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Thoughts on Panzergrenadiers

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ddd
24 Mar 2019, 14:52 PM
#181
avatar of ddd

Posts: 528 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Mar 2019, 06:58 AMspajn


Dominance? Every stream, every tournament game i have seen its always always OKW. Even the self proclaimed King of Wehrmacht Helpinghans is just playing OKW.


I was talking about previous patch, where it was ostheer every game with mobile defense or osttruppen. Your point was that ostheer is easily exploitable due to it defensive nature, its not true if you look at their past dominance.
25 Mar 2019, 06:03 AM
#182
avatar of spajn
Donator 11

Posts: 927

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Mar 2019, 10:29 AMKatitof


When was last time you have "took the initiative" using PGs?
When was last time you've seen any streamer do it?

I could really understand your argument, if PGs were meta unit, but they are not and were never in the past after beta. They always were just an optional squad and more people opted to skip them all together or go straight for shrecks.

How many ost players actually use PGs as AI squad? 1%? 2?

If you are arguing existence of the tool - sure, its better to have the option then not, just in case.
If you are arguing usefulness of/need for the tool - meta was always exclusively about gren spam + MG/mortar/sniper and not at any single time over last 5 years PGs were ever meta AI choice, so from meta point of view, AI PGs were never needed and were just a vanity/variety option.


What osttruppen offer, outside of resistance to sniper strats that base army lacks and needs?
Its not faust
Its not long range dps
Its not durability(grens are tougher in small arms firefights)
Its most certasinly not CQC DPS
So what do osttruppen bring to the table that ostheer so heavily lacks?

In case of mobile defense, panic puma is not something ost needs, its something that makes countering shock lights trivial, shreck PGs and teller mines were always capable of that.

Ost was never in soviet state of absolutely needing a commander to perform at any decent level, it was always about luxury choices.


sorry i can't care what someone who have thousands of trollposts have to say yet don't even play the game. If you can't even manage to get top 500 1v1 or 2v2 your opinions about balance is void.
25 Mar 2019, 07:35 AM
#183
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17883 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Mar 2019, 06:03 AMspajn


sorry i can't care what someone who have thousands of trollposts have to say yet don't even play the game. If you can't even manage to get top 500 1v1 or 2v2 your opinions about balance is void.

I was ranked 47 in axis and 64 in allies in 2s, when my 2v2 mate was still alive, but suit yourself.
25 Mar 2019, 09:02 AM
#184
avatar of spajn
Donator 11

Posts: 927

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Mar 2019, 07:35 AMKatitof

I was ranked 47 in axis and 64 in allies in 2s, when my 2v2 mate was still alive, but suit yourself.


Aka carried.
25 Mar 2019, 09:16 AM
#185
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17883 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Mar 2019, 09:02 AMspajn


Aka carried.

Yes, exactly, because you actually can carry someone in 2s to that rank when you're just slightly above his level.
Get a grip on reality.
25 Mar 2019, 17:52 PM
#186
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1527

Permanently Banned
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Mar 2019, 09:02 AMspajn


Aka carried.


+1000 I've mentioned he was carried by his teammate. His 2v2 random Win loss % was far worse. For that reason Katitof never posts his playercard. God knows when the last time he played a game of CoH2. I salute the person who banned him from the forums. Unfortuantely, we feel the consequences of the decision to reverse that order.
25 Mar 2019, 17:55 PM
#187
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1527

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Well what do u now, Katitof thinks pgrens are ENTIRELY optional? What a surprise. So what exactly does Ost do in CQC? Rely on a doctrine? AssGrens? They're called ASSgrens for a reason... which is why they're FINALLY getting a buff. And storms took a nerf as they're weapons are a lot less potent and have to use far more micro now. Cuz all the other factions have stock options of CQC.(Riflemen inherently good close range, penals, 5man sappers, sturms) but ost get lousy pios.
25 Mar 2019, 18:41 PM
#188
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1

Cuz all the other factions have stock options of CQC.(Riflemen inherently good close range, penals, 5man sappers, sturms) but ost get lousy pios.


US doesn't get a sniper, or rocket arty, or any stock vehicles with more than 160 armor. It's called asymmetry. Why do you keep making posts like this, there's absolutely zero point to what you just said.
25 Mar 2019, 18:52 PM
#189
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1527

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US doesn't get a sniper, or rocket arty, or any stock vehicles with more than 160 armor. It's called asymmetry. Why do you keep making posts like this, there's absolutely zero point to what you just said.


