Brace
7 Sep 2015, 05:35 AM
#61
1 
Posts: 311
MoerserKarL, do not use extensive firepower (which the brace can take), use only fire, and the Bofors will vanish from the map.
7 Sep 2015, 15:02 PM
#62
Posts: 692
I have no idea why they balance like they do. Instead of smashing brace with a huge nerf, It would be nice if relic would wait and see how things balance out after nerfing the AI of the bofors and whatnot.
They make these big sweeping nerfs making units useless, sometimes right after buffing them. I'm looking at you katyusha/ML-20/120mm mortar/pioneers, and I'm sure the list goes on.
Why is it so hard to make small incremental changes Relic? All you're doing is pissing everyone off.
UK emplacements cost a ton of resources, and you have to make them because the MP bleed from tommies alone would be huge, which is by design. They are meant to have good emplacements. A 30 second cooldown to brace will make them another huge MP/fuel sink.
They make these big sweeping nerfs making units useless, sometimes right after buffing them. I'm looking at you katyusha/ML-20/120mm mortar/pioneers, and I'm sure the list goes on.
Why is it so hard to make small incremental changes Relic? All you're doing is pissing everyone off.
UK emplacements cost a ton of resources, and you have to make them because the MP bleed from tommies alone would be huge, which is by design. They are meant to have good emplacements. A 30 second cooldown to brace will make them another huge MP/fuel sink.
7 Sep 2015, 15:22 PM
#63
Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1
Emplacement concept will be hard to balance, I wish good luck to Relic.
In one side, you have an expensive static unit so you want some return on investment.
On the other side, you have someone who try to push your army off and can't deal with the emplacement because it has a super strong defense ability.
Imo I don't expect Anvil being viable in 1vs1 in the long run, emplacement will always suffer of, or being weak vs their natural counter or completely OP.
In one side, you have an expensive static unit so you want some return on investment.
On the other side, you have someone who try to push your army off and can't deal with the emplacement because it has a super strong defense ability.
Imo I don't expect Anvil being viable in 1vs1 in the long run, emplacement will always suffer of, or being weak vs their natural counter or completely OP.
7 Sep 2015, 15:27 PM
#64
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
A have a feeling that giving cooldown to brace is like giving cooldown to retreat, after each retreat
7 Sep 2015, 16:06 PM
#65
Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1
Brace is shit and must be tonned down or removed. The whole UKF army is a joke.
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
7 Sep 2015, 16:14 PM
#66
Posts: 692
Brace is shit and must be tonned down or removed. The whole UKF army is a joke.
The only joke here is your 1500 posts of wehraboo whining. Why would you even bother posting if its just going to be a pathetic tantrum?
Remove brace? LOL
7 Sep 2015, 16:49 PM
#67
Posts: 509 | Subs: 1
Axis fanboys always win. Brace nerfed next patch with less than 2 weeks of brits release (it's a RTS game, you don't even have time to find counters. Totally lack of purpose).
Btw i can't believe somebody complaining about an ability to an emplacement that costs 400 mp (in the most mp starved faction) and disable fire when activated. I'll give you a tip: le.IG 18 next to Flak HT, bye bye mortar pits. Certainly there are some units in brits faction that may need to be nerfed (same as buffed others) but mortar pit, no way. Anyway for me it's too early to claim anything OP or UP either. Just be serious ffs. Game is about strategy not only win without any effort.
PS: Engies repairing mortar pit while being shoted by any type of artillery (mortar or IG 18) die in 2s.
Btw i can't believe somebody complaining about an ability to an emplacement that costs 400 mp (in the most mp starved faction) and disable fire when activated. I'll give you a tip: le.IG 18 next to Flak HT, bye bye mortar pits. Certainly there are some units in brits faction that may need to be nerfed (same as buffed others) but mortar pit, no way. Anyway for me it's too early to claim anything OP or UP either. Just be serious ffs. Game is about strategy not only win without any effort.
PS: Engies repairing mortar pit while being shoted by any type of artillery (mortar or IG 18) die in 2s.
7 Sep 2015, 19:27 PM
#68
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Axis fanboys always win. Brace nerfed next patch with less than 2 weeks of brits release (it's a RTS game, you don't even have time to find counters. Totally lack of purpose).
It was actually nerfed just like this in Alpha for a reason, the change just didn't make it into live. There is zero reason for it to have no cooldown because it makes it to easy to camp.
Btw i can't believe somebody complaining about an ability to an emplacement that costs 400 mp (in the most mp starved faction)
Brits are MP starved if you spam IS, if you don't spam IS they have just as much MP as any other faction. Once the Ost sniper is fixed they wont have nearly as much MP problems.
