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Steam vs Epic games

22 Mar 2019, 22:47 PM
#1
avatar of SturmtigerCobra
Patrion 310

Posts: 695 | Subs: 12

Console wars come to PC?:



Watch the intro meme:


Epic store in the spy business?:

Back in June, Chinese company Tencent Holdings purchased a minority stake in Epic Games, but it turns out that stake is substantial. Tencent snatched up 48.4% of Epic Games shares last year – that comes to around $330 million invested – and even has the right to nominate individuals to Epic Games' board of directors.

"Since the Group has the right to nominate directors to the board of Epic Games, Epic Games is accounted for as an associate of the Group." This is all laid out in Tencent Holdings' 2012 financial report, available as a pdf document through the source link below. Epic Games was the second US gaming investment from the Chinese outfit following its acquisition of Riot Games in 2011.

https://www.engadget.com/2013/03/21/tencent-sunk-330-million-into-epic-games-owns-nearly-half-of-s/

Relevant to strategy games. Phoenix Point (from the creator of X-com) will be an Epic store exclusive:
https://phoenixpoint.info/
6 Apr 2019, 16:03 PM
#2
avatar of SturmtigerCobra
Patrion 310

Posts: 695 | Subs: 12

Update:
Another strategy game is moving from steam store to the Epic store (exclusives to one PC store)..

Anno 1800 from Blue Byte/Ubisoft was scheduled to be released on steam, April 16.:
https://www.epicgames.com/store/en-US/product/anno-1800/home

News:
Ubisoft is partnering with Epic Games store for Anno 1800:
https://www.anno-union.com/en/ubisoft-is-partnering-with-epic-games-store-for-anno-1800/
Following the successful launch of Tom Clancy’s The Division 2 on PC on the Ubisoft Store and the Epic Games store, we are announcing today that we are partnering with Epic Games on Anno 1800 as well. Players can now pre-order the Deluxe and Standard editions of Anno 1800 on PC on the Epic Games store. Moreover, all players will be able to try Anno 1800 via the Open Beta, scheduled from April 12 to April 14, by downloading the game on Uplay or via the Epic Games store. Once the game has been released on April 16, 2019, Anno 1800 will only be available digitally on the Ubisoft Store and the Epic Games store. Pre-orders on Steam can be made until the release of the game. Everyone who pre-ordered Anno 1800 on Steam will be able to play the game upon release and will automatically get all future updates and content.


IMO, being forced into anything is anti-consumer.
6 Apr 2019, 16:11 PM
#3
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

Steam will not be dislodged from their position. Microsoft tried the same bullshit approach with their store and it failed miserably.
6 Apr 2019, 16:13 PM
#4
avatar of nigo
Senior Editor Badge

Posts: 2116 | Subs: 16

Epic store is a chinese bait.
6 Apr 2019, 21:35 PM
#5
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 3075

Best of luck to anyone who challenges valve. Fighting unwinnable battles ain't a great idea.
6 Apr 2019, 22:32 PM
#6
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2177 | Subs: 4

Best of luck to anyone who challenges valve. Fighting unwinnable battles ain't a great idea.

I respect the fight to add some competition, but paid exclusives or so cancerous.

Steam has many problems. I would love an actual serious alternative to force them into improving.
6 Apr 2019, 23:03 PM
#7
avatar of Rosbone
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 865 | Subs: 2

I recall telling everyone I knew "Dont buy Half Life if you need STEAM to run it. You are just screwing us all by giving in to this bullshit."

COH2 was the first Steam game I purchased. By then it was too late. The human race can never be saved. The feeling of missing out on something and not having all the cool new stuff is slowly eroding humanity into pavlovs dog.

You used to get a finished game on CD you could play anywhere you want with whomever you want. Now people are paying for shiny pants, boots, and dance moves in games even though it has nothing to do with game play at all. RIP Humanity. This ship of fools is going down.
7 Apr 2019, 00:06 AM
#8
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 3075

I recall telling everyone I knew "Dont buy Half Life if you need STEAM to run it. You are just screwing us all by giving in to this bullshit."

COH2 was the first Steam game I purchased. By then it was too late. The human race can never be saved. The feeling of missing out on something and not having all the cool new stuff is slowly eroding humanity into pavlovs dog.

