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top 200 play turns out its blobs snipers or cheese

30 Aug 2014, 02:09 AM
#1
avatar of nikolai262
Donator 22

Posts: 83

So I finally made it into top 200 as okw and Russians only to realise that the majority of the players in this bracket just use the cheapest tactics to win. I have literally given up playing 1v1 now because its just so lame and boring.

Play as okw 1st 2 games vs usa and its exactly the same each time struggle to control a ridiculous blob that steamrolls everything you have into easy 8 spam. sometimes there were like 6-7 squads just rolling around, no attempt to cap the map who needs fuel and ammo when I can just destroy all your units one by one then bother to cap. lack of mg does not help kubel is a pos.

Play next few games vs soviets and its even lamer every time the exact same, snipers + m3 into guards and call ins. One guy had 3 snipers in one game its just bs what can you do? the kubel is a piece of shit and gets killed by m3 that protects the sniper and he can have two snipers an m3 flamer and some cons by the time you get your first shreck squad, the shreks always fucking miss or blow up on a fucking wall or tree branch while the snipers just eat you alive. Soviet player can just use the map to avoid your units and pick them of one by one with the snipers try to rush the snipers and he has guards or m3. Once again even if you hold on then comes the ISU or 85/s.

I played some games as soviets and it was the same story just a massive fucking blob rolling round the map. Maybe I'm not used to it so yes maybe a little L2P but still seriously this is so lame.

Am I wrong is it fun playing like this?
30 Aug 2014, 02:14 AM
#2
avatar of ilGetUSomDay

Posts: 612

Watch some of the top streams. You will see this is not the case at the top levels of play. Top 200-1000 is players with varying levels of skill. A lot of them are really not terribly great but use cheese like you noticed to get to that point. They are not skilled players but rely on the the build and meta to win. Blobing can only get you so far. As for the snipers guard, its really just a faction design problem
30 Aug 2014, 02:41 AM
#3
avatar of Greeb

Posts: 971

As soviets, OKW infantry is so powerful that they need to rely in support units like snipers or maxims as main infantry to stay alive until doctrinal units are available.

USF can only blob rifles. Terrible faction design.

I just stopped playing the game till a patch is released because the current state of the game is truly boring as you said.
30 Aug 2014, 03:25 AM
#4
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

1v1
Top 200 with new factions is nothing "amazing" since you can mostly get there with a barely higher 50% w/l. Even those near the top100 ± can be just 500+ ranks with the older factions.

2v2
Random top200 is quite something but still you are probably going to be bouncing a lot.
Same with AT.

Regarding builds:
Yeah, it´s pretty on a stale state. Against someone of similar skill, a solid strat will beat any less viable or "hipster" one. At mid low levels, spam and blobs is what it seems are your daily food.
I guess is a matter of improving so you can actually handicap yourself against worst opponents (or those who don´t have "competitive" commanders on their loadouts) to try different things.

30 Aug 2014, 05:44 AM
#5
avatar of austerlitz

Posts: 1705

Lol yeah truly boring meta atm,if ur ost even worse - 1 infantry,1 tank.Don't blame usa though-nothing they can do except blob.
30 Aug 2014, 05:46 AM
#6
avatar of steel

Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1

Lol yeah truly boring meta atm,if ur ost even worse - 1 infantry,1 tank.Don't blame usa though-nothing they can do except blob.
You meant nothing but spam. You can always decide to not blob.
30 Aug 2014, 05:54 AM
#7
avatar of austerlitz

Posts: 1705

Wait till patch,
@steel - yeah thats what i meant,but due to lmgs..blobbing is more effective than it should be .Flanking units can be gunned down from range.
30 Aug 2014, 06:04 AM
#8
avatar of steel

Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1

Wait till patch,
@steel - yeah thats what i meant,but due to lmgs..blobbing is more effective than it should be .Flanking units can be gunned down from range.
Well said lad. The new LMG promotes blobbing. I think the old LMG was better.
30 Aug 2014, 07:23 AM
#9
avatar of LemonJuice

