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Why must USF be so hard to play/suck so hard?

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5 May 2018, 06:05 AM
#1
avatar of Mittens
Donator 11

Posts: 1276

Honestly, why does USF have to be the hardest faction or the faction that gets the least attention, not only is it the hardest faction in terms of tech but its downright requires a different amount of micro of any faction of coh2. Its utterly punishing, its unforgiving on every level, its has no scaling, and lacks the basic tools that many other factions have.

Under the current patch and so far even the future patch its almost an up hill battle in any game thats a 1v1 or even a 2v2 for anything above rank 200. Its simply not possible to beat OKW openings as they get more units and their DPS, scaling, and durability (received accuracy) is higher, they get a faster caping unit, and the USF tech is so locked up you have limited blob control that is tied to AT support. The 5th man of the rifle always drops leaving you with half DPS, nade tech is expensive AF, and the major as it stands is so expensive the p4 hits the field earlier than Sherman but also has better armor and pen.

USF is a faction in shambles as far as tech goes, its pacing is from 2016, and its units under preform for the most part besides the scott.
Why must this faction be hampered so much when it give so little in the way of tools to actually deal with the enemy blobs, heavy armored tanks, and long range units. Its an utter grind fest.

That said I get that not all factions are should be equal but god damn its frustrating to not only out play your opponent but lose b/c you units simply aren't as potent or as durable as theirs meaning you always need a 2-1 or to somehow win the almost impossible of beating OKW's early game 2v2 builds.

No matter the buld order, no matter the damage you deal, USF always seems on the back foot or lacking in their tech pacing of the game.
5 May 2018, 06:08 AM
#2
avatar of Gbpirate
Senior Editor Badge

Posts: 1150

l2p Mittens we're just bad

20% =/= half
5 May 2018, 06:14 AM
#3
avatar of Gbpirate
Senior Editor Badge

Posts: 1150

Rifle man needs s m o k e (don't tell Hans) again and back teching shouldn't be so god damn expensive :(
5 May 2018, 06:25 AM
#4
avatar of Gbpirate
Senior Editor Badge

Posts: 1150

There are only two real solutions that can be rectified with this.

1) Nerf OKW:
Eliminate 5x vet; Give Sturmpios MP40s w/ muni upgrade to StGs; Remove StGs from Volks, rename them "Volkssturm" and put one dude on crutches and another in a wheel chair; reduce Kubel cap rate to 1.0 (because why does it need to get to a point faster AND have a faster cap rate (insert Jackie Chan "wtf" meme)?

2) Uninstall the game.

Frankly, #2 is the best option.

Okay the StGs are bad on Volks because you're always getting shot at in the sweet spot of the Volksgrenadiers; 3x K98s at long range, then 2x MP44 when you're in mid range and it's just dumb because you lose that one model early, then another model again before your dudes are stationary and shooting. RIP riflemen
5 May 2018, 07:28 AM
#5
avatar of mondeogaming1

Posts: 464

rear echelons need a buff imo
5 May 2018, 08:08 AM
#6
avatar of tightrope
Senior Caster Badge
Patrion 39

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 29

No scaling? So the best tank destroyer, best machine gun and double bar rifles being better than STG volks and G43 grens doesn't count?
5 May 2018, 08:09 AM
#7
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

You should try playing Ostheer if you want to know what an uphill battle feels like
5 May 2018, 08:30 AM
#8
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3597 | Subs: 1

The 5th man of the rifle always drops leaving you with half DPS


Hope this rage post helps you to evacuate your frustration (no joke). But I would like to give you some insight about what I quoted. This may help you to understand it and maybe improve.

There is two kind of focus fire in the game used by any kind of infantry squad. Something we could call "focus damage" and "spread damage"

Focus Damage make a squad fire at another one model per model.
Spread damage make a squad fire at another one spreading its damage over all models.

So when you enter in a fight, if the squad in front of you has focus damage, it will pick up 1 model, kill it and then pass to another model, kill it then another one etc... This is what is happening when you see your riflemen squad losing a model vs a grenadier after 2-3 seconds. All four grenadier models fire at one model of your squad and kill it. Then why it happens sometime so fast is because of RNG chance to hit etc...

to make it easier to understand, I made a table in a guide I did for my clan: here is a reproduction

Focus Damage:

Squad---Life--- life per Round1-2-3-4-5...X
Entity 1 80--- 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 65 50...
Entity 2 80--- 80 55 40 20 0
Entity 3 80--- 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80...
Entity 4 80--- 80 80 80 80 80 70 50 20 0

The entity model 2 takes the initial damage and when it dies, the model 4 takes the damage and then when it dies, the model 1...

Spread Damage:

Squad---life--- life per Round1-2-3-4-5...X
Entity 1 80--- 80 75 65 50 40 40 35 0
Entity 2 80--- 80 55 50 45 30 25 10 5 0
Entity 3 80--- 80 70 55 40 20 0
Entity 4 80--- 80 80 70 65 50 45 30 20 0

All models take damage at the same time.