You used to get a finished game on CD you could play anywhere you want with whomever you want. Now people are paying for shiny pants, boots, and dance moves in games even though it has nothing to do with game play at all. RIP Humanity. This ship of fools is going down.


Just wait till they only ship you part of the game and the rest is locked away via paywall..... oh wait.... isn't that DLCs?
7 Apr 2019, 08:48 AM
#10
avatar of wuff

Posts: 1481 | Subs: 2

I recall telling everyone I knew "Dont buy Half Life if you need STEAM to run it. You are just screwing us all by giving in to this bullshit."

COH2 was the first Steam game I purchased. By then it was too late. The human race can never be saved. The feeling of missing out on something and not having all the cool new stuff is slowly eroding humanity into pavlovs dog.

You used to get a finished game on CD you could play anywhere you want with whomever you want. Now people are paying for shiny pants, boots, and dance moves in games even though it has nothing to do with game play at all. RIP Humanity. This ship of fools is going down.


Steam has mostly had a positive affect on PC gaming and digital distribution in general is far better than physical.

Steam is feeling a little old and clunky with a little too much bloat but hopefully with the continue updates the client should improve, and while valve do take what I think a too high % on revenue from developers they do offer quite a perks.



7 Apr 2019, 08:54 AM
#11
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 1839 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post7 Apr 2019, 08:48 AMwuff
Steam has mostly had a positive affect on PC gaming and digital distribution in general is far better than physical.


I'd say digital distribution on Steam is something of a scam. All the costs of making physical copies and distributing those to the stores are gone and yet the price for a game has remained the same.
7 Apr 2019, 10:47 AM
#12
avatar of wuff

Posts: 1481 | Subs: 2



I'd say digital distribution on Steam is something of a scam. All the costs of making physical copies and distributing those to the stores are gone and yet the price for a game has remained the same.


There are costs to using steam, 30%.
7 Apr 2019, 12:00 PM
#13
avatar of Rosbone
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 865 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post7 Apr 2019, 08:48 AMwuff
Steam has mostly had a positive affect on PC gaming and digital distribution in general is far better than physical.

Steam has some great benefits. Linking to Friends, game library, etc are all great. I am a huge fan. But you give away a lot of rights for these benefits. And that is the future. People giving up rights to get the shiny new thing. See South Park The Entity episode for reference.

The major problems of digital distribution vs CD/DVD:
- You need internet to play/install. Sometimes that is a problem.
- Steam could close its servers any minute. Goodbye to your $1000's of games. Microsoft has already done this with music, so COH3 on MS store is a big risk. Xbox has made this much more stable of a platform.
- Being forced to update games just to play them. Maybe a new patch breaks everything. Maybe you dont have access to inet to download 57 GB of garbage every week like new dance moves or pink boots.
- You have to have some sketchy client running on your PC doing who knows what all day long. PCs are tools. They can be used to do a lot things. Between Win10 auto update, client apps doing shit, etc YOU are no longer in control of YOUR PC (that YOU paid for). How about if your car just auto updates itself into oblivion while your out on the road?

Back in the day I would order a new PC for work and as soon as it came in drop Quake onto it to run Timedemos and get FPS numbers. Cant do that with Steam using works inet. My boss who was near retirement would go "How did it do? That good huh? Order another one."
7 Apr 2019, 13:01 PM
#14
avatar of Osinyagov
Senior Modmaker Badge

Posts: 1120

Even if EpicGames lose this fight... i am always for this fight. It's simple market rule - the winner in competition between market members - customer.

I agreed with Rosbone about dependence issue with Steam. It's awkward, when you are impossible to run your game without Steam, or when you have to update it, like it was with Vermintide 2 several weeks ago (patch totally break the game). It's good, when service like Steam is an option, not a rule.
7 Apr 2019, 15:27 PM
#15
avatar of wuff

Posts: 1481 | Subs: 2


Steam has some great benefits. Linking to Friends, game library, etc are all great. I am a huge fan. But you give away a lot of rights for these benefits. And that is the future. People giving up rights to get the shiny new thing. See South Park The Entity episode for reference.

