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12 Apr 2019, 05:15 AM
#201
avatar of blancat

Posts: 810

flamenade -> rears

grenade launcher -> rifles

there is no reason rifles use flamenade

and if rears get grenade launcher, rear spam will be back again

12 Apr 2019, 19:14 PM
#202
avatar of Outsider_Sidaroth

Posts: 1323 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Apr 2019, 05:15 AMblancat
flamenade -> rears

grenade launcher -> rifles

there is no reason rifles use flamenade

and if rears get grenade launcher, rear spam will be back again



Man, if only Rifles could get that Upgrade, you could put it on Rifle Company too...

I still uphold USF doesn't need these Molotovs, the bundle should be Willy Pete and Dozer Blades for Shermans.
13 Apr 2019, 05:30 AM
#203
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053

After a couple more games, I start to question the design of having both regular grenades and "molotovs" for rifles both for 30 munitions and both tied to the grenade upgrade. One doesn't really offer much over the other, which is probably why there are no units with both. And since both are tied to tech, you automatically gain access to both. If molotovs were not tied to tech, then at least, they'd offer a cost saving option in terms of tech cost. Otherwise there are very few situations where one would wish for a molotov over a grenade.

The throw range of the molotovs does not seem to be affected by vet (needs verification).

I also noticed that the grenade bulletins (cheaper and increased range) do not work for the molotovs, this is likely owed to the mod character, but should probably be changed/fixed for the final version, IF molotovs are to remain a feature for riflemen.

Ever tried to nade an infantry squad in a garison? they just laugh and hop out and hop back in 1 second later. Incendiaries on the other hand at least deny the building for a bit. Clearing garrisons with direct fire as USF is a bitch and a half and I love to have any sort of flame weapon to help with that.

IMO if it really is statistically a molotov (stated in the patchnotes IIRC) it should cost 20 like a molotov though. Throw animation is shorter but conscripts have oorah and rifles don't, so IMO it balances out in terms of performance.
13 Apr 2019, 08:46 AM
#204
avatar of sherlock
Patrion 14

Posts: 550 | Subs: 1


Ever tried to nade an infantry squad in a garison? they just laugh and hop out and hop back in 1 second later. Incendiaries on the other hand at least deny the building for a bit. Clearing garrisons with direct fire as USF is a bitch and a half and I love to have any sort of flame weapon to help with that.

IMO if it really is statistically a molotov (stated in the patchnotes IIRC) it should cost 20 like a molotov though. Throw animation is shorter but conscripts have oorah and rifles don't, so IMO it balances out in terms of performance.


If they were cheaper, they would be more appealing. As stated, for 30 munitions and tied to the same tech, they don't offer much and if it is house clearing you are looking for, that's what supposedly the RE rifle nades are for, you also are probably better of going for assault engineers or even rifle company.

I'm not very fond of the commander in general, to be honest.
13 Apr 2019, 23:34 PM
#205
avatar of Outsider_Sidaroth

Posts: 1323 | Subs: 1

The combo of Elite Infantry + Rocket Artillery is still one of a kind in USF limited Commander rooster.

I'd still wish Rangers lost their 3rd weapon slot, which is pointless most of the time when using Thompsons, so they could keep their Damage Reduction for flavour.
15 Apr 2019, 13:41 PM
#206
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

USF - Urban Assault ver. 4

The CD on the Sherman WP is way too low at 10 secs.


Suggestions:
Move rifle grenades to Riflemen as an upgrade taking all weapon slots and Molotov to R.E. as an squad upgrade mutually exclusive with Smoke grenade but no tech requirements. Add AT grenade option if needed.
15 Apr 2019, 14:29 PM
#207
avatar of JibberJabberJobber

Posts: 1614 | Subs: 3

What's wrong with making rifle molotovs techless? Pointless to make it 30 munitions otherwise.

Conscripts pay less munitions because they have to pay for the tech, unlike OKW.
15 Apr 2019, 15:07 PM
#208
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

What's wrong with making rifle molotovs techless? Pointless to make it 30 munitions otherwise.

Conscripts pay less munitions because they have to pay for the tech, unlike OKW.

