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Are Ass Grens too good??

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13 Jan 2020, 16:49 PM
#1
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 381

A. Grens used to suck. But with the buff are they perchance to good. Well let's see.
They cost 280 mp and comes at 0cp. Same as A. Engies. Comparing them,
RA: 0.95 vs 0.9 (grens vs engies)
DPS: 10.5 vs 13.5 (grens vs engies, per model)
The assault grens are weaker. But they have sprint to close in and very powerful specops nades.
They also when t3 is researched can upgrade to 6 man. Improving their RA to 0.9 adding 1 man. And with that upgrade they beat: ass angies, thompson cav rifles, assault sections, commandos, mp40 storms, IR STG obers from close range. Although they can't take on more powerfull allied cqc squads like thompson paras, ranges or ppsh airborn guards, assault guards, shocks. However they have that grenade ability. If used well they can challenge any of those squads as well. They also have very stron vet bonuses.
Offensive: +40% acc, -25% cooldown
Defensive: -33.6% RA (giving the 6 man squad a very good 0.6 RA, this is probably the highest defenses for a 6 man squad gets if we exclude the shocks)
So the 6-man ass grens are pretty good. For only 280mp+60mu and 0cp unit they can achieve what other axis squads can't parity with allied cqc units.
To me this seem really good in fact too good. + they also come from 2 doctrines which have tigers(TA in strat reserve and regular Tiger in mech assault).
Now I'm not saying they are OP or need to looked at but simply they are quite cost effective (maybe too cost effective) and the commanders they come from are not bad.
So what do you guys think about the ass grens???
13 Jan 2020, 16:53 PM
#2
avatar of Aarotron

Posts: 377

Imo they are at least fine. They allow ostheer way to play aggressive early game without being useless later on. Counters to them also exist withallies, with them being able to bully them with early game light vehicles, maxims and vickerses. Usf might struggle a bit early on but once teched and bars avaiable, they can be dealt with.
13 Jan 2020, 16:58 PM
#3
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 381

Imo they are at least fine. They allow ostheer way to play aggressive early game without being useless later on. Counters to them also exist withallies, with them being able to bully them with early game light vehicles, maxims and vickerses. Usf might struggle a bit early on but once teched and bars avaiable, they can be dealt with.
The question is not weather they are counter able or not but simply if they are more bang for your buck.
13 Jan 2020, 17:03 PM
#4
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1187

Agrens are fine. They're actually a bit underpowered against USF after the rifle buffs, balanced vs SU and probably best vs UKF.
13 Jan 2020, 17:06 PM
#5
avatar of Clarity

Posts: 266

For once I actually agree with IncendiaryRounds, I think Ass Grens are good but they don't have the utility other units have, nerfing them would just gimp Ostheer's early game even further since Grens aren't very good early game to begin with.
13 Jan 2020, 17:06 PM
#6
avatar of Grining Cat

Posts: 48

Assault Grenadiers are quite fragile.
Any mistakes with Assault Grenadiers result in a massive MP-bleed,
which is why I think they are fine and not "too good".
13 Jan 2020, 17:07 PM
#7
avatar of Stormjäger

Posts: 1320

Niche unit, nowhere near overtuned.
13 Jan 2020, 17:13 PM
#8
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 1810

A grens are not OP. They most certainly aren't UP either, there's nothing wrong with them no matter what faction your facing
13 Jan 2020, 17:15 PM
#9
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4113


The assault grens are weaker. But they have sprint to close in and very powerful specops nades.
They also when t3 is researched can upgrade to 6 man. Improving their RA to 0.9 adding 1 man. And with that upgrade they beat: ass angies, thompson cav rifles, assault sections, commandos, mp40 storms, IR STG obers from close range. Although they can't take on more powerfull allied cqc squads like thompson paras, ranges or ppsh airborn guards, assault guards, shocks. However they have that grenade ability. If used well they can challenge any of those squads as well. They also have very stron vet bonuses.

did u just pulled those out of ur ass or have something to show for it ? cause math says otherwise
13 Jan 2020, 17:20 PM
#10
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 1806

Ass grens are fine now.
13 Jan 2020, 17:40 PM
#11
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 381

did u just pulled those out of ur ass or have something to show for it ? cause math says otherwise
I'v tested each of these(around 3 times). Honestly this was quite surprising. I thought they would be on par wit cav riflemen but not better turns out they are.
13 Jan 2020, 17:45 PM
#12
avatar of Stormjäger

Posts: 1320

I'v tested each of these(around 3 times). Honestly this was quite surprising. I thought they would be on par wit cav riflemen but not better turns out they are.


Did you use cheatcommands to spawn them in front of eachother and changed sides on one of them?
13 Jan 2020, 18:26 PM
#13
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 381



Did you use cheatcommands to spawn them in front of eachother and changed sides on one of them?
kinda, but whole one squad having faster aim times, different formations bothered me. So in later tests i set up 2 sand bags at around range 7/8 apart and made then charge into those covers starting from a bit further away.
13 Jan 2020, 18:29 PM
#14
avatar of Stormjäger

Posts: 1320

kinda, but whole one squad having faster aim times, different formations bothered me. So in later tests i set up 2 sand bags at around range 7/8 apart and made then charge into those covers starting from a bit further away.


Yeah this method doesn’t work. Changing squad owner in range of an enemy squad messes badly with the combat. Your results are all wrong,
13 Jan 2020, 19:59 PM
#15
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 6469 | Subs: 1

Niche unit, nowhere near overtuned.
13 Jan 2020, 20:59 PM
#16
avatar of WAAAGH2000

Posts: 354

I'd like to see give Ost assault engineer……
Don't forget AE also a engineer,AG just grenadier
14 Jan 2020, 05:44 AM
#17
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 381



Yeah this method doesn’t work. Changing squad owner in range of an enemy squad messes badly with the combat. Your results are all wrong,
Sure about that. Why don't you do a better test and show me they are wrong.
14 Jan 2020, 13:12 PM
#18
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4113

SO I DID THE TEST, U ARE A Liar

https://imgur.com/a/YeOhpe2

ps cover are only there for positioning i deleted them cause it would create problem with flamer

commando had no bonus form ambush btw, with it they win
14 Jan 2020, 15:50 PM
#19
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 381

SO I DID THE TEST, U ARE A Liar

https://imgur.com/a/YeOhpe2

ps cover are only there for positioning i deleted them cause it would create problem with flamer

commando had no bonus form ambush btw, with it they win

Flames do more damage in cover, and thompson have similar profile to stgs so outside of range 10 they don't loose as much dps. Hey they still beat commandos.
14 Jan 2020, 16:53 PM
#20
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4113


Flames do more damage in cover, and thompson have similar profile to stgs so outside of range 10 they don't loose as much dps. Hey they still beat commandos.
I removed cover u can literally see it

btw this prove u didn't test and just made it up
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