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A Stupid Idea for USF

19 Feb 2017, 20:00 PM
#1
avatar of Angrade (Ægion)
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Posts: 765 | Subs: 2

People love to bring their Ambulance forward to create early and aggressive map pressure. However, this is very dangerous. There is a way to reduce the danger swap the Medics with Rear Echelons. It should still heal and reinforce while still having the medics back at base ready to heal infantry squads that retreat. What do you all think? Could this work or is it not worth?
Vaz
19 Feb 2017, 20:44 PM
#2
avatar of Vaz

Posts: 1158

So you can reinforce from a rear echelon squad? Am I reading this right? Sounds pretty stupid if so.
19 Feb 2017, 21:56 PM
#3
avatar of Tiger Baron

Posts: 3141 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Feb 2017, 20:44 PMVaz
So you can reinforce from a rear echelon squad? Am I reading this right? Sounds pretty stupid if so.


I think he means swaping the driving squad of the ambulance with REs.

Perhaps he's asking if it's viable.

Problem is is that if you lose the ambulance you lose a more combat effective than the medics squad, which is also your main builder and repair unit, as well as their ability to volley fire which may be crucial in some early game parts in order to gain ground and force the enemy to retreat.

But yeah, you then have 2 healing units and the REs can repair the ambulance.

I'd say see how it works out for you and then maybe report back here.
19 Feb 2017, 22:02 PM
#4
avatar of Vuther
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I think he means swaping the driving squad of the ambulance with REs.

Perhaps he's asking if it's viable.

Problem is is that if you lose the ambulance you lose a more combat effective than the medics squad, which is also your main builder and repair unit, as well as their ability to volley fire which may be crucial in some early game parts in order to gain ground and force the enemy to retreat.

But yeah, you then have 2 healing units and the REs can repair the ambulance.

I'd say see how it works out for you and then maybe report back here.

If that is indeed the topic (for I am also unsure), my suggestion would be to wait for the next patch to drop. My attempts to do it ended just with frustration from my medics not healing unless I microed them to do it or chasing my units when I didn't want them to - both things which are set to be fixed by the next patch.
19 Feb 2017, 22:09 PM
#5
avatar of Angrade (Ægion)
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I think he means swaping the driving squad of the ambulance with REs.

Perhaps he's asking if it's viable.

Problem is is that if you lose the ambulance you lose a more combat effective than the medics squad, which is also your main builder and repair unit, as well as their ability to volley fire which may be crucial in some early game parts in order to gain ground and force the enemy to retreat.

But yeah, you then have 2 healing units and the REs can repair the ambulance.

I'd say see how it works out for you and then maybe report back here.


Sorry if I was a bit unclear. I was thinking that if you lose an ambulance it would hurt less if you have the medics already out. Then, you will not need to rebuild an ambulance for the heals. Alternatively you can have the medics out on the field healing squads that just got out of combat, also increasing field presence.

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Feb 2017, 22:02 PMVuther

If that is indeed the topic (for I am also unsure), my suggestion would be to wait for the next patch to drop. My attempts to do it ended just with frustration from my medics not healing unless I microed them to do it or chasing my units when I didn't want them to - both things which are set to be fixed by the next patch.


Yes, this will help when these bugs/oversights fixed.
19 Feb 2017, 23:20 PM
#6
avatar of elchino7
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as well as their ability to volley fire which may be crucial in some early game parts in order to gain ground and force the enemy to retreat.


Since the nerf, Volley fire is no longer viable unless your opponent is asleep. You won't suppress anyone fast enough before they focus fire the RE and kill you.

OP: IMO you are just handicapping yourself in case something goes wrong. If you can somehow make medics jump before the ambulance get's killed that's "good" but putting a utility/combat unit out of the match is never a good idea.
19 Feb 2017, 23:43 PM
#7
avatar of Sturmpanther
Lead Strategist Badge

Posts: 5441 | Subs: 35



Sorry if I was a bit unclear. I was thinking that if you lose an ambulance it would hurt less if you have the medics already out. Then, you will not need to rebuild an ambulance for the heals. Alternatively you can have the medics out on the field healing squads that just got out of combat, also increasing field presence.



Yes, this will help when these bugs/oversights fixed.


The thing is, that the ambulance heals all near units at the same time!

The doctors can heal only 1 squad at the same time.

20 Feb 2017, 00:33 AM
#8
avatar of Nubb3r

Posts: 141

This sounds like a cool idea, but USF aura heal is really good and you wouldn't want to risk it. Though I would recommend to put medics into your (team game) allies' base. Brits for example could use medics in their base. You swap a wounded RE squad in, no ned to reinforce since ambo only takes two (?) crewmen and you put your medics into your brit friends' base. Brit heal sucks, because you need to have a medic section with the other units that need to be healed. Also there is no risk of mismicro for the brit, since its not his own medic so he doesn't control it.
20 Feb 2017, 00:39 AM
#9
avatar of Outsider_Sidaroth

Posts: 1323 | Subs: 1

Most maps are too small to put your Ambulance at risk, that's why you don't see it anywhere but the base, it's simply too squishy and very easy to kill without any risks involved.
Vaz
20 Feb 2017, 00:55 AM
#10
avatar of Vaz

Posts: 1158



The thing is, that the ambulance heals all near units at the same time!

The doctors can heal only 1 squad at the same time.



3 at a time, since you get a squad of 3. If I'm not mistaken, they will spread out to multiple units. The aura heal is better still, so I would prefer using the ambulance over the medics.
20 Feb 2017, 05:13 AM
#11
avatar of Tiger Baron

Posts: 3141 | Subs: 2



Since the nerf, Volley fire is no longer viable unless your opponent is asleep. You won't suppress anyone fast enough before they focus fire the RE and kill you.