The major problems of digital distribution vs CD/DVD:
- You need internet to play/install. Sometimes that is a problem.
- Steam could close its servers any minute. Goodbye to your $1000's of games. Microsoft has already done this with music, so COH3 on MS store is a big risk. Xbox has made this much more stable of a platform.
- Being forced to update games just to play them. Maybe a new patch breaks everything. Maybe you dont have access to inet to download 57 GB of garbage every week like new dance moves or pink boots.
- You have to have some sketchy client running on your PC doing who knows what all day long. PCs are tools. They can be used to do a lot things. Between Win10 auto update, client apps doing shit, etc YOU are no longer in control of YOUR PC (that YOU paid for). How about if your car just auto updates itself into oblivion while your out on the road?

Back in the day I would order a new PC for work and as soon as it came in drop Quake onto it to run Timedemos and get FPS numbers. Cant do that with Steam using works inet. My boss who was near retirement would go "How did it do? That good huh? Order another one."


Not having cd/dvd's is great for the environment.

Steam has allowed so many indie dev's to get their product to a massive audience they could never do before.

Being able to patch and update games is great for developers and gamers, especially for MP. Not sure you're forced to update, thing you can play it offline.

Comparing a game client to a car is weird and doesn't make any sense.

Having all our content online regardless of what it is, is always a risk, tho only tiny.

Digital distribution has its issues but overall it has been a massive positive.


7 Apr 2019, 16:10 PM
#16
avatar of Rosbone
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 865 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post7 Apr 2019, 15:27 PMwuff
Steam has allowed so many indie dev's to get their product to a massive audience they could never do before.

I totally agree with this point. Make a game, post updates on Imgur,Instagram, Facebook, etc. Then release on steam. Huge positive for the gaming community.
9 Apr 2019, 20:26 PM
#17
avatar of SturmtigerCobra
Patrion 310

Posts: 695 | Subs: 12

Update;
Gearbox Software (CEO Randy Pitchford) owns the borderlands 3 IP and the former Relic IP, Homeworld.
So there is a real risk future Homeworld RTS games will be Epic store exclusive.

Negative Reviews, Piracy and Boycotts: Epic Still Doesn't Care


FYI; Randy Pitchford is a real piece of work (a rogue CEO & douchebag) that fooled Sega, press and fans alike with his lies and fake Aliens Colonial Marines demos which cost Sega millions of dollars in a class action lawsuit and later revenue loss on Sega's Alien:Isolation created by Creative Assembly.
Gearbox boss does “whatever the fuck he likes”, says Sega

If Epic store was any good, they should keep Randy Pitchford on a short leash as he's doing terrible PR for the store.
I think Steam need more competition, but the Epic store raises a red flag as not favorable to consumers (yet).
Steam has one of the best user-reviews system and Randy are intentional spreading misconceptions and fake news to make the Epic store look more favorable.

Recent example of Randy's misconceptions and lies about steam;
1) On 15. mar. 2019 Valve announce coming changes to the review system, correcting misuse and review bombs:
https://store.steampowered.com/news/?feed=steam_blog
*SNIP*
Since that post, we've continued to listen to feedback from both players and developers. It's clear to us that players value reviews highly, and want us to ensure they're accurate and trustworthy. Developers understand that they're valuable to players, but want to feel like they're being treated fairly. We've also spent a bunch of time building analysis tools to help us better understand what's happening in the reviews across all titles on Steam. With that feedback and data in hand, we think we're ready to make another change.

That change can be described easily: we're going to identify off-topic review bombs, and remove them from the Review Score.

2) 5. apr. 2019 Randy quote:
https://twitter.com/DuvalMagic/status/1114169379338555392
@thereal_scottv
5. apr.
Not cool at all to misuse the review system like this and shame on @steam_games for allowing it.
Randy Pitchford:
Ironically, that this misuse is possible and that Steam has no interest in correcting this misuse makes me kind of happy about 2k’s decision and makes me want to reconsider Gearbox Publishing’s current posture on the platform.