As far as I know, only Falls are spreading their damage. (maybe USF vehicule crew as well, didn't test)

Important note: Focus damage always works as a rule until the 3rd model down (for a riflemen squad at least) when there is two models remaining the damage is dealt to the two last entities simulteanously.

and the major as it stands is so expensive the p4 hits the field earlier than Sherman but also has better armor and pen.


The major is another problem. The FRP delay is much more impacting USF than OKW or UKF because of the other Major abilities, sometime you use the FRP and need a reco run and you can't use it without having that loooong delay before being able to use the FRP again.

Overall I 100% agree with the fact USF is the faction that recieved the least attention those last years. But you know they give it a T0 mortar... everytime you'll say USF lacks something someone is going to tell you about it.
5 May 2018, 08:50 AM
#9
avatar of adamírcz

Posts: 955

I guess with some price tweaks, it could be salvagable in 1vs1 and 2vs2. Cut down REs reinforce cost to 20 (25 is just plain ridiculous), Ambulance from 250MP to 200MP, also lower side-tech MP costs and some vehicle MP costs (WTF is the M20s one), also the Pack Howie cost and the 50.cal to 260MP
5 May 2018, 08:55 AM
#10
avatar of iAMcHETs

Posts: 28

26 1v1s played, not even ranked, thinks his opinion matters =D
5 May 2018, 09:05 AM
#11
avatar of kanon

Posts: 50

I guess with some price tweaks, it could be salvagable in 1vs1 and 2vs2. Cut down REs reinforce cost to 20 (25 is just plain ridiculous), Ambulance from 250MP to 200MP, also lower side-tech MP costs and some vehicle MP costs (WTF is the M20s one), also the Pack Howie cost and the 50.cal to 260MP


these are good ideas. I find USF teching one of the best in the game but the unit choices out of it are quite disappointing.
Lots of USF units got a very limited window of opportunity, for example the m20, it's an overpriced utilty unit right now, easily countered by lots of axis tools ( raketens, flak ht, pak, 222, and so on).
Pack howie it's a good unit, but again, overpriced in my opinion.

What about switching m20 with the m8 greyhound?
5 May 2018, 09:11 AM
#12
avatar of |GB| The Hooligan486
Senior Referee Badge

Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1

Try watching the usf of the "pro" players and try to learn from them.
5 May 2018, 09:41 AM
#13
avatar of RifleMan

Posts: 52

watch UTT where allies lost 90% of the games?
5 May 2018, 09:43 AM
#14
avatar of LeOverlord

Posts: 310

It depends on your game behavior. If you are playing aggressive and keeping the pressure on them, you are doing fine. Also, if you want to call a Sherman earlier than them, you have to lock down the fuel sectors and get a good fuel lead. I have won 2v2 games as USF by blocking their fuel income. You call in 2 Shermans, and by the time you have them in the field, he will hardly have a single tank.
I had the same "complain" at the beginning, but since i found this strategy with my friend, we can take the fight. We only lack experience in late game, but hopefully we find some strategy for that.
5 May 2018, 13:10 PM
#15
avatar of swordfisch

Posts: 138

it's a good thing the 222 is getting a buff so riflemans and tommies can get mowed down even faster.

meanwhile m20 and valentine cry in the corner
5 May 2018, 14:19 PM
#16
avatar of LiberalPerturabo

Posts: 26

Is this a troll post?
I mean I know some people are biased af but this is just pure insanity.
5 May 2018, 15:02 PM
#17
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

The 5th man of the rifle always drops leaving you with half DPS


1 * ( 4 / 5 ) = 0.5?
5 May 2018, 16:44 PM
#18
avatar of DerKuhlmann

Posts: 465

If you compare them against okw in the opener.
Sturms>RE
Mortar never does anything useful other than smoking.
Riflemen is performing medium versus volks.

If RE suppression time just got buffed, it would really help the transition to next phase.
5 May 2018, 17:25 PM
#19
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4

Hope this is just a rage post, as USF is pretty potent in 1v1.

I guess with some price tweaks, it could be salvagable in 1vs1 and 2vs2. Cut down REs reinforce cost to 20 (25 is just plain ridiculous), Ambulance from 250MP to 200MP, also lower side-tech MP costs and some vehicle MP costs (WTF is the M20s one), also the Pack Howie cost and the 50.cal to 260MP


This is unlikely to happen again, since you'll get price spamming pios with flamers AGAIN.

6 May 2018, 00:15 AM
#20
avatar of Mittens
Donator 11

Posts: 1276

jump backJump back to quoted post5 May 2018, 15:02 PMLago


1 * ( 4 / 5 ) = 0.5?

it was an exaggeration but thank you for the math :snfPeter:
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