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Post nerf USF strategies?

29 Mar 2017, 17:14 PM
#1
avatar of Clockblocked

Posts: 26

After having played a few games with USF and being handily trounced, im not sure what the new 'meta' is or should be for this faction. MGs were already a problem early game and beyond, and the proper answer to that was a mortar team. Now, with the reduced range, mortars feel weaker than ever, dying to an ostheer rifle grenade without much fuss. Id like to comment on the mid and late-game, but I honestly havent made it past 8 to 10 minutes without critical losses. I guess the answer is to retreat even earlier and even more often, but then, where is the early game advantage us is supposed to have?
29 Mar 2017, 17:45 PM
#2
avatar of Tanker

Posts: 53 | Subs: 1

USF should have never got a mortar in the first place, but relic feels early USF struggle against MG spam so they gave them one.
The point is USF player nowadays just want to headon HMG and use mortar to punish them instead of trying to execute a flank so that when the mortar nerfed they cannot go headon with HMG anymore. What i am trying to say is practice new strat like smoke, flank and don't rely too much on USF OP mortar like before the patch. Use your brain a bit.
29 Mar 2017, 18:01 PM
#3
avatar of DAZ187

Posts: 394

problem is that now that mg is in t0. usf battles vs mg openings. without the mortar getting nades delays the tech way too much
29 Mar 2017, 18:06 PM
#4
avatar of Clockblocked

Posts: 26

For the record, this is not meant to be a whine post or a place to bicker about balance. Please keep the discussion insightful about how a proper game with USF should look after WBP.

For reference, here are the changes to USF in the latest patch.


Try to keep the discussion to these topics but also feel free to quote changes from other factions that are relavent to the topic at hand. Cheers boys! :)
30 Mar 2017, 05:22 AM
#5
avatar of Hector

Posts: 3729 | Subs: 4

Against hmg.

General rule is to never let theme to get a key buildino and flank any hmg from different angles in the open.

M20 do wonders now, since 222 has been delayes.
3 Apr 2017, 03:18 AM
#6
avatar of ClassyDavid

Posts: 292 | Subs: 1

If HMGs in buildings are being quite a pain I'd recommend going Rifle company or Armor company as both provide flamers. Smoke with mortar or smoke grenades then attack ground. Very good combo and both doctrines are good as well.
3 Apr 2017, 04:04 AM
#7
avatar of Cafo

Posts: 241

jump backJump back to quoted post29 Mar 2017, 17:45 PMTanker
USF should have never got a mortar in the first place, but relic feels early USF struggle against MG spam so they gave them one.
The point is USF player nowadays just want to headon HMG and use mortar to punish them instead of trying to execute a flank so that when the mortar nerfed they cannot go headon with HMG anymore. What i am trying to say is practice new strat like smoke, flank and don't rely too much on USF OP mortar like before the patch. Use your brain a bit.


On the contrary they should have always had a mortar, its a staple in any military and is a counter for static play... Were they messed up was making it overpowered on release. They should be promoting a variety of units and abilities not rifle blobs. Its the most boring faction in the game.
3 Apr 2017, 14:34 PM
#8
avatar of August1996

Posts: 160

Your first thing to do as USF is ban all maps that disfavour you the most, this includes all wide open maps such as Langres, Crossing, maybe even Crossroads if you hate that map. For HMG, first order of business as USF is to occupy key buildings with your REs first, swapping them out for Rifles later. Such buildings include the south church at Arnhem Checkpoint and the north house at Kholodny Ferma. For HMGs out in the open, you need two Rifle squads going from different angles, you don't even need smoke if you do it correctly. I use nades for nuking any HMGs in wooden houses and ignore stone houses.

