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russian armor

Ostheer since new patch

15 Jan 2014, 21:36 PM
#81
avatar of link0

Posts: 337

They are pretty inaccurate and vulnerable in m3s though. But I agree yet another lame sov cheese strat.


They have 100% accuracy when the M3 is not moving. They also fire faster because they don't seek auto-cover. A decent player using the clowncar sniper is just infuriating.
15 Jan 2014, 22:32 PM
#82
avatar of Aradan

Posts: 992



I am interested when OS will get the MG-42 in a Halftrack via DLC and will be getting it at 0 CP, just imagine the Sov Rage of an MG that pins and can move without the need to Setup and De-setup =))


OST can have LMG or PzG with shrecks in halftrack (250). And i like, if halftrack MG generate some suppresion.

Maybie 50% accuracy infantry in car (not moving), will solve this problem. In past CoH I hate kangaroos, now is it little kangaroo.
15 Jan 2014, 23:19 PM
#83
avatar of gokkel

Posts: 542



I am interested when OS will get the MG-42 in a Halftrack via DLC and will be getting it at 0 CP, just imagine the Sov Rage of an MG that pins and can move without the need to Setup and De-setup =))


Sounds awfully similar to that Russian M5 Halftrack after the upgrade! If you have some ridiculous luck you might steal one and make them already rage!
15 Jan 2014, 23:27 PM
#84
avatar of Cyridius

Posts: 627

Let's just say this;

In CoH1, two squads caught out in the open with no cover would mince eachother in a few seconds. This is what made strategic play and flanking rewarding.

Due to the durability of units(primarily infantry), that strategic play and flanking no longer even exists except where a set-up position is in play. My Grens can duke it out with Conscripts for unnaturally large periods of time. It bogs down gameplay, rewards nooby play and minimizes effort.
16 Jan 2014, 09:20 AM
#85
avatar of MarcoRossolini

Posts: 1040

And makes grenades king.
16 Jan 2014, 22:02 PM
#86
avatar of Bravus

Posts: 503

Permanently Banned
The no cover need thing is very wrong, you take a good position (all green) like the shots dont work and miss all, and the enemy infantry get comming into you in open space, shoting or molotov, and forcing get off the good place quick... The infantry are too strong on this game, see by the tanks that fires in the middle of 6 guys and no one dies?! Yes sometimes is this...
17 Jan 2014, 06:39 AM
#87
avatar of wongtp

Posts: 647

tank vs infantry are not calculated, infact every shot is always a miss, its the AOE that gets infantry most of the time. so its very much based on chance, they could reduce scatter, and increase AOE to make things more consistent though.

i miss the vcoh tables where tanks gets calculated hits and shells will warp all over the place to get its targets.
17 Jan 2014, 07:48 AM
#88
avatar of coh2player

Posts: 1571

I have played this game since it first appeared. The Germans used to be completely OP in such an obvious way.

Since then, they have buffed the Soviets a great deal until they are either equal or superior to the Germans in every category except Heavy Tanks in the anti-tank role. The is a biggy.

The T-34/85s remain too expensive to use against Panthers and Tigers. (need mark target and/or ram)

Soviet late game tanks continues to be an issue as only the IS-2, while a great tank, is cost ineffective against German heavy armor.

I personally would like to see another buff to the T-34/85 just to make it cost effective against Panthers and Tigers.

That is probably the last major thing I'd like for the game. Everything else has been gravy outside of the 2 OP commanders.
17 Jan 2014, 13:36 PM
#89
avatar of Bravus

Posts: 503

Permanently Banned
What? Less cost for T34? Oh i will see 10 of then...

When i have 1 tinner PZ4 the Rus get 2 T34 and make suicide game to fk my PZ4... Plus comming with artillety etc...

And Get the 3°, 4° t34 fast to make again, because the rus spam infantry (1 shocks make fest) win the ger little inf, soo the strategy is suicide tanks and win by mass infantry spam...

With german you need make no mistakes, if you loose 1 squad early game you are in danger, for russians not, they loose tanks, etc... No problem!

Less cost for all! And make more real damages to all! Less armor infantry too! Better cover and pin!
17 Jan 2014, 13:47 PM
#90
avatar of Aradan

Posts: 992

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Jan 2014, 13:36 PMBravus
What? Less cost for T34? Oh i will see 10 of then...