Posts: 1144 | Subs: 7

in any game you play, the top levels are all about finding the most efficient way to victory. that being said, blobbing is fairly easily countered using a variety of tools at your disposal.
raw
30 Aug 2014, 07:24 AM
#10
avatar of raw

Posts: 644

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Aug 2014, 02:41 AMGreeb
As soviets, OKW infantry is so powerful that they need to rely in support units like snipers or maxims as main infantry to stay alive until doctrinal units are available.

USF can only blob rifles. Terrible faction design.

I just stopped playing the game till a patch is released because the current state of the game is truly boring as you said.


this
30 Aug 2014, 08:54 AM
#11
avatar of Aerohank

Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1

It's a problem with the game design really. There is just too great of a gap between 'optimal' and 'sub-optimal' strategies.

It's mostly due to the effectiveness of doctrinal vs non-doctrinal units, and the high cost of teching to get decent tanks vs availability of superior call-in tanks without teching.

Trying to have fun and rolling with Wehrmacht Festung Support Doctrine for some ostruppen and a howitzer just gives you a much lower chance of winning than just going for Mechanised Assault doctrine and bringing in the no-tech call-in tanks.

Trying to play Soviets of fun with Soviet Reserve Army for some combined arms supported by irregulars and a howitzer can be loads of fun against Wehrmacht, but only if they use sub-optimal doctrines themselves. VS OKW you are playing to lose with that playstyle. And in general you are just much better off with guards motor for better call-in infantry and superior tanks that you can get without tech.

USA and OKW are less affected by 'good' and 'bad' doctrines in my opinion, but they both actually have powerful core armies.
30 Aug 2014, 09:47 AM
#12
avatar of sevenfour

Posts: 222

So I finally made it into top 200 as okw and Russians only to realise that the majority of the players in this bracket just use the cheapest tactics to win. I have literally given up playing 1v1 now because its just so lame and boring.

Play as okw 1st 2 games vs usa and its exactly the same each time struggle to control a ridiculous blob that steamrolls everything you have into easy 8 spam. sometimes there were like 6-7 squads just rolling around, no attempt to cap the map who needs fuel and ammo when I can just destroy all your units one by one then bother to cap. lack of mg does not help kubel is a pos.

Play next few games vs soviets and its even lamer every time the exact same, snipers + m3 into guards and call ins. One guy had 3 snipers in one game its just bs what can you do? the kubel is a piece of shit and gets killed by m3 that protects the sniper and he can have two snipers an m3 flamer and some cons by the time you get your first shreck squad, the shreks always fucking miss or blow up on a fucking wall or tree branch while the snipers just eat you alive. Soviet player can just use the map to avoid your units and pick them of one by one with the snipers try to rush the snipers and he has guards or m3. Once again even if you hold on then comes the ISU or 85/s.

I played some games as soviets and it was the same story just a massive fucking blob rolling round the map. Maybe I'm not used to it so yes maybe a little L2P but still seriously this is so lame.

Am I wrong is it fun playing like this?


You are not wrong, I`d say you are actually pretty much spot on.

My CoH2 cycle is:
  • Start playing CoH again since there are no good RTS games on the market.
  • Play as axis (faction design is more fun) and face multiple snipers BS most of the time.
  • Get fed up, switch to Soviets and do multiple snipers BS most of the time.
  • Get bored and quit CoH.
  • Repeat.
30 Aug 2014, 09:58 AM
#13
avatar of Thunderhun

Posts: 1617

It's always been like this in the top levels of 1v1 and 2v2 ladder. People tend to use glithces/bugs/OP units/strats and cheese just to be in the top 10. Having a nice rank in the ladder only require decent micro and cheese (just look at PzAngrifien).

Also being in top 200 isn't hard as the game lacks 1v1 players, even many noobs got into top 200.