To be honest, I think the maps that USF performs worst are, Crossing, Langres, Halbe, Road to Kharkov, Semiosky Summer and Lost Glider(seriously fuck those stone garrisons).
6 Apr 2017, 20:18 PM
#9
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 1193

Your first thing to do as USF is ban all maps that disfavour you the most, this includes all wide open maps such as Langres, Crossing, maybe even Crossroads if you hate that map. For HMG, first order of business as USF is to occupy key buildings with your REs first, swapping them out for Rifles later. Such buildings include the south church at Arnhem Checkpoint and the north house at Kholodny Ferma. For HMGs out in the open, you need two Rifle squads going from different angles, you don't even need smoke if you do it correctly. I use nades for nuking any HMGs in wooden houses and ignore stone houses.

To be honest, I think the maps that USF performs worst are, Crossing, Langres, Halbe, Road to Kharkov, Semiosky Summer and Lost Glider(seriously fuck those stone garrisons).

I wish normal exploding/fragmentation type nades were more consistent against garrisons in general.

I hate trying to play on Arnhem checkpoint too with usf for the most part. I don't know if it's just me, but I feel like the only saving graces for usf on that map are .50cal, paratroopers, and m20 mines.
7 Apr 2017, 17:40 PM
#10
avatar of Clockblocked

Posts: 26

Has anyone had any experience with the Stuart or M15 AAHT? Ive used the Stuart a few times, and it feels mostly the same, but not quite as potent as it used to be against infantry, which I feel it may have been slightly over-nerfed on. Reducing main gun damage is fine but the MG Accuracy nerfs were a bit much. Isnt AI the CoAx and Hull MGs purpose? Im not sure it needed increased pen, as I cant remember bounces on light vehicles it is intended to counter. Maybe more damage would have been better? What is your experience?

Also, has anyone used the new AAHT yet? I havent gotten around to it yet, but I wonder about what its main gun is meant for now. Before, I used it like an ass-backward luchs with less armor but an MG to make up for it. Now, with the Main gun damage vs infantry set to -50% change, I cant be sure why it exists. Can it hit/pen/damage anything outside of a Kubelwagon. Is there ever a reason to attempt to use it against any vehicle? Its nice that accuracy of both the MG and Main gun seem to increase with vet, and vet reqs are lowered, but I often have trouble keeping it alive that long vs a 222, Luchs, or god forbid a Puma, all three of which come out about the same time.

7 Apr 2017, 18:17 PM
#11
avatar of DonnieChan

Posts: 1243 | Subs: 1

First of all, thank you very much for providing your playercard.

the quickest and easiest way to improve is playing 10 games with wehrmacht while copying exactly the strat you have problems with. you will see immediately how players react to it whcih will give you plenty of insight.


the crucial thing with US is about timing. don't just rush in with your rifles because you think "i have semi autos, so i have to get in close". Use cover and mid range engagements. try to pick up loney grens and attack them from 2 sides with all your rifles firing. Ignore MG house campers and get to their Cutoff.
19 Apr 2017, 21:46 PM
#12
avatar of Clockblocked

Posts: 26

In games that you go with a doctrine that provides m1919s, is it better to equip a BAR in the other weapon slot or keep it to one m1919 per rifle squad and spend munitions elsewhere?

Also, any tips on using the m20? Should it be kept at max range to avoid being fausted, or simply in the background planting sneaky mines?
19 Apr 2017, 23:40 PM
#13
avatar of August1996

Posts: 160

In games that you go with a doctrine that provides m1919s, is it better to equip a BAR in the other weapon slot or keep it to one m1919 per rifle squad and spend munitions elsewhere?

Also, any tips on using the m20? Should it be kept at max range to avoid being fausted, or simply in the background planting sneaky mines?


M1919s used to be good when you can double up on them. Now its just go for double BARs. Mixing them up only hurts the DPS rifles as now you have a long range M1919 and mid/close range BARs.

M20 use them at long range to murder infantry or flank support weapons. Against infantry with no snares just hug them at close range and watch them drop like flies. Also extremely good at killing squads on retreat.
20 Apr 2017, 01:16 AM
#14
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Referee Badge

Posts: 481

In games that you go with a doctrine that provides m1919s, is it better to equip a BAR in the other weapon slot or keep it to one m1919 per rifle squad and spend munitions elsewhere?