With german you need make no mistakes, if you loose 1 squad early game you are in danger, for russians not, they loose tanks, etc... No problem!


No, you cannot make mistakes with soviet tanks. You dont have AT infantry, no smoke, no blitz. If you lose too many fuel, you lost game.
I am expert in losing games. :)
17 Jan 2014, 14:26 PM
#91
avatar of gokkel

Posts: 542

I have played this game since it first appeared. The Germans used to be completely OP in such an obvious way.

Since then, they have buffed the Soviets a great deal until they are either equal or superior to the Germans in every category except Heavy Tanks in the anti-tank role. The is a biggy.

The T-34/85s remain too expensive to use against Panthers and Tigers. (need mark target and/or ram)

Soviet late game tanks continues to be an issue as only the IS-2, while a great tank, is cost ineffective against German heavy armor.

I personally would like to see another buff to the T-34/85 just to make it cost effective against Panthers and Tigers.

That is probably the last major thing I'd like for the game. Everything else has been gravy outside of the 2 OP commanders.


So you say that Russians are now equal or sometimes even better in every way other than anti tank tanks (unless you actually use the abilities you have available, but I guess that is too much to demand), and now you want to take the according to your opinion last advantage Germans have. Sounds reasonable.
17 Jan 2014, 16:54 PM
#92
avatar of RoosterSamurai

Posts: 9

I have played this game since it first appeared. The Germans used to be completely OP in such an obvious way.

Since then, they have buffed the Soviets a great deal until they are either equal or superior to the Germans in every category except Heavy Tanks in the anti-tank role. The is a biggy.

The T-34/85s remain too expensive to use against Panthers and Tigers. (need mark target and/or ram)

Soviet late game tanks continues to be an issue as only the IS-2, while a great tank, is cost ineffective against German heavy armor.

I personally would like to see another buff to the T-34/85 just to make it cost effective against Panthers and Tigers.

That is probably the last major thing I'd like for the game. Everything else has been gravy outside of the 2 OP commanders.


Spoken like a true soviet-only player.
17 Jan 2014, 18:05 PM
#93
avatar of b-VDV

Posts: 17

Hi guys, i would you to watch this replay.
This is what i meet everygame (or Tiger Ace) when i play soviets since the last patch. . My opponents will blob and spam all the match. (MG spam/ Panzergren spam/panther spam)
Yes, i do some mistake, my teammate too, we are not Pros, but seriously it's always like this!!! This IS NOT FUN!

http://www.coh2.org/replays/13053/company-of-heroes-2-most-noobish-game-ever-spammersblobbe

17 Jan 2014, 18:47 PM
#94
avatar of coh2player

Posts: 1571

I actually have more games as German than Soviet, and I play both at a 60:40 split.

You must read between the lines. The 'heavy tank' problem the soviets have is bigger than say, the differences between mortars which is relatively marginal. Heavy Tanks are game-changing and #1. This cancels out a lot of German disadvantages.

The German relies a lot on flexible synergy, speed, and medium/heavy tanks and not raw unit strengths. German tanks have 3rd MGs, they outclass non-doc. soviet tanks typically. Defensive smoke and blitz is a huge advantage. They have panzershrecks, which is a big advantage if used well.

Panthers and P4s are the best and most cost effective vehicles in the game. Brumbars are also highly effective. The Panther is a tank destroyer with a turret and high speed. Brumbars annihilate infantry and zis guns.

Due to the T-34/85's weakness against tigers, panthers, and elefants, I have largely secluded my doctrinal use to IS-2 and ISU-152 doctrines for months.

I use Soviet Industry, Shock Rifle or Armored Assault, or either one of the 2 x ISU-152 doctrines.

I don't even use Guards Motor much because I don't have faith in the T-34/85 in pure anti-tank actions. They are solidly countered by panthers and tigers even with marked target and ram. The german tanks often have smoke, which frustrates things. The trade off is not worth it as it is not always possible to get 4 x T-34/85s onto the field. I still need to employ my pair of zis to even out the odds.

For German, I use Luftwaffe support, Elite Troops, and Jaeger Armor or mechanized (the one with the artillery gun).
17 Jan 2014, 18:58 PM
#95
avatar of link0

Posts: 337

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Jan 2014, 06:39 AMwongtp
tank vs infantry are not calculated, infact every shot is always a miss, its the AOE that gets infantry most of the time. so its very much based on chance, they could reduce scatter, and increase AOE to make things more consistent though.

i miss the vcoh tables where tanks gets calculated hits and shells will warp all over the place to get its targets.