I'll give you a tip: le.IG 18 next to Flak HT, bye bye mortar pits.
That's kind of the issue, because of Brace cheap indirect like support guns and mortars do way more damage to emplacements than actual artillery does due to cooldowns. This change is fine.
PS: Engies repairing mortar pit while being shoted by any type of artillery (mortar or IG 18) die in 2s.
All units that repair get an incoming damage modifier.
7 Sep 2015, 19:52 PM
#69
Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7
It was actually nerfed just like this in Alpha for a reason, the change just didn't make it into live. There is zero reason for it to have no cooldown because it makes it to easy to camp.
60 seconds is overnerf and yo cant argue for that , 30 second is fine it give us ability to counter it but still it is not overkill
Brits are MP starved if you spam IS, if you don't spam IS they have just as much MP as any other faction. Once the Ost sniper is fixed they wont have nearly as much MP problems.
And what you want to do in early game except 1 mg and 3 IS (total)
or im mising something like investing so much mp (280= 1 IS ) to get pios ?
That's kind of the issue, because of Brace cheap indirect like support guns and mortars do way more damage to emplacements than actual artillery does due to cooldowns. This change is fine.
+1
All units that repair get an incoming damage modifier.
All factions have a counter to turbomortar cvered by hmg and sniper + grens and probably scout car and pak [IRONY]
7 Sep 2015, 19:54 PM
#70
Posts: 61
Emplacements/brace are either good or really not that much of a factor depending on the map. So balancing them is kind of tricky. I think all that brace needs is a slight cool down increase (Take longer to activate) and it will be fine.
7 Sep 2015, 20:05 PM
#71
Posts: 509 | Subs: 1
It was actually nerfed just like this in Alpha for a reason, the change just didn't make it into live. There is zero reason for it to have no cooldown because it makes it to easy to camp.
Really? Camp what if mortar pit does not shot shells while brace activated?
Btw just do flame-shell from mortar-ht and mortar pit goes down despite of brace being activated in a few seconds.
All units that repair get an incoming damage modifier.
Already knew that, that's why I said engies die in 2s while repairing. Point?
7 Sep 2015, 20:49 PM
#72
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Really? Camp what if mortar pit does not shot shells while brace activated?
Btw just do flame-shell from mortar-ht and mortar pit goes down despite of brace being activated in a few seconds.
Camp because it allows you to be pushed off the field for a period but still retain your structure investments in a way other factions cannot. And as I have stated multiple times in this various thread all flame damage is getting a reduction next patch because currently it does retardly high DoT damage (like molotovs killing bunkers and caches) which is able to negate braces added armor (as armor is the best solution for stopping flame damage).
Already knew that, that's why I said engies die in 2s while repairing. Point?
It's not something Brits have to uniquely deal with is my point. And British engineers are the second best in the game currently only losing out to Sturmpioneers.
8 Sep 2015, 01:47 AM
#73
Posts: 692
How to beat British without any effort:
1) Make a Sniper AKA your german Hero unit and own british 4 man squads in seconds
2) Make a mortar HT and 1 shot 400mp+ emplacements with 1 incendiary shell
1) Make a Sniper AKA your german Hero unit and own british 4 man squads in seconds
2) Make a mortar HT and 1 shot 400mp+ emplacements with 1 incendiary shell
8 Sep 2015, 02:03 AM
#74
Posts: 111
I think im actually ok with Brace, but Pak43 & OKW flack emplacements should get it too
Let's all make sure Axis gets everything good that the allies have, and then also make sure that allies never get anything good that the axis have.
This sounds like a good way to balance the game.
Ready!? BREAK!
8 Sep 2015, 07:38 AM
#75
8 Posts: 2470
brace is really annoying to deal with but i think it needs to stay. the brit's emplacements are very similar to OKW's building setup, particularly the flakHQ, except that they are more expensive and not part of teching.
also mortar halftrack.
also mortar halftrack.
8 Sep 2015, 07:48 AM
#76
Posts: 2819
After a week of playing against it, I think it's a good ability.
You can destroy the emplacements with relative easy, but brace gives the time to react to an upcoming attack. Which is a good thing.
You can destroy the emplacements with relative easy, but brace gives the time to react to an upcoming attack. Which is a good thing.
All posts made are about situations in 2v2's. Not a 1v1 player.
8 Sep 2015, 13:52 PM
#77
Posts: 600
Let's all make sure Axis gets everything good that the allies have, and then also make sure that allies never get anything good that the axis have.