Your not comparing the same thing. CQC is a whole facet of the game not a attribute like the armor number of a vehicle. Why do YOU keep on making posts like this? You're obviously hating on me cuz I make more sense than u.
25 Mar 2019, 19:13 PM
#190
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1



Your not comparing the same thing. CQC is a whole facet of the game not a attribute like the armor number of a vehicle.


Light, medium, and heavy armor aren't "facets of the game"?

Whatever that even means. You're just arbitrarily deciding what matters and what doesnt
25 Mar 2019, 19:49 PM
#193
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1527

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How do you counter cqb infantry? Shocks, the best cqb infantry in the game with all the tools to close were just buffed because it was in viable. In this game long range is king.
At any rate, support your NG and it will do fine. Support it with pgrens and it will do more than fine.
If it's an urban map you are going FHT anyways, use that. Use mine fields, barbed wire. A flamethrower on your pios. A bunker to watch your back. There are plenty of options. And like it or not pgrens are one of them.


Um shocks were basically the ONLY underpowered allied CQC inf before the patch. USF CQC inf are monsters. Commandos are great. Pgrens can counter if your opponent fails to dodge the preemptive bundle nade. Flamer pios vs CQC inf? You're joking. They'll get shredded faster than the flames can do any work. I just said how easy it is to get a FHT ambushed. And pathing issues are disgusting in urban areas.
25 Mar 2019, 23:13 PM
#194
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
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Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4

invised posts for flame and 1 post for quoting it.
25 Mar 2019, 23:16 PM
#195
avatar of IncendiaryRounds:)

Posts: 1527

Permanently Banned
invised posts for flame and 1 post for quoting it.


Feelings don't matter, Mr. Moderator, only facts. Remember that.
25 Mar 2019, 23:51 PM
#196
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279



Um shocks were basically the ONLY underpowered allied CQC inf before the patch. USF CQC inf are monsters. Commandos are great. Pgrens can counter if your opponent fails to dodge the preemptive bundle nade. Flamer pios vs CQC inf? You're joking. They'll get shredded faster than the flames can do any work. I just said how easy it is to get a FHT ambushed. And pathing issues are disgusting in urban areas.

So the tools don't work if the enemy is bmgood enough to not succumb to them.... So you can't counter them if the enemy out plays you?
And yet shocks were (and still are) the most durable and have smoke to negate incoming damage and Supression...

Ass engies have no means to close. If they got up in your guts it's because they walked right up there unmolested and commandos, well they can camo to get there so I'll grant you that. Dictate your engagements. Make them have to close. Make them take the heat.

Flame thrower is a very very good SUPPORT element. Make it PART of your defense.

Also how is it that ass engies are melting you when you close but pgrens are getting obliterated as they attempt to? Is the enemy putting more work into getting their infantry into a range that they can engage effectively than you are?
26 Mar 2019, 00:12 AM
#198
avatar of SturmTigerVorgo

Posts: 307

I would like to see the received accuracy increased because of 4 man squad. They just die too fast for their price to be effective,
26 Mar 2019, 00:18 AM
#199
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17883 | Subs: 8

I would like to see the received accuracy increased because of 4 man squad. They just die too fast for their price to be effective,

They already have 0.8 and hefty vet bonus.
Add more to that and they'll start dodging bullets, matrix style.

But they are not shock troops, never were and never will be, they will always be punished by frontal attack without use of cover or other units allowing for approach(sniper stun shot, mortar smoke, HMG suppression, gren rifle nade forcing movement therefore lowering opponents dps, even moving in first other squad to soak some damage).
26 Mar 2019, 00:21 AM
#200
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 5279

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Mar 2019, 00:18 AMKatitof

They already have 0.8 and hefty vet bonus.
Add more to that and they'll start dodging bullets, matrix style.

But they are not shock troops, never were and never will be, they will always be punished by frontal attack without use of cover or other units allowing for approach(sniper stun shot, mortar smoke, HMG suppression, gren rifle nade forcing movement therefore lowering opponents dps, even moving in first other squad to soak some damage).


But I don't WANT to use the unit or the army the way its intended I want to charge the enemy head in and WIN this isn't fair! RELIC! BUFF YOUER STUPID GAME
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