No, actually there are calculated hits. It's around 5% depending on the gun and range. And of course, the AOE will probably kill a few others.
17 Jan 2014, 19:44 PM
#96
avatar of slother

Posts: 145

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Jan 2014, 18:05 PMb-VDV
Hi guys, i would you to watch this replay.
This is what i meet everygame (or Tiger Ace) when i play soviets since the last patch. . My opponents will blob and spam all the match. (MG spam/ Panzergren spam/panther spam)
Yes, i do some mistake, my teammate too, we are not Pros, but seriously it's always like this!!! This IS NOT FUN!

http://www.coh2.org/replays/13053/company-of-heroes-2-most-noobish-game-ever-spammersblobbe



So I watched that replay, It wasnt fun true but:

1. "MG spam" while they had 1 MG each...

2. They spammed pgrens later on (2-3 each), but your mate had 4 conscripts and later 3 shocks.

3. U called in 2 guards squads while there was absolutly na armor on the field, while u needed more Anti-infantry weapons.

4. They went t4 to get armor while u floated and didnt bother even teching. You just waited for t34-85/is2 and hoped for the best. No T3, no su85's, no katyusha. At 10min, 1100req, 300 fuel float, at 30min, 1400req , 400 fuel float.

5. They had 1 panther each, they build more the moment u started to spam t34-85 (You had 4 callins, 8 t34-85, at one moment u had 5 on the field)

I'm sorry but You played bad, you didnt adapt to the game at all.

Actually this only shows how good soviets are, even tho you made really big mistakes and bad choices. You both got carried by callins. Germans bothered to tech and get panthers, while you didnt even bother and just relayed on call in spam (8 t34-85, 2xkv8, is2)

They put an early pressure on You, U both floated and waited for callins. They did a right thing - they countered your strat.
17 Jan 2014, 21:07 PM
#97
avatar of 5thSSPzWiking

Posts: 135

Soviets are pretty much easy win mode right now. this is so ridiculous the sov whine girls trying to defend the current state of balance. 1cp elite infantry is so dumb. the only way ost has a chance is if the sov players make mistakes.
17 Jan 2014, 21:45 PM
#98
avatar of VonMecha

Posts: 419

you cant float 1400mp/400 fuel and expect to win if you are not already.
18 Jan 2014, 04:50 AM
#99
avatar of wongtp

Posts: 647

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Jan 2014, 18:58 PMlink0


No, actually there are calculated hits. It's around 5% depending on the gun and range. And of course, the AOE will probably kill a few others.


yes I know, but it isnt too far off to say that they arent calculated. I wouldnt put my chances on 5%. its quite obvious really, AT tanks have low AOE, AI tanks have huge AOE to make up for their misses, so that the AOE gets infantry.

in effect its all missed shots. which makes things difficult to make them consistent.

ytd I had a game, an ISU is firing at a mg42 for 6-7 shots before killing a man. in another instance, a blob of pgren comes strolling over, a single shot took 4 models away, 1 from 4 different squads. in another case, a gren squad capping, a single shell wiped the squad off the earth.

then i watched my mate's t34, all bark and no bite, stopped moving yet taking forever to kill a stationary mg42. it was probably about 4-5 shots before a model was killed off and forced a retreat. I think it was the hull mg that took it out instead.

im all for vcoh consistency, where i can count on sherman/p4 tanks as fire platforms to pick off infantry.
18 Jan 2014, 16:57 PM
#100
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637

Let's just say this;

In CoH1, two squads caught out in the open with no cover would mince eachother in a few seconds. This is what made strategic play and flanking rewarding.

Due to the durability of units(primarily infantry), that strategic play and flanking no longer even exists except where a set-up position is in play. My Grens can duke it out with Conscripts for unnaturally large periods of time. It bogs down gameplay, rewards nooby play and minimizes effort.


This is my biggest complaint. Cover often hurts. More so the Ost i think. Grens tend to velcro themselves to green cover and they fight you when you tell them to move. This makes dodging molos hard.

Look at what LMGs do to scripts. This is how both sides infantry in the open should fair.



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