Also, any tips on using the m20? Should it be kept at max range to avoid being fausted, or simply in the background planting sneaky mines?




M1919s used to be good when you can double up on them. Now its just go for double BARs. Mixing them up only hurts the DPS rifles as now you have a long range M1919 and mid/close range BARs.

M20 use them at long range to murder infantry or flank support weapons. Against infantry with no snares just hug them at close range and watch them drop like flies. Also extremely good at killing squads on retreat.


This ^

And then also the M20 gets a bonus against snipers.

21 Apr 2017, 11:52 AM
#15
avatar of EffenNewbie

Posts: 720

Has anyone had any experience with the Stuart or M15 AAHT? Ive used the Stuart a few times, and it feels mostly the same, but not quite as potent as it used to be against infantry, which I feel it may have been slightly over-nerfed on. Reducing main gun damage is fine but the MG Accuracy nerfs were a bit much. Isnt AI the CoAx and Hull MGs purpose? Im not sure it needed increased pen, as I cant remember bounces on light vehicles it is intended to counter. Maybe more damage would have been better? What is your experience?

Also, has anyone used the new AAHT yet? I havent gotten around to it yet, but I wonder about what its main gun is meant for now. Before, I used it like an ass-backward luchs with less armor but an MG to make up for it. Now, with the Main gun damage vs infantry set to -50% change, I cant be sure why it exists. Can it hit/pen/damage anything outside of a Kubelwagon. Is there ever a reason to attempt to use it against any vehicle? Its nice that accuracy of both the MG and Main gun seem to increase with vet, and vet reqs are lowered, but I often have trouble keeping it alive that long vs a 222, Luchs, or god forbid a Puma, all three of which come out about the same time.



IMO, the Stuart and M15 were badly overnerfed. I've tried both since the patch and don't like either. I'd save the fuel and try to get a Sherman out quicker.
21 Apr 2017, 14:03 PM
#16
avatar of le_saucisson_masque

Posts: 439 | Subs: 2

the quickest and easiest way to improve is playing 10 games with wehrmacht while copying exactly the strat you have problems with. you will see immediately how players react to it whcih will give you plenty of insight.


+1

play with wehrmacht if you think that mg42 are so overpowered,
you will understand soon enough how to smoke/flank/nade them or even how m20 is good at countering them.

USF got a shit tons of way to deal with osther mg42, it's not that much difficult with other allies factions, but the whole USF faction has been designed to make flank and use of light vehicle.
21 Apr 2017, 14:33 PM
#17
avatar of Delodax

Posts: 48



M1919s used to be good when you can double up on them. Now its just go for double BARs. Mixing them up only hurts the DPS rifles as now you have a long range M1919 and mid/close range BARs.



So, conclusion is to only get one M1919, and no BAR? Or is double BAR > single M1919 in all circumstances?
21 Apr 2017, 14:49 PM
#18
avatar of EtherealDragon

Posts: 1007


I wish normal exploding/fragmentation type nades were more consistent against garrisons in general.



Grenades are more or less consistent - key is to throw them at the windows that models are currently occupying (so usually the side of the garrison facing your squad) throwing them in the center of larger buildings like churches will usually do less damage overall.

The exception would be if we're talking about a damaged building - in which case if you throw the grenade at the undamaged walls you can increase he change of a collapse and wipe (damage to all walls are what cause collapses)
21 Apr 2017, 16:36 PM
#19
avatar of August1996

Posts: 160

jump backJump back to quoted post21 Apr 2017, 14:33 PMDelodax


So, conclusion is to only get one M1919, and no BAR? Or is double BAR > single M1919 in all circumstances?


Double BAR >>> everything else except thompson Rangers
21 Apr 2017, 23:00 PM
#20
avatar of Outsider_Sidaroth

Posts: 552 | Subs: 1



Double BAR >>> everything else except thompson Rangers


LMG Paras are solid AI too, specially with a team of BARfinders just behind them, above Thompsons Rangers too due to having access to TA.
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