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russian armor

Ostruppen seriously

8 Oct 2013, 10:35 AM
#41
avatar of GreenDevil

Posts: 343



Dave so constructive.


What do you expect from a 13 year old kid, that cries in the middle of game of how badly the game sucks. If the game sucks so bad Dave, as I've told you before, go back to Call of Duty and your buddies there.
Hux
8 Oct 2013, 11:42 AM
#42
avatar of Hux
Patrion 14

Posts: 505

Don't go back Dave. They're not really your buddies!

The Ostruppen are your buddies now!
8 Oct 2013, 12:26 PM
#43
avatar of Blovski

Posts: 480

If we can focus on complaining about/suggesting counters to Ostruppen instead of having another irrelevant flamefest about forum personalities that'd be grand. I notice noone has taken me up on point 4c yet?

Also, balance stream at 9 my time I believe. Will be interesting to see if they've worked out a proper solution yet.
8 Oct 2013, 12:55 PM
#44
avatar of MajorasLiepa

Posts: 105

Against these Ostruppen strategy all time im lossing, no more fun playing COH2. And most german only goes for them.
8 Oct 2013, 13:12 PM
#45
avatar of Hypnotoad

Posts: 107



Your game sucks, sorry.


Erm.. then why do you still keep posting on this forum? You do realize it's almost entirely dedicated to a game you seem to loathe?
8 Oct 2013, 15:37 PM
#46
avatar of The Dave

Posts: 396

http://www.coh2.org/replays/8980/here-s-what-your-fun-patch-has-done.

Done being constructive. This game just sucks. Check the evidence.
8 Oct 2013, 16:17 PM
#47
avatar of undostrescuatro

Posts: 525

http://www.coh2.org/replays/8980/here-s-what-your-fun-patch-has-done.

Done being constructive. This game just sucks. Check the evidence.


lol gota check the replay just because of those comments. what did they do they trenched in front of your base?

i kinda agree with dave. i havent been playing the game lately. i want to like the game but the game is not making me like it.
8 Oct 2013, 16:26 PM
#48
avatar of Strummingbird
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 930



lol gota check the replay just because of those comments. what did they do they trenched in front of your base?


I haven't seen the replay, but I believe it was massive scout car spam from games I've seen on Sturmtigerjamin's stream.

8 Oct 2013, 17:10 PM
#49
avatar of undostrescuatro

Posts: 525



I haven't seen the replay, but I believe it was massive scout car spam from games I've seen on Sturmtigerjamin's stream.



russian major weakness, no infantry AT, scout cars are pretty cheap and if you build more scout cars than russian conscripts you are pretty much done.

(in before someone mention a certain doctrinal unit)
9 Oct 2013, 16:53 PM
#50
avatar of Ptah

Posts: 66

Ostrupen completely broke the game.
They need to get vet slower and most important remove the faust ability from them.
9 Oct 2013, 19:23 PM
#51
avatar of Lynskey
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 223

The only thing worse than people moaning is people moaning about people moaning. Please stop before you create some sort of moaning ouroboros and devour reality.
9 Oct 2013, 22:31 PM
#52
avatar of Ptah

Posts: 66

The only thing worse than people moaning is people moaning about people moaning. Please stop before you create some sort of moaning ouroboros and devour reality.


What are you saying? I taught this is a thread about Ostrupen balance and how we can improve it. So cant we discuss Ostrupen or are we not allowed to speak any more so you dont get upset????
9 Oct 2013, 22:43 PM
#53
avatar of Appleseed

Posts: 622

jump backJump back to quoted post9 Oct 2013, 16:53 PMPtah
Ostrupen completely broke the game.
They need to get vet slower and most important remove the faust ability from them.


i think they are fine now, after put half of the cap speed. they are not broken in my eys they are about just right for the price. Remove the faust? so u can just use crown car+ flame engineer to BBQ them for free? come on man they already die like flies, conscript should have no trouble fighting them so you know need remove the faust to make them completely useless. also you never state why they are broken in the game
9 Oct 2013, 22:46 PM
#54
avatar of Blovski

Posts: 480

jump backJump back to quoted post9 Oct 2013, 22:31 PMPtah


What are you saying? I taught this is a thread about Ostrupen balance and how we can improve it. So cant we discuss Ostrupen or are we not allowed to speak any more so you dont get upset????


You have completely not understood Lynskey's post and added yet another post not discussing Ostruppen to the thread. (This post makes it two more). I'm noting that noone has taken me up on point 4c) yet.

Anyway, the change to Ostruppen in the patch notes (a version's circulating with some apparently erroneous changes to the Ostruppen rifle) is that Ostruppen cap at half rate. I don't personally think this looks likely to address the serious issues with the unit while reducing their capacity as a midgame support unit but will add it to the first post.

