Solve balance issue regarding call-ins
13 Oct 2014, 14:33 PM
#1
Posts: 28
What if for each call in of a tank the next time you use it cost is increased by a percentage. Maybe only for the big heavy beasts, the next time you call it in say it costs 25% extra, and the next time after that, 25% added to that amount. That would show their rarity, afford unit preservation and avoid spam in team games.
13 Oct 2014, 15:03 PM
#2
Posts: 1605 | Subs: 1
So factions, that heavily rely on call-ins would be punished while others will roflstomp (even more) in the late game.
As a soviet 4v4 player (mostly) I say - no, thanks. At least not unless there are non-doctrinal heavy armor alternative. Like KV-85.
As a soviet 4v4 player (mostly) I say - no, thanks. At least not unless there are non-doctrinal heavy armor alternative. Like KV-85.
13 Oct 2014, 15:11 PM
#3
Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2
Permanently BannedNO.
just add fuel upkeep relic!
just add fuel upkeep relic!
There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
13 Oct 2014, 15:40 PM
#4
Posts: 1740
IMO the best solution for the call in problem is to bind call ins to the techings.
Ostheer:
Stug III G - T3
Tiger/Ace - T4
Elefant - T4
Puma - T2
Soviet:
T34/85 - T3 OR T4
IS-2 - T3 OR T4
ISU-152 - T3 OR (AND?!) T4
KW2 - T3 OR T4
KW1 - T3 OR T4
KW8 - T3 OR T4
M4 Sherman - T3 OR T4
M3 with Guards - T1 OR T2
OKW:
Jagdtiger - All 3 Buildings built (like KT)
P4 Ausführung J - Mechanized Company Built
Kommandopanther - Mechanized Company Built
Ostwind - Heal or Ressourcetruck built (Or maybe also Mechanized)
USF:
M10 - Captain or Lieutenant unlocked
M8 - Captain or Lieutenant unlocked
Jeep - No unlocks needed
M4 E8 - Major unlocked
M4 Bulldozer - Major unlocked
Priest - Major unlocked
I probably forgot some units but you get the point.
This would add the fact that players would actually try to tech and test new strategies instead of just waiting for the uber call-ins.
Ostheer:
Stug III G - T3
Tiger/Ace - T4
Elefant - T4
Puma - T2
Soviet:
T34/85 - T3 OR T4
IS-2 - T3 OR T4
ISU-152 - T3 OR (AND?!) T4
KW2 - T3 OR T4
KW1 - T3 OR T4
KW8 - T3 OR T4
M4 Sherman - T3 OR T4
M3 with Guards - T1 OR T2
OKW:
Jagdtiger - All 3 Buildings built (like KT)
P4 Ausführung J - Mechanized Company Built
Kommandopanther - Mechanized Company Built
Ostwind - Heal or Ressourcetruck built (Or maybe also Mechanized)
USF:
M10 - Captain or Lieutenant unlocked
M8 - Captain or Lieutenant unlocked
Jeep - No unlocks needed
M4 E8 - Major unlocked
M4 Bulldozer - Major unlocked
Priest - Major unlocked
I probably forgot some units but you get the point.
This would add the fact that players would actually try to tech and test new strategies instead of just waiting for the uber call-ins.
It is though God by command has withdrawn every other throne.
And God is saying 'No. These people will deal with me alone.'
And God is saying 'No. These people will deal with me alone.'
13 Oct 2014, 15:49 PM
#5
Posts: 655
Permanently BannedThere are so many people who have ideas on how the call-in meta should be solved, and I think Relic has the same feeling, all their ideas scattered. While I'd normally say something sarcastic like "Oh look it's this thread again" but this is an issue that really needs to be screamed if anything is gonna get done about it.
Highfiveeeee, I like your idea, but it kinda removes the point to having call-in units to begin with. I'd like to see call-ins still used and viable, but not the basis of the meta.
Highfiveeeee, I like your idea, but it kinda removes the point to having call-in units to begin with. I'd like to see call-ins still used and viable, but not the basis of the meta.
A Fallen Scrub
13 Oct 2014, 16:16 PM
#6
Posts: 1637
Tying heavy Call ins to tech would only delay them for all factions but OKW in team games. Since OKW currently has to tech to all buildings to call in the KT and they still do it...every game. It would really hurt the Soviets and Ostheer. But OKW wouldnt give a damn since their tech cost isnt every expensive in comparison.
The PTRS's are fine as they are. Whenever i'm up against Guard Infantry, I always have to be careful with my vehicles or the Guards will completely destroy them. Good range, good damage and fairly cheap; if anything, the PTRS should nerfed since it's ridiculously good for the price. Even in the hands of Conscripts, the PTRS's are extremely potent.
13 Oct 2014, 16:22 PM
#7
2 
Posts: 1108
IMO the best solution for the call in problem is to bind call ins to the techings.
Ostheer:
Stug III G - T3
Tiger/Ace - T4
Elefant - T4
Puma - T2
Soviet:
T34/85 - T3 OR T4
IS-2 - T3 OR T4
ISU-152 - T3 OR (AND?!) T4
KW2 - T3 OR T4
KW1 - T3 OR T4
KW8 - T3 OR T4
M4 Sherman - T3 OR T4
M3 with Guards - T1 OR T2
OKW:
Jagdtiger - All 3 Buildings built (like KT)
P4 Ausführung J - Mechanized Company Built
Kommandopanther - Mechanized Company Built
Ostwind - Heal or Ressourcetruck built (Or maybe also Mechanized)
USF:
M10 - Captain or Lieutenant unlocked
M8 - Captain or Lieutenant unlocked
Jeep - No unlocks needed
M4 E8 - Major unlocked
M4 Bulldozer - Major unlocked
Priest - Major unlocked
I probably forgot some units but you get the point.
