets have more than enough AI options with penals/ppsh cons/LV's and as such do not need their AT infantry to also be solid AI.
There is a very good reason why guards are so prevalent this patch and its not solely Guard/Sniper synergy.
It is both correct that the PTRS was changed and those changes were not included in the Final patch notes but they were described in "DECEMBER BALANCE PREVIEW V1.0"
"PTRS Ready Aim Time reduced from 2 to 1.25 (affects all PTRS variants)"
Do note that this means the fireflys dps will be higher (negligibly so, still) since both tank destroyers fire off a shot immediately (they don't have to reload first). Also remember to consider vet and upgrades.
Mind that FF does 200 (240 with vet) and Jackson does 160 (200 with AP) which makes them different when dealing with diverse HP pool.
Also what Jae states. Burst > sustain damage. You aim, shoot and then reload. Also Tulips is a far greater potential threat which deserves the slight higher cost of the unit.
If something needs to be done, i'll go first for cost (i don't think it's too far from it like a bit mp and +5 fuel) or mobility.
The Jackson probably does need a nerf in a stat or two but it isn't dangerously OP.
I Agree with all these points. The one matchup where the Jackson seems truly overwhelming to me is when it is fighting P4s, THE medium tank option for OKW and Ostheer. Just about if not 100% penetration on both with 20 additional range makes it very challenging to utilize P4s against someone who has produced jacksons based on the p4s middling speed for a medium. Mabye this is fine, but I think it is one of the reasons there are great concerns about the jackson presently. The jackson should certainly be a good counter, but it seems like it can just Shut down p4 play incredibly hard, when the P4 is a core tank for both factions.
Other than that matchup I agree minor adjustments can bring it in line.
I think its best to compare the Jackson to the firefly, since they are now pretty similar and they fight the same units. To compare the Jackson to the panther or many axis tanks doesn't give you a great idea of what you are paying for as they are so different.
640 HP, 60 range 220/210 penetration far 260 penetration near for both. They cost 140 and 155 fuel respectively, so Knowing that the numbers should play out that the firefly is slightly better.
If you do the DPS considering they have such similar penetration you get
Jackson : 24.427480916DPS
FireFly :24.2424242424 DPS
They are doing approximately the same amount of damage. The jackson has 1.2 more speed and nearly twice the accelearation as the firefly
FireFly- Speed: 5.3 Accel: 1.6
Jackson-Speed: 6.5 Accel: 3
(im not an expert on how much this helps but the jacksons definitely faster).
To me it seems like you are getting a cheaper firefly that's more mobile, I think reload or penetration should be decreased slightly to compensate for this inconsistency. Mabye USF should have a better TD as it is their one lategame option I think the jackson can be the best and still be balanced, but I think this should be looked into and the numbers should be made more comparable.
As an aside firefly to me seems like its a middle of the road kind of tank this patch, not too good, not too bad.
(I'm ignoring special abilities b/c idk the best way to compare them).
I certainly agree with the point about spread and range. Pretty much all rocket artillery is useless at max range except for the landmattress, which has very poor range and high minimum range.
I think they are for the most part too hard to dive. Incredibly fragile units but often killing them will require you to sacrifice a vehicle IF you can even find them. Locating a rocket artillery vehicle can often come too late to react when yo must micro your units immediately not knowing where a first volley will land. Subsequent seconds are used repositioning your troops more effectively and finally only AFTER PEOPLE ARE DEAD, you can see where the artillery is, but by then they are running.
If Rocket artillery was revealed when it fired rather than when it hit you, that would make it much easier to counter which i think is necessary since it is really not in any standard playbook to kill them. It takes a big misplay by your opponent to kill them 95% of the time.
This would also be a reasonable tradeoff between quick firing axis units and slow firing allied ones who seem to perform better presently without impacting the fire power or usefulness to skilled players.
TLDR: Rocket artillery should be revealed when firing not hitting, creates risk, does not affect effectiveness vs campers.
They are hella exensive in munitions for the cost now. I would prefer they do more initial damage since they can be dodged now, and I wouldn't like to see a 15-25 muni nade being thrown in 100% of fights
At their current power level though the unlock is fine. They are good, just pricey for their damage even with denying cover
I think the general issue is that as a hard counter the 222 is not a very hard counter. A 221 might be cheaper but the 222 already has the 221 mg. For the resources invested sniper counters don't work well enough. And they leave you vulnerable to more standard lategame armys, especially if they fail.
The 251 could also be an effective tool vs snipers but its weapons are quite impotent and it doesn't have a turret
I have compiled some clips of scout cars trying to kill snipers and one of a gren trying to kill a sniper model for comparison. This is a small sample but something tangible for discussion
Gren kills a retreating sniper from midrange easily for comparison to other damage during retreat, possibly lucky but still shows what infantry can do from close range that scoutcars can struggle to achieve. https://clips.twitch.tv/TentativeBelovedWalletPJSugar
Yeah and if you're going for a Puma, you're probably in trouble. I need the Flak truck or the Luch to hold back the waves of infantry coming at me.. the Puma won't answer that immediate problem.
At least the Raketen can destroy lights reliably, but that's all it does for me :\
Ya I Think the puma is always what you need but not something you can afford to get unfortunately. Of course lategame pumas are riskier investments than other tanks so your still kinda stuck when your behind on fuel unless you go full fortifications bunkering down, but thats more stalling than winning.
I think the Jp4 is useful but ultimately its tough to not have any vehicles that can counterharass infantry so you need something else, and it can struggle against massed tds, ATGs when you only have 1. Not like you can afford a cheaper AI vehicle to take out infantry at if you go med into flak so its tough to support a Jp4 even though i really want one.
I've been on an OKW bender later, and they Raketen really does die fast. It gets to fire it's one shot from ambush and then dies. Retreating I've learned is largely useless as the crews always die while retreating anyways. Best use is to scout ahead.. which is silly.
It needs to benefit from green cover like other AT guns. Perhaps lock the camo behind a VET ability ? and you cannot move while ambushed. Keeps it with some flavor, but it's not a silly joke.
There's jut some things you don't fuck with in asymmetrical balance, and access to a proper AT gun is as crucial as access to proper MGs.
I think the idea for the faction has always been that they are supposed to have light vehicles fill these rolls, but that doesn't really work when you can't even get medics with your light vehicles
Also the raketen crew might have better recieved accuracy than volks recrewing it(.89 vs 1), so it starts a death cycle when the original guys die. It does have that bonus to start though which is nice, and possibly better than green cover considering many people say the AT gun cover doesn't apply often due to directionality.
Outside the box suggestion, What if the raketen only needed 1 guy in the crew, It might be quicker to get 1 dude to pick it up and reduce the risk of it getting 1 shot