OP: IMO you are just handicapping yourself in case something goes wrong. If you can somehow make medics jump before the ambulance get's killed that's "good" but putting a utility/combat unit out of the match is never a good idea.


I was unable to download the Winter Balance Patch due to Relic's Brilliant download system so I am unaware of any minor nerfs and buffs, I only remember what I read from the changelog and what I heard others discuss.
20 Feb 2017, 09:53 AM
#12
avatar of Angrade (Ægion)
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Posts: 765 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Feb 2017, 00:33 AMNubb3r
This sounds like a cool idea, but USF aura heal is really good and you wouldn't want to risk it. Though I would recommend to put medics into your (team game) allies' base. Brits for example could use medics in their base. You swap a wounded RE squad in, no ned to reinforce since ambo only takes two (?) crewmen and you put your medics into your brit friends' base. Brit heal sucks, because you need to have a medic section with the other units that need to be healed. Also there is no risk of mismicro for the brit, since its not his own medic so he doesn't control it.


Personally I think the British healing is actually on the strong side. Being able to heal your Infantry Sections on the field, increasing longevity of the squads. However, it would be nice if you could provide healing to their Royal Engineers and non-vet 3 Commandos with your now spare medics.
20 Feb 2017, 13:07 PM
#13
avatar of Nubb3r

Posts: 141



Personally I think the British healing is actually on the strong side. Being able to heal your Infantry Sections on the field, increasing longevity of the squads. However, it would be nice if you could provide healing to their Royal Engineers and non-vet 3 Commandos with your now spare medics.


Yeah, that was exactly my idea. Personal healing for IS is great, but vickers, engies etc. need it too, so sparing the medics for your brit ally you alleviate him from having to microbaseblob every now and then.
20 Feb 2017, 13:40 PM
#14
avatar of Jespe

Posts: 190

People love to bring their Ambulance forward to create early and aggressive map pressure. However, this is very dangerous. There is a way to reduce the danger swap the Medics with Rear Echelons. It should still heal and reinforce while still having the medics back at base ready to heal infantry squads that retreat. What do you all think? Could this work or is it not worth?


Tried it couple of times.

Killed those medics unknowlingly because they seem to follow infantry that is not healed completely.
20 Feb 2017, 15:09 PM
#15
avatar of Angrade (Ægion)
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jump backJump back to quoted post20 Feb 2017, 13:40 PMJespe


Tried it couple of times.

Killed those medics unknowlingly because they seem to follow infantry that is not healed completely.


WBP fixes this.
20 Feb 2017, 16:39 PM
#16
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7



I think he means swaping the driving squad of the ambulance with REs.

Perhaps he's asking if it's viable.

Problem is is that if you lose the ambulance you lose a more combat effective than the medics squad, which is also your main builder and repair unit, as well as their ability to volley fire which may be crucial in some early game parts in order to gain ground and force the enemy to retreat.

But yeah, you then have 2 healing units and the REs can repair the ambulance.

I'd say see how it works out for you and then maybe report back here.


You want to tell me that echelons are really engineers for faction that builds buildings out from nowhere and have tanks with repair crews ?

Also please enlight me how can volley fire be particulary effective
20 Feb 2017, 17:27 PM
#17
avatar of elchino7
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Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2



I was unable to download the Winter Balance Patch due to Relic's Brilliant download system so I am unaware of any minor nerfs and buffs, I only remember what I read from the changelog and what I heard others discuss.


WBP didn't touch it. After WFA release and it's required nerf, it has never been use-able early on.
20 Feb 2017, 19:14 PM
#18
avatar of Tiger Baron

Posts: 3141 | Subs: 2



WBP didn't touch it. After WFA release and it's required nerf, it has never been use-able early on.


Huh, well Idk, I always noticed that my Sturms were dead in their tracks trying to rush a volley fire RE squad.

@Hector, the Brits also don't need Engineer units since their buildings are erected from the nothing but still they have them because they're an integral part of any Army, they're dedicated mine layers, mine defusal, repair, demolition, bridge-laying (reparing in this case) and fortifications builder.

Saying that you flat out don't need them is bullshit, what would the USF do if they didn't have their tank crews to repair their vehicles, plus what if your team mate needed repairs but since you need your vehicle crews for your vehicles and no Engineer unit you wouldn't be able to help him/them in any way.
20 Feb 2017, 21:40 PM
#19
avatar of Kamzil118

Posts: 455

Also please enlight me how can volley fire be particulary effective

I don't want to step into this conversation, but volley fire can be effective if rear echelons are given light machine guns. I am not sure that this strategy is viable in the current meta, but I have stopped a blob of infantry with two-three squads armed with LMGs a few months after the volley fire was nerfed. The LMG sort of boosts the ability to actually suppress units.

Though, I highly doubt that anyone would do that since riflemen with double BARs tend to be much more effective and that most USF players just slap a few Bazookas to the REs.
20 Feb 2017, 21:43 PM
#20
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7


I don't want to step into this conversation, but volley fire can be effective if rear echelons are given light machine guns. I am not sure that this strategy is viable in the current meta, but I have stopped a blob of infantry with two-three squads armed with LMGs a few months after the volley fire was nerfed. The LMG sort of boosts the ability to actually suppress units.

Though, I highly doubt that anyone would do that since riflemen with double BARs tend to be much more effective and that most USF players just slap a few Bazookas to the REs.


Also USA isn´t munnition floating faction, that can spend ~ 140 munnition to get useful volley fire. They need munnition on so many things including rifles upgrades to keep them on par with axis counterparts, smoke to control HMG´s, grnades to control garrisons and tank abilities to win tank fights.

Thank you for your interesting post, its really interesting strategy, but won´t work, maybe in lategame where you have surplus resources ;)
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