Cobra got popcorn ready for more Randy and Epic store drama;

9 Apr 2019, 21:06 PM
#18
avatar of MrBananaGrabber.
Social Media Manager Badge
Patrion 26

Posts: 323

FYI; Randy Pitchford is a real piece of work


Don't forget his love of barely legal porn. Which perhaps explains the two women wearing school uniforms in the pile of **** that was Duke Nukem Forever.

It's in this latter document that Callender's allegations are most severe. Alongside accusations surrounding the reported $12 million USD bonus, Callender puts forth other examples intended to illustrate Pitchford's alleged breach of judiciary duties, including an incident where Pitchford is claimed to have left a USB drive containing highly sensitive material (Gearbox employee details, development efforts, corporate partners, etc.) at a Medieval Times restaurant in Texas.

Here, the suit takes a darker turn, claiming that, "Upon information and belief, Randy Pitchford's USB drive also contained Randy Pitchford's personal collection of 'underage' pornography".

As noted by arstechnica, Pitchford himself corroborated elements of the USB stick story during an episode of The Piff Pod a day after Callender's suit was filed. In the podcast, he explains that a Medieval Times worker returned the stick "and also discovered the [camgirl] pornography. It was 'barely legal' porn. This girl's handle was 'Only 18.'" Pitchford claimed the stick contained one image, and that his executive assistant checked the returned device while he was away on holiday. "Before I know it," he said, "I think the entire office looked at it."


https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2019-01-11-gearbox-boss-randy-pitchford-and-former-lawyer-embroiled-in-legal-battle-over-breach-of-contract-more
10 Apr 2019, 00:20 AM
#19
avatar of TheGentlemenTroll

Posts: 943 | Subs: 1

Randy is a joke. Probably one of my least favorite people in the entire gaming industry. His attempts to seem holier than thou and his blatant lying is hilarious to watch.
14 Apr 2019, 20:53 PM
#20
avatar of SturmtigerCobra
Patrion 310

Posts: 695 | Subs: 12

Randy Pitchford Again SLAMS Steam, Explains Support For Borderlands 3 Epic Store Exclusivity:


Epic Games CEO is defending Randy Pitchford doing PR for the Epic Store:
https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/1117145708799451136
@TimSweeney
Randy Pitchford (@DuvalMagic) wrote a great tweetstorm on the Epic Games store and Borderlands, which Redditor u/Slawrfp assembled below. Sort comments by "controversial" to see both points of view.

Randy Pitchford explains his support for EGS:
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/bcsou4/randy_pitchford_explains_his_support_for_egs/
Randy Pitchord wrote a long chain of tweets discussing his opinions on EGS. I have reformatted it for readability on Reddit.
TLDR of TLDR: Competition good, Steam bad.

TLDR: He believes that what we are currently experiencing with EGS is only a mild annoyance towards something that is ultimately very good because Valve had a stranglehold on PC distribution and that is bad.

He believes that in a year or two, EGS will be far more developed than Steam, because Epic is not as complacent as Valve. (I would like to note that Tim Sweeney believes that Steam even has too many features, so Randy is pretty much incorrect)

He thinks that Epic will eventually beat Valve and that in about a decade Steam might be a dying platform, or at least whichever platform is the dominant it will not be Steam. Randy also thinks that the fact that Valve is privately owned is a disadvantage (lol) and compares them with Epic whose outside investors (Tencent, yup, he considers it a good thing) are insisting on constant growth and reinvestment into the business.

Finally, he believes that years from now we will look back to the day that Bl3 came to EGS as an amazing day for gaming because the ''Steam monopoly'' officially died.

Randy reacts to fan criticism in the Reddit thread:
Gosh - Many of the takes in that Reddit thread are laughable and extremely detached from reality. I don’t spend time on Reddit, but the discourse feels like conspiracy theory type thinking, which is horrifying if Reddit is being used by *anyone* to help shape their opinions.

Randy trolling steam fans with deliberately exclusionary Borderlands 3 polls:
https://www.reddit.com/r/linux_gaming/comments/bcdh4v/randy_pitchford_running_a_poll_on_twitter_as/

"Everyone loves working with Valve, basically" – PC Gamer:
https://www.pcgamer.com/what-indies-think-of-valve-giving-more-money-to-big-sellers/

Randy doing semi-official PR for Epic store exclusivity, what possible could go wrong?


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