It'd be great if people can discuss whether the change has a serious impact on their games once they've played a couple of games against or especially WITH the Ostruppen.
9 Oct 2013, 22:56 PM
#55
avatar of Blovski

Posts: 480

i think they are fine now, after put half of the cap speed. they are not broken in my eys they are about just right for the price. Remove the faust? so u can just use crown car+ flame engineer to BBQ them for free? come on man they already die like flies, conscript should have no trouble fighting them so you know need remove the faust to make them completely useless. also you never state why they are broken in the game


Could you answer these? I'm genuinely interested in getting some tips from Ostruppen players to aggregate some proper Ostruppen counter strategies since it looks like they'll be very popular for a while.

4) further questions for the people who think it's balanced right now:
a) what do you do to counter it on a map like Semois or Kharkov which is heavy on buildings? have you had any success on these maps against players who are just as good as you Ostruppen spamming?
b) what is your recommended counter?
c) at the earliest time your recommended counter can hit the field, assuming even map control, how many Ostruppen squads can be on the field?
d) what is the cost of your recommended counter (include the manpower cost of T1 or T2 if you have to build that straight off the bat...) - how many Ostruppen units does it cost?

You can consult the first post for a list of reasons I think they're imba. I personally think removing the faust is a good idea if Relic is absolutely unwilling to change the cost and the call-in time (which combined with trenches operating very strangely are the real issues here). Right now they more or less counter snipers just because of the number of men and 10mp reinforce cost and flamers on infantry engi squad are a bit of a gamble because of the flamer criticals, so I'd like Tier 1 to play better against them at the very least so you have to either compliment them with grenadiers or rushed scout cars.
9 Oct 2013, 22:57 PM
#56
avatar of Ptah

Posts: 66

They broke the game on maps like Semoisky where are alot of green cover and houses. The german player just spams Ostrupen and you cant get them out of the house so he caps most of the map while you are fighting him. The clown car with flamers would be a good counter to that but because they have faust you cant do that. Furhter german played doesent need to go t1 and goes straight to t2 and than most of the time t3 and because he doesent spent the fuel on t1 and he has a lot of capping power he can get P4 much earlier than in games where he has to go t1 and that just puts the Soviet player more behind. So that's my reasoning why they broke the game.
10 Oct 2013, 09:05 AM
#57
avatar of Le Wish
Patrion 14

Posts: 813 | Subs: 1

I would argue that the building cover design synergy with the powerful buildings is the big issue. Making the problem more map specific in my opinion. On more open maps with few buildings I find them less of a problem. Still, the map-design is unlikely to change. So either buildings and or osttruppen have to change to make buildingheavy maps feel more viable.
10 Oct 2013, 13:24 PM
#58
avatar of Blovski

Posts: 480

jump backJump back to quoted post10 Oct 2013, 09:05 AMLe Wish
I would argue that the building cover design synergy with the powerful buildings is the big issue. Making the problem more map specific in my opinion. On more open maps with few buildings I find them less of a problem. Still, the map-design is unlikely to change. So either buildings and or osttruppen have to change to make buildingheavy maps feel more viable.


Semoskiy at least, I think is really fun without Ostruppen. Kharkov I think is tricky but also a lot of fun. I don't really think good maps should have to get mangled just because the game has one badly designed unit. Also, while I guess the patch has made it unwatchable, Ginnungagap's spam into FHT replay was on Langres, and with trench spamming there seems to be a lot of potential for it to be OP on any narrow map.

Edit: You are of course right that the building heavy maps are the most acute example of the problem with Ostruppen but I'm not convinced that's the only one as long as trenches remain unchanged.
10 Oct 2013, 13:43 PM
#59
avatar of Abdul

Posts: 896

What they did in this last patch is not a solution, it actually messes up things for those who want to make a good use of the unit without spamming it.

For example before the patch if you built t1 you could still call ostruppen at the same time and use it to cap for you along with engineers. Now they broke this useful aspect with the capping delay and left all the other main problems with spamming it untouched:

a)fast cool down
b)fuast
c)bunkers.
10 Oct 2013, 14:45 PM
#60
avatar of MoerserKarL
Donator 22

Posts: 1108



i think they are fine now, after put half of the cap speed. they are not broken in my eys they are about just right for the price. Remove the faust? so u can just use crown car+ flame engineer to BBQ them for free? come on man they already die like flies, conscript should have no trouble fighting them so you know need remove the faust to make them completely useless. also you never state why they are broken in the game


+1 and the faust ability is needed imo.
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