This sounds like a good way to balance the game.
Ready!? BREAK!
Bit like how hammer tactics give brits blitz speed?
Most of the good stuff on the axis faction (like smoke, self repair ect) is doctrinal... where as the allies have most of them as standard + better doctrinal abilities.
8 Sep 2015, 14:07 PM
#78
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Think of brace as a standard retreat.
If you hit retreat before its too late, your squad will survive.
Forget about it and you will lose it.
Emplacements cannot move so its obvious they should have something to protect them.
If you blob as OKW or usf, got into heavy fire and retreat to FRP, and then 30sec later blob again into heavy fire, do you have cooldown on retreat? No, you dont. You can save your troops how many times you want.
As for brace. Giving it cooldown like this, means insta death.
Attack with mortar - force to brace - wait - attack with off map, Stuka, sturmtiger, mortars, leig, anything to kill it.
Now imagine that your blob cannot retreat from OKW Schwerer and you can just watch how models are dying.
Its not perfect comparasion but still.
Make brace without cooldown, so you can use it constantly, but received damage would be around 20-30% of normal damage instead of almost unkillable.
If you hit retreat before its too late, your squad will survive.
Forget about it and you will lose it.
Emplacements cannot move so its obvious they should have something to protect them.
If you blob as OKW or usf, got into heavy fire and retreat to FRP, and then 30sec later blob again into heavy fire, do you have cooldown on retreat? No, you dont. You can save your troops how many times you want.
As for brace. Giving it cooldown like this, means insta death.
Attack with mortar - force to brace - wait - attack with off map, Stuka, sturmtiger, mortars, leig, anything to kill it.
Now imagine that your blob cannot retreat from OKW Schwerer and you can just watch how models are dying.
Its not perfect comparasion but still.
Make brace without cooldown, so you can use it constantly, but received damage would be around 20-30% of normal damage instead of almost unkillable.
8 Sep 2015, 14:14 PM
#79
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Think of brace as a standard retreat.
Brace =/= retreat.
If you hit retreat before its too late, your squad will survive.
Brace =/= retreat.
Emplacements cannot move so its obvious they should have something to protect them.
So can we give Brace to all static structures then?
If you blob as OKW or usf, got into heavy fire and retreat to FRP, and then 30sec later blob again into heavy fire, do you have cooldown on retreat? No, you dont. You can save your troops how many times you want.
Except FRP's aren't hard to punish at all.
As for brace. Giving it cooldown like this, means insta death.
No it means you need to consider your investment. 60 seconds is still shorter than the recharge on most artillery pieces.
Attack with mortar - force to brace - wait - attack with off map, Stuka, sturmtiger, mortars, leig, anything to kill it.
It's almost like that's how it should work!?
Now imagine that your blob cannot retreat from OKW Schwerer and you can just watch how models are dying.
But the Schwer doesn't have the durability of emplacements though? It cannot move, but it cannot brace.
Make brace without cooldown, so you can use it constantly, but received damage would be around 20-30% instead of almost unkillable.
This would make mortars and support guns to good against them, decent cooldown + high reduction (which is how it will be in the upcomming patch) works well enough.
8 Sep 2015, 14:27 PM
#80
Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1
Brace =/= retreat.
Brace =/= retreat.
So can we give Brace to all static structures then?
Except FRP's aren't hard to punish at all.
No it means you need to consider your investment. 60 seconds is still shorter than the recharge on most artillery pieces.
It's almost like that's how it should work!?
But the Schwer doesn't have the durability of emplacements though? It cannot move, but it cannot brace.
This would make mortars and support guns to good against them, decent cooldown + high reduction (which is how it will be in the upcomming patch) works well enough.
Brace is retreat for structures. Saying it is not equal to retreat is just...weird.
Also the Brit emplacements are a core part of the army, and in many cases are required, while the other factions emplacements are not, and have other strengths. OKW trucks certainly do not deserve this function because they are not required to be built out of base sector, you just have the added bonus of being able to do that. Oh and the Germans never have the problem of Stuka dive bomb destroying stationary structures in one hit. The most they have to fear is an IL-2 which can be shot down and is extremely munitions heavy.
I don't really even know how to respond to your Schwerr comment. Basically you are arguing a free upgrade on a tech structure, that can kill inf, light tanks, planes, and support weapons that come within range, and seriously threaten medium tanks is not enough. You should also be able to make it indestructible because you built it too far outside your base for 0 cost. Oh and the building self deploys so it takes none of your infantry off the front line to gain field presence.
Good to see predictions of nerf Allies buff Axis as soon as Brits appeared going on full force.
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