Nevermind the bad faction design and retarded commanders.

So yeah, after 10 games I'm usually fed up and go to an another game, but eventually I return 'cuz since I've started COH my standarts are too high. :D
30 Aug 2014, 13:27 PM
#14
avatar of Butcher

Posts: 1217

I agree. In my experience the USA don´t have much of a choice, they are designed around riflemen being used extensively. Imo that requires skill.

Soviets on the other hand are just annoying. Either it´s the dual sniper followed by guards and mines, which eventually will destroy any hope of having a fun game. Or it´s durable 6 men maxim crews sitting everywhere. So the real problem lies with the Soviets. As if that wasn´t enough, a neutered Panther is supposed to defeat armies of T-34/85s with mark vehicle leading to late game medium tank spam.

A first step of fixing their annoying gameplay would be to make conscripts more attractive and snipers less viable.
30 Aug 2014, 19:50 PM
#15
avatar of van Voort
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 3552 | Subs: 2

This simply cannot be true.

Whenever the rest of us venture an opinion we get told that only the top 1v1 players have valid judgement because of their leet mad skilz.
31 Aug 2014, 15:15 PM
#16
avatar of ZombiFrancis

Posts: 2742

The "top players" bit is an excellent way to disregard 99% of the customer base. It feels democratic because anyone, if they try hard enough, can get there. But once there, then there's a very select group of people that can be listened to and ignored, rather than giving the nameless internet masses a voice to be silenced.
raw
31 Aug 2014, 18:07 PM
#17
avatar of raw

Posts: 644



You are not wrong, I`d say you are actually pretty much spot on.

My CoH2 cycle is:
  • Start playing CoH again since there are no good RTS games on the market.
  • Play as axis (faction design is more fun) (they are plain ass better in every way) and face multiple snipers BS because they can't viably play anything else.
  • Rage because my Ubersoldaten still ocassionally die to things if I really really mishandle them, demand that Relic make Germans more strong, switch to Soviets and do multiple snipers BS most of the time.
  • Get bored and quit CoH.
  • Repeat.


Ammended for truth value.


Soviets on the other hand are just annoying. Either it´s the dual sniper followed by guards and mines, which eventually will destroy any hope of having a fun game. Or it´s durable 6 men maxim crews sitting everywhere.


Try playing anything else.
31 Aug 2014, 18:25 PM
#18
avatar of pantherswag

Posts: 231

I'm top 50 and the only time I blob is to counter another blob that I don't have a proper counter for yet. Cheesy strats and blobs only work until you get a counter out. Then 9 times out of 10 the other player will have no idea what to do because blobbing/cheesing is the only thing they know how to do.
31 Aug 2014, 18:38 PM
#19
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

The "top players" bit is an excellent way to disregard 99% of the customer base. It feels democratic because anyone, if they try hard enough, can get there. But once there, then there's a very select group of people that can be listened to and ignored, rather than giving the nameless internet masses a voice to be silenced.


You can have low skill, be low ranked, play just "casual" for the fun big teamgames AND have a valid argument/opinion because you KNOW how the game works.
You don´t neccesarily need to be ABLE to apply your knowledge rather than having it. Thing is, MOST of the playerbase don´t know mechanics, timings, synergies, stats, strats, potential of units or skill to use them at their most. They just whine because they don´t realize what they are doing wrong.

1 Sep 2014, 00:44 AM
#20
avatar of steel

Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1

I'm top 50 and the only time I blob is to counter another blob that I don't have a proper counter for yet. Cheesy strats and blobs only work until you get a counter out. Then 9 times out of 10 the other player will have no idea what to do because blobbing/cheesing is the only thing they know how to do.
Spot on. I've seen my opponent pratically lost 3/4 of the map because they keep going through the same place trying to go through the same place guarded by 2 bunkers and some S-mine. I just went around with my pio capping.
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