This would add the fact that players would actually try to tech and test new strategies instead of just waiting for the uber call-ins.
+1
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13 Oct 2014, 16:27 PM
#8
Posts: 2561
First call-ins need to be attached to tech so that they do not get a large resource advantage over players who tech.
Then fuel upkeep needs to be added to vehicles so that lighter vehicles stay relevant against heavier vehicles.
That's what it will take for the game would be able to be balanced in the late game across all modes
Then fuel upkeep needs to be added to vehicles so that lighter vehicles stay relevant against heavier vehicles.
That's what it will take for the game would be able to be balanced in the late game across all modes
13 Oct 2014, 16:38 PM
#9
Posts: 1637
First call-ins need to be attached to tech so that they do not get a large resource advantage over players who tech.
Then fuel upkeep needs to be added to vehicles so that lighter vehicles stay relevant against heavier vehicles.
That's what it will take for the game would be able to be balanced in the late game across all modes
I think the combination is a good idea. But fuel prices for tech for all factions should be identical to keep it fair. Wouldnt want a Tiger to be more expensive then a KT for example.
The PTRS's are fine as they are. Whenever i'm up against Guard Infantry, I always have to be careful with my vehicles or the Guards will completely destroy them. Good range, good damage and fairly cheap; if anything, the PTRS should nerfed since it's ridiculously good for the price. Even in the hands of Conscripts, the PTRS's are extremely potent.
13 Oct 2014, 16:39 PM
#10
Posts: 728
definately wouldn't want to see the cost increase for getting an easy 8 called in every time or a fuel upkeep it is hard enough getting a couple late game now that there 145 fuel and considering it is still nothing compared to german and soviet late game call in tanks. Most USF are going to have at least a t3 probably t4 building unlocked by then anyways as you just cannot survive until 9 command points waiting to call in easy 8s.
13 Oct 2014, 18:24 PM
#11
Posts: 154 | Subs: 2
definately wouldn't want to see the cost increase for getting an easy 8 called in every time or a fuel upkeep it is hard enough getting a couple late game now that there 145 fuel.
Child please! Don't think it would be super-difficult to adjust fuel cost and CP requirements.
NO.
just add fuel upkeep relic!
Wouldnt only encourage saving for late game call-ins? Don't see how that would fix any balance or gameplay issues at all.
---------
I agree with OP, simply put tech-requirements for Doctrinal tanks would fix the horrendous call-in gameplay that is so prevalent right now. How much more interesting wouldnt it be to watch replays and casts if this was the case? "This guy went T4, will he get Panther for AT, Brummbär for AI or Tiger for something with a bit of both?"
You actually have to use your timing to choose when to tech. You can even scout enemy base to get an idea of what he might get! "He went T3? Then he probably won't afford teching t4 later to get his Tiger."
"Oh fuck, I know he has ISU commander and I can see him building T4 now!"
Other units could do well with a maximum amount or very long cooldown at the very least. (I'm looking at you ISU/Elephant!)
This shall hence become my music
13 Oct 2014, 18:35 PM
#12
Posts: 543
Heavy call ins should be limited to 1 per game.
13 Oct 2014, 18:37 PM
#13
Posts: 2561
Heavy call ins should be limited to 1 per game.I don't like hard caps. It's better to better to keep all builds possible, even if the chances of attaining them are slim.
13 Oct 2014, 18:54 PM
#14
Posts: 17892 | Subs: 8
Heavy call ins should be limited to 1 per game.
So we won't see other stuff except tiger aces ever again? No thanks.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
13 Oct 2014, 19:15 PM
#15
Posts: 154 | Subs: 2
So we won't see other stuff except tiger aces ever again? No thanks.
Hahaha, I thought you disagreed with yourself there. ;j
This shall hence become my music
13 Oct 2014, 19:17 PM
#16
Posts: 2070
Wouldn't the call-ins being tied to tech hurt Soviets and Ost a lot? It cost a lot to tech up as those factions
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
13 Oct 2014, 19:25 PM
#17
Posts: 154 | Subs: 2
Wouldn't the call-ins being tied to tech hurt Soviets and Ost a lot? It cost a lot to tech up as those factions
If nothing else is changed of course but I don't think that is the point here.
This shall hence become my music
13 Oct 2014, 19:29 PM
#18
Posts: 2070
But would players build the units that come out of that tier? Or would they just build the building and continue waiting for call-ins? It will delay the first call-in, but would it change the meta?
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
13 Oct 2014, 19:34 PM
#19
Posts: 680
I Think you are thinking this the wrong way - the soviets should not be punished by resticting them to one call-in or making the call-in unlocked by basebuildings. Instead make the core-units so good that a call-in is made on strategic decision instead of a must.
http://www.coh2.org/topic/24647/would-a-swap-between-t3476-and-t3485-be-good-for-the-game
http://www.coh2.org/topic/24647/would-a-swap-between-t3476-and-t3485-be-good-for-the-game
13 Oct 2014, 19:47 PM
#20
Posts: 154 | Subs: 2
But would players build the units that come out of that tier? Or would they just build the building and continue waiting for call-ins? It will delay the first call-in, but would it change the meta?
Basically you get more bang-for-buck with call-ins. Tying them to tiers will level that out. To counter your enemies units you might want a Tiger and a Brummbär for example. As it is now, it would be insane to get Tiger and then spend fuel/manpower/time to tech to T4 to get that Brummbär. You might as well just get a 2nd Tiger instead. You see what I mean?
Also you could somewhat predict what your opponent is doing a bit and could even delay him by destroying the tier building.
This shall hence become my music
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