Imo mainline infatry should not have access to anti garrison tools (yes that goes for VG also).
That gives other units utility and thus increases diversity.
15 Apr 2019, 15:33 PM
#209
avatar of JibberJabberJobber

Posts: 1614 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Apr 2019, 15:07 PMVipper

Imo mainline infatry should not have access to anti garrison tools (yes that goes for VG also).
That gives other units utility and thus increases diversity.


Garrisons are an annoying gameplay mechanic anyway (as in: too strong). Unless they made going point blank range counter garrison cover, I don't mind flame nades.
15 Apr 2019, 16:15 PM
#210
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1



Garrisons are an annoying gameplay mechanic anyway (as in: too strong). Unless they made going point blank range counter garrison cover, I don't mind flame nades.


1) If rifle grenades are moved Riflemen they will able to clear garrison, at the price of no weapon upgrades.

2) If mainline infatry have no access to anti-garrison tools and other units have access to them there more reason to diversify one's built.
17 Apr 2019, 10:19 AM
#211
avatar of SupremeStefan

Posts: 1220

Hey guys i was thinking about usf bunker and i think its very underestimated unit so i suggest add to CP 0 Urban assault equipment hp bunker update. RE can now upgrade pits hp for 30muni just simple thing and probably will works good with urban theme. Just give it some love
ddd
17 Apr 2019, 13:14 PM
#212
avatar of ddd

Posts: 528 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Apr 2019, 15:07 PMVipper

Imo mainline infatry should not have access to anti garrison tools


Move rifle grenades to Riflemen


?
17 Apr 2019, 13:23 PM
#213
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Apr 2019, 13:14 PMddd

?

If the choices is between having incendiary grenades for riflemen and Rifle grenades for R.E. or the opposite this later is much better especially if it takes up all weapon slot for riflemen.

Currently R.E. with rifle-grenades are more a like more mobile mortar, while the affordable and Riflemen gain allot of utility.
ddd
17 Apr 2019, 13:25 PM
#214
avatar of ddd

Posts: 528 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Apr 2019, 13:23 PMVipper

If the choices is between having incendiary grenades for riflemen and Rifle grenades for R.E. or the opposite this later is much better especially if it takes up all weapon slot for riflemen.

Currently R.E. with rifle-grenades are more a like more mobile mortar.


Ah so its better because its worse for usf? Gotcha.
17 Apr 2019, 14:05 PM
#215
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13476 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Apr 2019, 13:25 PMddd


Ah so its better because its worse for usf? Gotcha.

No its better from design point of view.

For instance R.E. in fighting position will fire 2 rifle grenades while they can also use volley fire to pin.

In addition a blob with rifle-grenades and smoke is cancerous.

The change will also allow incendiary grenades to be available without unlocking grenades.
18 Apr 2019, 22:04 PM
#216
avatar of Outsider_Sidaroth

Posts: 1323 | Subs: 1

Thanks for finally making the Rangers third slot worth a damn, Balance Mod Team!
19 Apr 2019, 16:13 PM
#217
avatar of Qeit

Posts: 61

I don't like current situation with molotovs for rifles - it requires grenade unlock and their throwing speed is kinda too fast.
Cover to Cover - good, very good.
Changes are fine in case of rangers (damage modifier was strange on infantry unit, RA is better IMO). I still would like to see decrease in chance to drop weapon.
Additionally, some vet req. decrease for Calliope would be nice.
19 Apr 2019, 16:25 PM
#218
avatar of MrBananaGrabber.
Patrion 26

Posts: 328

Thanks for finally making the Rangers third slot worth a damn, Balance Mod Team!


When they have three zooks are they three more powerful zooks or just standard ones?
19 Apr 2019, 17:09 PM
#219
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

When they have three zooks are they three more powerful zooks or just standard ones?


They get the elite bazookas now (if they pick up bazookas from the rack), which deal 20 more damage and have 30 more penetration on all ranges.
19 Apr 2019, 17:35 PM
#220
avatar of MrBananaGrabber.
Patrion 26

Posts: 328



They get the elite bazookas now (if they pick up bazookas from the rack), which deal 20 more damage and have 30 more penetration on all ranges.


Thanks for the info!

When they pick up two bazookas from the rack they actually get three, so that's three extra powerful bazookas. Which could be a bit too much, especially on a commander that has a sprint ability that can be used on several squads at once.

Are they supposed to get three (for the price of two) or is that a bug?
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